Sunset announcement - E8/9

Sorry Erik. This is a  2-rail E8/9 anounnced on the 2-rail forum. I am not in 3-toyrail and do not read toyrail forum. Go figure! Stephen

PS: Love the DP web updates after all these months past. OH WAIT, There isn't any!!!!!!

I don't remember the N&W having any "E Units". Please elaborate. 

Thanks Erik! I did not know 90% of the 2-rail dicussiions was on the other forums.

Stephen

N&W accuired recieved the units from the Wabash in the merger. The E units ran on the Banner Blue, Blue Bird, etc. . The N&W also leased theRF&P E8 in the late 50's in the RF&P paint scheme with N&W lettering in silver.
Hope this helps.

Stephen

OK, thanks. Thus, "post steam era" for the leased units, and then the 1960s merger era for the Wabash units.

Here's one of the leased RF&P units:

Rusty

Rusty: GREAT PHOTO! I have the decals custom made for these units waiting for the RF&P units!

Stephen

Erik: I had sent Scott info on the N&W and Wabash units and other ideas to go with the E8s.

Thanks, No one has ever done the N&W E units before except for very limited HO brass models.

Stephen

Apart from paint schemes, was there really that much difference in any of the E8's (barring passenger vs freight pilots and the distinctive PRR train phone antennae)?

Seems like a paint job would be the fix. There are plenty of brass E8's floating around out there.

Simon

Hey guys. I wound up selling my E7 before I could do any minimum radius testing. I know they E8s are advertised as 48"r, but I'm wondering if 36"r would be possible? I really want an EL E8A so I can replicate EL Train #28 and #29 that ran between Cleveland and Youngstown Ohio. It used to run right behind my house. I don't want a shelf queen though. If I can get it down to 36"r I'm in. Do you think I would have to send the inboard axles to Joe F. to have cut the flanges off or will long shank couplers with coupler box mods allow 36"r operation?

My thinking is that since long shank couplers allow an SD50 to run on 36"r that it may work for the E8s since they are a bit shorter than an SD50 and both have 6 wheel trucks. Thoughts?

Thanks

36" radius?  Will the 3-rail versions do that?

There can be many small details.  With or without dynamic brakes (usually a large cooling fan at the center of the locomotive), with or without winterization hatches over the cooling fans, with or without a MARS light in the upper headlight location (with the headlights in the lower location on the door), with or without MU receptacles on the nose, grab iron placement, horn placement, type of horn, with or without air tanks on the roof (possibly only on the Southern) and at least on the Erie E8s, a third sand box filler on each side.  Yes, they all start out basically the same, but there can be many variations.  How important these variations become is up to each individual modeller.

Yeah - have these been done in the past with all these different variants?  I do not see quite the passion here that I see in that 3-rail scale thread, which is now four times longer than this thread, I think?

Editorial.  For a long time now I've felt it's way overdue to merge the 2RS and 3RS sub-forums back into one suitably named combined forum.  I always check both and I find a large number of the posts could be on either forum.  Why not?  Huh?

to borrow from the esteemed Bob2,

opinion: I surely want to avoid a combining of the 2R and 3RS groups. to my mind there are too many dissimilarities between the two disciplines.

I posted the Sunset E8 announcement because of a lot of 2-railers do not read 3-rail forum, myself included. I have nothing to do with 3-rail and no desire to or care if it sinks or swims. In the rest of the world 3-rail is a joke as it is predominantly 2-rail as the real world railroads. Maybe the post 3-rail is longer because there is more of them being a 3-rail mag. Combining the forums is the most rediculous thing I read. OGR has been gracious to host the 2-rail forum where my only interest lies. Stephen

I am interested. I only post if I feel I have something to add to the conversation. I intend to order a A unit. I've seen many pictures of NYC E7s consisted with E8s and that's the look I want to capture.

While I agree that the two forums should be kept separate, I am not visceral about it, and have a great deal of respect for the modeling skills that show up on 3RS.

I personally do not understand the desire to retain the center rail, but that is my problem, not theirs.  They are happy, and that is what counts.

What I was trying to point out is that they (3RSers) are kind of driving this idea that every single grab iron that is different from one railroad to the other needs to be faithfully reproduced in maybe ten variants and twenty paint schemes for these products.  We 2-railers have, at least in the past, been satisfied with one variant and no paint schemes.

Opinion.

That would be a disaster of biblical proportions.

Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!

Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes!

The dead rising from the grave!

Human sacrifice! Dogs and cats, living together! Mass hysteria!

we do not want to go there. it is idiotic.

Not to mention it's just a bad idea.

I don't think combining is a good idea either. Both will lose their identity and there are ideas and posts that only apply to one or the other. 

What I was trying to point out is that they (3RSers) are kind of driving this idea that every single grab iron that is different from one railroad to the other needs to be faithfully reproduced in maybe ten variants and twenty paint schemes for these products.  We 2-railers have, at least in the past, been satisfied with one variant and no paint schemes.

 

I've wanted correctly detailed models, but unless I bought brass I couldn't get it and sometime not even then. I think the 3RS guys are experiencing what the 2R guys have felt for years. Unless you build it, its tough to get a correctly detailed locomotive. The difference I see now is we can combine the requests of the 3RS and 2R guys which gives us a larger voice and maybe someone will be listening. 

Butch

Howdy,

I'm not a fan of the idea of merging the 2 different forums.

I checked out the other thread to see what was going on. I did count at least seven 2 railers in the mix on the 3 rail forum discussion for these models. It looks like Dave has the Southern info nailed down.

A few reasons come to mind:

• If it ain't broke, why fix it. 
• A lot of humans are creatures of habit, and we don't like it when our routines change. 
• We do not want to unleash a disaster of biblical proportions on the world at large as pointed out by MWB. 
• What would we have to rationally discuss on slow days? Heavens to Murgatroyd, we might actually have to build and photograph something. 

I don't even know why I'm reading this thread.  Neither NP or GN had either one of these beasts. 

Regards,

Jerry

Hey why not!  Give it a shot.  

Larry

Wait a minute...

Where am I?

How did I get here?

I must be lost, I'll just show myself out. 

Which way to the door?

Back off man, I'm a scientist!

Aside from the little roller thingies on the bottom and the wheel flanges, there really aren't that many other dissimilarities with our models.

Both sub-forums are about the trains and running reasonable accurate models of them.  We have many of the Sunset/3rd Rail/GGD offerings ONLY because of the combined interest in both the 2RS and 3RS communities.

I don't see the sub-forums being combined, but the approach to modeling (aside from one group being able to see past the 3rd rail) is pretty much the same.  A 2RS modeler who does not occasionally check the 3RS sub-forum is going to miss out on some interesting threads just like the 3RS who doesn't occasionally check this sub-forum.

Jim

jd-train: You are sooooooo wrong. A lot more differences than roller thingies and flanges and third rail. Swivel pilots, foobie paint schemes, cartoon models, toy details, oversized couplers, smoke in everything with wheels, wrong sound bites, and large models on sharp curved track and more. If 3-railers want scale, let them try 2-rail SCALE, and get rid of the overpriced joke of 3-rail as most of the world modeling community perceives. That is why 3-rail is called gauge and not SCALE. You can say there is 3-rail scale, but it will always be 3-rail!  Face it, the general modeling community from Z scale and up, 3-railers are a different bred. If you like 3-rail, then by all means enjoy. Stephen

nw2124,

 WOW! 3-rail perceived as an Overpriced Joke by most of the world modeling community? 3-railers considered a different breed by the general modeling community from Z-scale and up.... Really? I'd like to know were you got your facts. Let me just say this, I would put up forum member Rich Bautista's 3RS layout up against any 2-rail layout I've ever seen for realism any day of the week and twice on Sunday, and that ain't no Joke!

Joe

NW2124 - I don't share your perspective on 3RS guys and believe you've incorrectly lumped them with traditional 3 railers.  These guys fix/replace swinging pilots, install scale couplers, research the prototype, and don't embrace fantasy paint schemes. The "alliance" between 2 railers and 3RS's has served both communities in encouraging importers to offer moderately priced scale detailed models. Witness the Sunset horizontal drive diesels and passenger trains like AtlasO's California Zephyr and GGD's El Capitan.  The models may not be up to Key or Kohs levels but they strike a very attractive balance between detail and price while delivering excellent performance. Without moderately priced mass produced models we'd have far fewer O scale 2 rail converts.

Jvega2 - Just like nw1224 missed the mark in generalizing about 3RS's , you missed the mark about 2 railers.  There are fantastic 2 rail layouts out there - witness N&W Chris' and John Sethian's PRR - both 3 rail converts! 

My preference is for OGR to retain separate sub forums as it makes it a little easier to surf around for topics of interest. 

Ed Rappe

The facts are direct from large modeling groups here in the US and Europe which I have traveled, commuticate, and associate. Anything else I can inform or update? You really need to enlarge your inner circle

Stephen.