Thank You WBB for Trains that do LESS

I agree with simpler is nice sometimes.  I run my Lionel Legacy trains with a WOW and when a break is needed I dim the lights in the train room and put on my PW 2245 Lionel Texas Special F3, hearing the low rumbling growl of the motor pulling lighted silver 027 passenger cars behind.  It takes me back to where my love of trains all began.

Steve, Lady and Tex

I have a roster of four WbB engines (N&W EF-4, N&W FM Train Master, BL2 GM demonstrator, & C&O E7 ABA), that I keep specifically to run on our club modular layout. I spent less than $500 for the entire collection. Outstanding value.

No fuss, no muss. Drop them on the rails, throw the power to them and they just plain work. On one occasion, I had my E7 ABA (w/ powered B unit) pulling almost 50 cars continuously for more than 8 hours. The motors were barely warm when I finally took them off the layout.

Especially when running for the public, 95% of the folks can't tell the difference between a $200 and a $2000 locomotive. Why risk the good stuff when inexpensive, bullet-proof locomotives are available?

The one thing I have learned with new WbB engines to pull the motor and give the gears a good load of grease before running.

Gilly

I've been out of the hobby for basically the whole era of TMCC/Legacy/DCS, and just come back to it recently.

I picked up a WBB NW-2 and really dig it! Needs a little work for better low speed performance but other than that it's great.

I work in web development for a living so the thought of coming home and "debugging" a model train layout is... less than compelling. Although I'm sure I'll eventually take the plunge, it's nice to know I can "KISS" vis-a-vis my WBB NW-2 whenever needed/desired.

I have a BL-2 WBB as well and its always a good runner. Are their steam locos as nice? I may consider one in the future.

I understand what you mean and more power (and run time) to you.  However, I have grown to where I miss the chuffing or diesel sounds WBB and RMT locos don't have.  I have put Railroads in several steam loco tenders however and run them, and one WBB Trainmaster that I added sound to.  On the other hand, since I run only conventionally, I have no problems or issues with DCS and Legacy locos: in fact recent (last two years of so) Legacy locos in particular out-conventional most conventional locos by which I mean the actually run in that mode as nicely or more linearly and slowly than purely non-Legacy locos, and I prefer them now.  

Hello guys and gals........

I have a simple Williams Geep which I know will run ANYTIME and not have to deal with the MTH or lionel fully electronic problems causing stress and takes away the fun of the hobby. Williams fill the bill nicely, just put it on the track and run it, its more relaxing that way.

the woman who loves the S.F.5011,2678

Tiffany

Truth!

Pete

Mr. Johnson: Your post's title cracked me up, for I knew exactly what the subject would be about...but it means your slogan should be, "If it ain't broke, it's not electronic".

wbb and I have several run great and as much as I enjoy DCS and TMCC its  pleasant change of pace to operate conventionally.

Gilly you are so right (best value in O-Gauge

Lee - You obviously don't fit the demographic of the intended WBB customer.  Sometimes it's best to not say anything.

Pete

Shouldn't that be everyone's slogan?  In a way?

Pete

I think Lee has a good point - I'm sure once I take the plunge I'll feel similarly about having all the cool sounds and great (by all reports) low speed operation.

But, as an "outsider" / newbie who is faced with choosing between DCS and TMCC/Legacy, it's all quite daunting. To really get the most out of either system requires a nontrivial investment of money, time and effort and the decision to stick with one path (or else invest in both systems, thereby doubling the money, time and effort most likely...)

It's quite a constrast with the simple and cheap joy of running a WBB in conventional.

That's not really a demographic thing so much as a quality of life thing.

I also work in the IT field, and the last thing I want to do when I come home to run trains is deal w/ more electronic problems.  That's why I run pretty much all postwar w/ a bit of MPC.  I know my ZW, RW & KW will always work & aside from some oil & grease every so often, I can pull any engine off a shelf & know it will work.  

As much as I love the sounds, I have found that when I have 3 trains running, the sounds all kind of jumble together.  I usually shut off the railsounds & just go w/ a horn/bell 

I find the sounds are really fun for about 5 minutes, then I want to turn them off or way down. I have many Williams or Williams WBB diesels and electrics and they are a pleasure to run. They pull well, run cool, draw few amps and are just very easy to live with. I haven't bought any of the steamers because I do enjoy lots of smoke. So I have 2 MTH locos (one conventional, one PS1), several postwar locos that smoke well, and a K-Line Allegheny that is wonderful in all respects except for the anemic smoke unit.

If I'm in the mood to just watch the trains go around and around, Williams motive power is my first choice.   

I love my WBB engines. I have several engines now and planning on buying more in the near future.  

I actually bought some of my WBB engines at such a great price that I intend to upgrade them to dcs for slow speed and sound.  One in particular will be canibalized for a mongrel hybrid that I am toying with.

In the meantime they are solid performers.

"Thank you, Williams engine, for always coming to life, and moving down the track when I push the throttle..."

Same here.  I'm retired now, but I spent 25 years in the IT arena, and I don't want any more complex electronics.  I've been all-Lionel up to now, but I just bought a Williams AA pair of Baldwin sharks, and I couldn't be happier with them.  On the advice of several posters on this forum, I rewired the motors to series, and now they run even better at slow speeds.

like others have said, after running the trains with all their sounds for 5-10 minutes I like to shut off the sounds, turn my son loose to run the trains, I sit in a rocking chair with a nice scotch,  converse with my son ,we like to listen to the "noise" of just the trains running around on the layout. Great therapy for relaxation and stress reduction, before Joey has to go to bed. Then I do a little paperwork talk to the wife and hit the sack!!!!!

PRICELESS!!!!!!

I have taken my Blood pressure before and after running the trains and it always registers lower!!

This is the cheapest BP medicine with no medical sideeffects!!!!

I have several Williams engines that run flawlessly and only need some occasional maintenance. The SD-45's are great for hauling freight cars, if one powered unit won't do it then add one more.

I have not had any Williams engine break down on me. 

I even put some Williams True Blast 2 units in some other engines I have because the horn was weak.

Lee Fritz

They have semi-scale and scale steamers. The semi-scale stuff are basically repros of 50s Lionel engines. They have some earlier brass scale steamers such as the N&W 611 that are nice. Currently they have a scale Hudson. If the road name(s) suit you, it's worth a look.

HUDSON

The link I gave you is showing list prices. I'm condifent you can do much better with OGR Sponsor distributors.

Gilly

I second the "thank you"!

I have a WBB ten wheeler, that gets far more run time than my command control engines. The fast start issue was cured with three sets of diodes - turned it into a smooth creeper if desired. And I don't have to worry about breaking something when I pick it up.

Truly a unique engine with unique qualities.

sounds like my nights, except I replace the scotch w/ a cold beer

It is all about having choices. When it comes to simple conventional engines Williams is certainly or at least probably the best value on the market bare none.

I can run anything conventional but nothing runs like a real conventional engine.

However Lionel has out out some very nice conventional engines too.

To me conventional means track sound and smoke that's it.

Which is precisely what made PW trains legendary ...to this very day. 

(As I started posting many years ago): "This issue is not that your stuff doesn't work or has failed importer, the issue is what are you going to do about it & who is going to pay for it!

Funny stuff!!!!  I stopped buying new MTH locos when they no longer made the 'Loco-sound' non-command control units.  But I do like buying brain dead 'fancy' locos and putting a WbB DCU in them.

Those are my thoughts as well. When I have four tracks going and rumbling, I find that my Williams loco with True Blast combined with the PW Whistle Shack and operating railroad crossing bell is more than enough sound.

Tiffany,

You should be in the marketing department at WBB!  Couldn't be said more succinctly than as you worded it.  I cringe every time I hear someone opine that WBB should pursue Legacy, DCS, or some whiz-bang electronics for their products.  A good, dependable, solid, quality conventional running loco with good, dependable, solid, quality basic sounds accessible from a conventional throttle...(sigh)...the 'comfort zone' of the hobby. 

Of course, that's just an humble opinion.

Good job!

KD

Good point Dave.  I hold out hope that MTH will consider keeping a "Loco-sound" engine in the fleet.

I purchased an older 'prototype' model from Perry's Toy Exchange, and thoroughly enjoy it...even if it's 'chuff' is far from the best fidelity...it's a reliable runner.

When I was going through service issues with my first modern MTH steam purchase, I ran my WBB Ten Wheeler & Berkshire to ease the pain.  I've got two WBB diesel sets as well, and they remind me the most of the MPC era engines of my youth...really dig those as well.

 Williams by Bachman!

Robert

Hello guys and gals.........

When my 3rd Sunset S.F. 5011's electronics goes kaput as I am expecting it since the engine was made in 2002, I will just put in a Williams reversing unit in the engine and turn it into a Williams/3rd Sunset or WS3RD.   I think the KEY here is the Williams's tough reversing unit which makes all Williams locomotives run, run and run forever!  Is there such a thing as a "self contained" chuff, whistle and bell sounds package nothing else just those 3 sounds that I can put in the tender without the tether to the engine as I just installed a pair of roller pick-ups on my Sunset 3rd tender.  I am trying to do without the stupid tether !!!!.  I would like for the engine to run by itself like the Williams and postwar lionel steamers do. Can something like that be done?

the woman who loves the S.F.5011,2678

Tiffany

I have a few diesels and will be getting a few more.  So far I have found decent selection and prices at Pats, Trainworld, and Wholesale trains.  Are there any other places I'm missing for reasonable pricing on these?  I try to buy at my LHS but they never carry WBB and sometimes hobby shops seem to pretend that $100-$200 locomotives don't even exist.  

Another ex-IT person that runs conventional.......I see a pattern. I was, and all us IT'ers were, high tech before high tech was 'IN'. I've had my fill.

I worked on a unified Demand Deposit system, the first ATM's, Credit Card automated fraud detection system, the POS machines(where you swipe your card at the WM) a lot of things that were cutting edge.....I like my trains simple!

Hi there. I just bought the WBB Lakehore Limited Ready to Run set.

I hope it runs as nice as you all say it should.

How many times a year do we hear comments like in this thread, singing the praise of WBB engines with their conventional operation, pulling power, reliability and great price?   Sounds to me like the other manufacturers could take a lesson here.  I hope they are listening.   There IS a huge market for conventional without all the expensive extras.

(the zoom-zoom die-cast steam is just hopeless; the 4-6-0, though, is a mechanical jewel) 

I don't especially like the "old-timey" styling of the 4-6-0.  Every day I log in here hoping to read that Williams has redesigned its "Golden Memories" steam locos to have a two-piece chassis and slow-speed operation like the 4-6-0.  If they do I would buy one, or maybe several!

In the meantime, locos from Lionel and MTH also run on can motors.  It's very easy to simplify them by removing the electronics, and they are geared lower than Williams which contributes to better operation.  You can avoid the whole Forward/ Neutral/ Reverse thing by running on DC from a G-scale, or heavy-duty HO power pack.

I do commend Williams for pricing their trains close to cost.  I would like to see the other brands follow suit, with longer production runs and greater parts availability for mods and scratch-building.  My $.02.

This is absolutely correct! I've been thinking about transitioning from conventional to either DCS or Legacy and mulling over the differences between the two systems and the overall benefits of the modern electronics. I like the idea of the sounds of the engine but agree that once you have 2 or more trains running at the same time the benefit of that feature becomes negligible. That leaves walking around the layout with your train and slow speed operation as the next big attractions. Well, my layout isn't that big (25' x 18'). Do I really need to walk around? I don't think so. I like to sit back on my high stool and just...watch, but if I do want some kind of remote, MTH has one that connects to a Z4000. So slow speed operation...is that such a big deal? My WBB U33C is the smoothest running engine I have. It goes plenty slow even without the internal wiring modification but no AC powered engine that I've seen, regardless whether it's a DCS or Legacy, runs as slowly or as smoothly as anything that ran on my old N scale DC layout. And to my grandchildren, slow speed = b o r i n g.

So yes, I'm conventional and proud or it, love my WBB equipment, the reliability, the prices ($99 for the U33C!) and will continue to buy more from them.  KISS is the name of the game for me.

Yup, fastest way I know of to clear the train room when friends and family are over. Lots of great posts in this thread on why we enjoy the hobby. Plus some hidden gems on easy mods to make our conventionals run better at slow speed.

Houston Tinplate runs W/WBB engines for HOURS.  Only thing we have to do is to oil/lube every so many hours.  

I have had only one W/WBB "Failure".  A wire pulled out of the lead to the pick up roller.  Simple repair.  The loco is good to go.

W/WBB weakness is light bulbs.  Because to the units "light" energy draw, they can be dim.  Went to Ace Electronics over on Antione and 34th, and got some 24V BA9 white LEDS.  The light gives the "wow" fator, and the are bright enough at W/WBB voltages.

BTW, some modern power has light wholes in the rear which are so small it is not worth changing over:  SD90's, EF4's, U33c's.  In these cases, I took the old bulb out an did not replace. 

I'm a little fuzzy on the LED thing. Is this a direct replacement bulb? Wouldn't I still need a resistor and a bridge rectifier (like Dale H's circuit)?