Was this a TMCC issue and if so, how to fix?

Many times it means the engine is not getting strong enough signal. Might be something over the layout masking the signal like a steel bridge or just poor antenna in the engine. On the Mikado jr it may mean the handrail is shorted to the shell. On the RK it depends where the R2LC is, tender or engine. Try removing the engine shell on the Mikado jr and see if that helps. Also the shell on the RK that covers the receiver board.

Pete

If the engines only run away after you crack the throttle, that typically means they're speed control equipped and there's a problem with feedback or configuration.

How about exact product numbers?

If these engines have ERR Cruise, try reconfiguration of the cruise.  Occasionally, the ERR cruise loses it's configuration and that results in full speed launches.  If they have Lionel Odyssey, first thing to check is the magnet ring on the flywheel.

Assuming the Mikado Jr is from early 2000s and stock, it has non cruise DCDR. No magnets.

Pete

Right Pete, but it may have been upgraded with ERR cruise, I've had more than one come in for that simple upgrade.  The symptom of only running away after cracking the throttle suggests to me a cruise module malfunction, that's why I mentioned it.  Truthfully, it's very rare for a locomotive with a plain DCDR to exhibit runaway only after throttle application, a shorted triac causes an immediate runaway as soon as you apply power.

Over the years I've seen only one locomotive with a DCDR that exhibited a runaway after throttle application, it turned out to be a bad R2LC.

@Norton posted:

Many times it means the engine is not getting strong enough signal. Might be something over the layout masking the signal like a steel bridge or just poor antenna in the engine. On the Mikado jr it may mean the handrail is shorted to the shell. On the RK it depends where the R2LC is, tender or engine. Try removing the engine shell on the Mikado jr and see if that helps. Also the shell on the RK that covers the receiver board.

Pete

Pete,

Shouldn't the headlight be flickering if any of these are the case?  Or maybe you're saying that the signal is so bad that it's not being received by the locomotive at all, hence no flickering?

Mike

If it gets no signal, the headlight flickers a couple of seconds and then comes on solid when it shifts to conventional.  That's also when sudden acceleration takes place.

However, the symptoms are that TMCC functions work, horn, lights, etc.  It's only when throttle is applied they take off.  This is classic cruise control malfunction.

@Ward H posted:

In all cases the locos started up normal in TMCC mode.  I addressed the locos, sounded the horns and bells. It was only when I started them moving did I have the issue of one of the locos speed going crazy.

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Pete,

Shouldn't the headlight be flickering if any of these are the case?  Or maybe you're saying that the signal is so bad that it's not being received by the locomotive at all, hence no flickering?

Mike

Usually on take off you shut it right down. I doubt anyone ever notices what the headlight is doing.

Pete

@Norton posted:

Usually on take off you shut it right down. I doubt anyone ever notices what the headlight is doing.

The headlight normally goes off as the engine heads for the floor!

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

If the engines only run away after you crack the throttle, that typically means they're speed control equipped and there's a problem with feedback or configuration.

How about exact product numbers?

If these engines have ERR Cruise, try reconfiguration of the cruise.  Occasionally, the ERR cruise loses it's configuration and that results in full speed launches.  If they have Lionel Odyssey, first thing to check is the magnet ring on the flywheel.

John,

Just for my future knowledge how do you reconfigure ERR Cruise?

Robert

@R Whitley posted:

John,

Just for my future knowledge how do you reconfigure ERR Cruise?

Robert

Being ERR Cruise requires correctly formatted serial data commands from the R2LC/R4LC receiver and it's configuration, along with the cruise module itself having a microprocessor and thus resulting settings- you have to follow BOTH.

Understanding R2LC/R4LC types and feature codes. Type is the labeled type and thus firmware. Example C08 VS C07. Then feature codes is a setting you set over TMCC when programming the ID.

See the attached InstructionstoRestoreTMCCfunctions.pdf Suggest printing that out and placing near your layout.

Then the ERR Cruise manual http://www.3rdrail.com/err-3rd.../CruiseCmdr-Inst.pdf

Quote right from the manual:

"Why is it necessary to set the Feature Code?
The Cruise Commander uses the serial data from the R4LC receiver to detect the throttle
settings. This serial data signal is dependent on the feature code. If this is not properly set,
the loco will not respond to throttle commands and may even enter into conventional mode
and rocket down the rails! Additionally, features like the smoke unit will not operate until
the feature code is set. It is always a good idea to know your loco feature codes for proper operation of smoke/strobe/cab/marker lighting effects. This is true of your entire TMCC loco stable."

Then page 6 of the manual goes on to describe further advanced settings specific to ERR Cruise beyond the basic "type" settings.

Additional Settings/Options for the R4LC
Speed Step Selection
Motor Type Selection
Cruise On/OFF Selection
“Nudge Mode” Operation

Here are the details of the locos involved.

MTH RK 30-1133-1 NYC Commodore Vanderbilt with Proto Sounds by QSI. Upgraded to TAS EOB with TMCC and Lionel RS4.

The CV was powered and standing at idle.

MTH RK 30-1123-1 NYC 0-8-0 Switcher with Proto Sounds by QSI. Upgraded to TAS EOB with TMCC and Lionel RS4. Currently working on upgrade to ERR Cruise Commander, ERR Railsounds, GRJs Super-Chuffer and Chuff-Generator.

The 0-8-0 switcher was running on rollers as it previously started slow as expected but took off full speed. Now running on rollers it behaved itself and ran nicely.

Lionel 6-38609 NYC Mikado JR with TMCC and RS5. Upgraded to ERR Cruise Commander M.  The Mikado Jr has run perfectly (knock on wood) on this layout for 2-3 hours.  

In this instance it started at a fast speed instead of a nice slow speed as usual.  Today I tried it again and it behaved itself and ran well.  I actually had the 0-8-0 switcher running on rollers and the CV and Mike Jr running slowly on the oval.

Thanks for the suggestions,

Ward

Well, the TAS one taking off is typically a tach reader issue, many times a wire breaks right at the tach reader base, or the tach reader comes loose from it's mount.

My experience with ERR cruise is occasionally they'll lose their programming, typically after a derailment.  Reprogramming them usually gets them up and running again.