THE Word **RARE**

In a commercial world, almost nothing mass-produced is truly "rare".   The older postwar products might be called "rare", but are not.  This because toy trains were played with and many tossed out years ago- leaving fewer of them available today.  BUT- we are in a hobby of shrinking demand.

Some exceptions are obviously those that were "mistakes" - with faulty stamping etc. - those are rare, but also have a very small market.

I actually saw a Lionel 2026 locomotive featured as "rare" and "vintage" on the Bay- when they were Lionel's low price line of O27 engines in their day- thousands were sold by every outlet including the chains.   Another 2026 listed as : "WOW!!!" and "1952-53 ONLY!!!" on e-Bay posts.  

Supply and demand is about all that counts.  The supply is affected by how many were originally made (O27 more than O Gauge or Standard Gauge), and how many were played with to oblivion and/or were discarded.  

The demand is affected by the age group that drove "train collecting" in the 1980's- 90s, but is shrinking due to having all that will fit in their space, or the (about) 1-2% of 70- 75 year olds who pass away each year.  As well, an unknown number move to a place with no room for trains at all.  

Plus, today, demand is softened because a lot of what is being released as "new" are really updates using new technology under the hood.  But the shells might be made from  older tooling.  This means you can buy a new one, with better running and modern features- in quantity.  Yes you might have to pre-order, or buy online since your LHS cannot carry $ 500- $2000 items that don't move (if the LHS even exists).  

The bottom line- do trains for fun- and not so much for profit.  Be happy if you can partially pay for your fun by selling off unused pieces.  Sell those off to good home for whatever you can get, and be happy when someone else is happy.

The only thing rare for me is $20.00 bills.

Dave

Before the internet, for Johnny come lately, l drove to distant shows and finally found an ...uh, "uncommon" item.  Then l got on internet, and, surprise!, they were not uncommon.  And l glommed a couple more.  And ignore all the rest offered. "Rare" if you want it and can't find it, or then can't or won't spend the price.

Tom Williams posted:

M5 LIONEL 6-19925 LEARNING CENTER BOXCAR NEW IN BOX ~ …

https://picclick.com/M5-LIONEL-6-19925-LEARNING...

M5 LIONEL 6-19925 LEARNING CENTER BOXCAR NEW IN BOX ~ Rare Find MADE IN USA!!! - $22.95. Special addition Lionel New in box...1990's If you know your trains, this is an excellent buy!They will be shipped in another Lionel box that is heavy.. thus the shipping price. Boxes may have "shelf wear on outside" see pic for typical wear.. Will combine shipping if interested in several.

Remember this one?

Ultra rare in Greenburgs Book.

Lionel cleared out their US warehouse and now you can buy one for $5.00

 

I think there is a distinction there (not that I am sure most care about it).

Before the house cleaning at Lionel, any of these that were out in the wild had an actual specific engraving for what the car was awarded for. 

All the ones released during the house cleaning have no engraving on the metal plate, I believe.

I don't actually have one of these (any flavor), but seem to recall noticing that when they starter sprouting up everywhere.

-Dave

bob2 posted:

Isn't it just "puffing?"  Aren't we supposed to ignore puffery, and buy what we want?  "Recommended by doctors", " only driven by a little old lady from Pasadena" etc.?

Skipping an ad because of a meaningless word that you don't like might someday cost you a real deal.

And don’t forget my favorite, “As seen on TV!”

Hey..."as seen on TV" was impressive, in 1950('s?) while we kids crowded around my friend's black and white, blocks away..nowadays...uh, no.

Don't want my toy trains rare - I want them well done! 

Is it RARE or REAR?

I have seen both terms on Ebay.

If it's RARE, I find I already have it.  If it's REAR, I don't even want it.

John Rowlen posted:

Is it RARE or REAR?

I have seen both terms on Ebay.

If it's RARE, I find I already have it.  If it's REAR, I don't even want it.

I like the rear ones.

I can tolerate seeing the words “Rare & Scarce”, but am educated enough to know the difference.  The one that really gets me is “MINT”, and showing multiple photos of the item.  The second you removed the item from the box, MINT goes out the window.  You just changed it to Brand New, unused.  I’m still trying to find the true definition of “Minty”, what’s that??

I can accept a photo of an item and not be concerned that the act of taking the photo made it no longer "mint".

I'm much more worried about something that truly is "mint in box" actually being "unknown in box" and finding is has some major flaw when I open it.

-Dave

I think RARE is an acronym for Respectably Ancient, Really Expensive...but I could be wrong....

phrankenstign posted:

"Rare" and "Scarce" items don't necessarily command high prices, even if they are correctly described. 

Back in 1974 Lionel brought out a new track called Tru Track.  It was aluminum (magnetraction wouldn't work) and you had to use it in the sizes available because of the way the center rail provided electrical continuity.  I bought it from Glen Uhl (Akron) at the local TCA meet for 25c a section; enough to make a decent loop.  Never tried to set it up.  It is truly rare.  There are zero hits for this on eBay.  It is useless but it is a great conversation piece when discussing these adjectives.  I really don't think I could give it away.  

Lou N

Lou N posted:

Back in 1974 Lionel brought out a new track called Tru Track.  It was aluminum (magnetraction wouldn't work) and you had to use it in the sizes available because of the way the center rail provided electrical continuity.  I bought it from Glen Uhl (Akron) at the local TCA meet for 25c a section; enough to make a decent loop.  Never tried to set it up.  It is truly rare.  There are zero hits for this on eBay.  It is useless but it is a great conversation piece when discussing these adjectives.  I really don't think I could give it away.  

Lou N

Wasn't there some molded rubber roadbed that was made to go with that?

I'm thinking my dad may have had some blister packs of this, but I might be confusing Tru Track with some other product.  (also, might not have been a blister pack, but more of like a shrink/saran wrap sort of thing.  It was mounted to a card for hanging up on a store rack)

-Dave

"rare" - in a word, OVERUSED.

Dave45681 posted:

Lou N posted:

Back in 1974 Lionel brought out a new track called Tru Track.  It was aluminum (magnetraction wouldn't work) and you had to use it in the sizes available because of the way the center rail provided electrical continuity.  I bought it from Glen Uhl (Akron) at the local TCA meet for 25c a section; enough to make a decent loop.  Never tried to set it up.  It is truly rare.  There are zero hits for this on eBay.  It is useless but it is a great conversation piece when discussing these adjectives.  I really don't think I could give it away.  

Lou N

Wasn't there some molded rubber roadbed that was made to go with that?

I'm thinking my dad may have had some blister packs of this, but I might be confusing Tru Track with some other product.  (also, might not have been a blister pack, but more of like a shrink/saran wrap sort of thing.  It was mounted to a card for hanging up on a store rack)

-Dave

Yes but it was rigid plastic. And yes it was in blister packs for hanging up. I never opened mine. 

LouN

Rare is a good word.  So is "Caveat Emptor!"  (Disclaimer: I learned all my Latin from The Brady Bunch )

I'll admit that "RARE" often makes me look. I am always interested in learning something new, and maybe it actually is rare, or at least not common. Costs nothing to look. I enjoy seeing trains; getting piqued by seeing certain words, not so much.

As for MINT... TCA standards grade trains and boxes separately, so a train removed from the box can most certainly be Mint, as long as it remains unused and unblemished. The box is probably not Mint anymore, though, since it is hard to open one without introducing a tiny crease somewhere. I guess if you want to be precise, listings with photos should say "Mint with original box," rather than "Mint in original box," but it's not that big a deal, IMO.

nickaix posted:

..........

As for MINT... TCA standards grade trains and boxes separately, so a train removed from the box can most certainly be Mint, as long as it remains unused and unblemished. The box is probably not Mint anymore, though, since it is hard to open one without introducing a tiny crease somewhere. I guess if you want to be precise, listings with photos should say "Mint with original box," rather than "Mint in original box," but it's not that big a deal, IMO.

While we are on that subject, TCA Standards actually went away from the Mint-New-Like New-Excellent-Good-Fair-Poor system quite a while ago, but many people still use it (TCA members or not). 

While the new numbering (1-10 with definitions for each) system was a good idea, there is probably not a snowball's chance in Hades of ever getting anyone outside of the TCA to start using it.  So I am sure we will still be seeing 99% of trains listed as Mint for quite a while.  (whether they are or not is a whole other discussion, as has been documented above by many).

-Dave

Lou N posted:

Yes but it was rigid plastic. And yes it was in blister packs for hanging up. I never opened mine. 

LouN

Thanks for confirming that my memory was at least partially right.

-Dave

Just got another classic: "I don't know anything about trains, but I know these are worth a lot of money" and one I just got as a reply to a craigslist inquiry "I don't know anything about trains but I took these to a trained expert who told me they're worth minimum $500" when he has about $100 worth of rusted and corroded postwar.  I just called it a day, lol

"No lowballers I know what I got." This is a recurring joke on many of the automotive sites. Folks scour CraigsList for these adverts and post the most ludicrous ones. Generally the vehicles are in poor condition and carry the refrain "Ran when parked." In the case of eBay it's often "I have no way to test, but I know it's in perfect condition."

Rick

Rick posted:

"No lowballers I know what I got." This is a recurring joke on many of the automotive sites. Folks scour CraigsList for these adverts and post the most ludicrous ones. Generally the vehicles are in poor condition and carry the refrain "Ran when parked." In the case of eBay it's often "I have no way to test, but I know it's in perfect condition."

Rick

That one about testing gets me every time. Especially the “engine is tested, and runs great! Didn’t test the horn though as I don’t have a battery/way to test/not sure/etc”...

BS. You know it doesn’t work. Just say it. lol