What would you pay for a set of Black Santa Fe Aluminum cars?

@Railrunnin posted:

So funny.

To me this K-Line BlackBonnet Passenger set is one of the most beautiful consists ever made. Always a favorite of visitors as well. The matching ABA pulling these 8 cars is visually stunning.

The BlackBonnet freight cars came in four road numbers each for a total of 16 cars (hoppers, tank, box, gon) plus a matching caboose. Go ahead - try and find that caboose for a reasonable price. Once again quite the impressive consist when paired with the matching ABA.

Others may not like them, but I think both sets are outstanding.

Paul

I agree that the color scheme is fantastic - it just makes me sorry that I didn't buy more of those freight cars.

Weren't they K-line by Lionel brand?

i have the whole freight set with ABA and caboose ! i lucked out

I wouldn't pay it, but 6 cars sold yesterday on Ebay for $3800.

Sorry I am new here, didn't realize this was page 2.  Really embarrassed!

Wow, that is easily one of, if not the highest prices I've ever seen for something by K-Line. I actually want to get the Lionel version of the Black Bonnets at some point, so these cars are definitely something I like in general. Like some others have said, I wouldn't pay more than a $100 per car. Usually with any 15" aluminum passenger cars, I usually try not to pay more than $50 per car, but if they are harder to find, I'd be willing to put out a little more money.

@gmorlitz posted:

So c.sam, what's your set worth to you?

Gerry

Oh, I don't have any of the Blackbonnet Santa Fe pieces. Think they are attractive but have never owned any. Can't see paying that much for 'collector value' either when there have been a few custom runs recently (Pat's Trains comes to mind) of engines and cars that probably look better than the original K-Lines...

Does anyone out there have a couple of sets of F3's and the MTH PA's they could post some photos of?

Make sure to buy the 46-wheel articulated that goes with it. 

@Sean007 posted:

I agree that the color scheme is fantastic - it just makes me sorry that I didn't buy more of those freight cars.

Weren't they K-line by Lionel brand?

Hi Sean. The original BlackBonnets were put out by K-Line well before any "K-Line by Lionel" offerings. On the freight side, I believe the tank cars and the caboose are the harder cars to find but they do come up for sale fairly often.

The price for those passenger car seems to be a good example of two people who "had to have" an item finding each other on an auction site.

Paul

I agree with Paul. All it takes is 2 buyers with the same "Joe McDoakes" mindset (and the money to back it up) and this is what happens. This  happened a few yrs ago on a smaller scale with a set of K-Line 18-inch aluminum NYC cars on the same site. I really wanted them, but set a limit on what I would pay. When the bidding exceeded my limit, I walked away and I'm glad I did, because I found the same cars for sale here a few months later for less than half the hammer price of the auction in which I was bidding. Sometimes it pays to have a little patience, but that isn't always easy.

Just purchased black bonnet MTH SD70Ace from Pats Trains. I love it.

I am really into Santa Fe Black Bonnet everything, just ask Pat at Patrick's Trains; but even I would not pay nearly what the six passenger cars went for.  That being said, I would go $200/car because the K-Line Santa Fe Black Bonnet passenger cars are so well done as was the matching K-Line ABA.

Great looking engine and consist, Dave.  I wonder who sparked your interest in Santa Fe Black Bonnet trains . . . was it my MTH RailKing 30-20583-1 Santa Fe Black Bonnet MPDC15 Diesel Engine released in early 2019?  That engine is one of my favorites; but sadly and uncharacteristically, I did not order more freight cars to go with it.

Janet Mattern (TCA, LCCA, P&P, and GCMR member)

@Dave Benton posted:

Just purchased black bonnet MTH SD70Ace from Pats Trains. I love it.

here is mine from Pat's Trains

The set though fantasy, is good looking - Enjoy.

The prices these ebay folks paid are simply mind boggling to say the least.   I can't believe this set is anywhere near the price he paid for it.   

Must be nice to have that much cash to simply throw around without thinking it through.   Maybe there is something more to this story we don't know about.

Was this set previously owned by some celebrity or was it a prototype?

All it will take is for Williams to offer their own Black Warbonet set and that will wipe out most of the 'Midnight Chief' bubble.

@Allegheny posted:

The set though fantasy, is good looking - Enjoy.

The prices these ebay folks paid are simply mind boggling to say the least.   I can't believe this set is anywhere near the price he paid for it.   

Must be nice to have that much cash to simply through around without thinking it through.   Maybe there is something more to this story we don't know about.

Was this set previously owned by some celebrity or was it a prototype?

No. As Trainrunnin and BlueComet400 stated in their posts above, that ridiculously inflated price appears to be the result of 2 hapless buyers who found their “just gotta have it” set on the same auction site. So, they duked it out with the bidding until one of them ended up paying $3,800 for it.

So, with “whimsy” and “to each his own” aside, it’s still an absurd price to pay for what it is.

@Yellowstone Special posted:

No. As Trainrunnin and BlueComet400 stated in their posts above, that ridiculously inflated price appears to be the result of 2 hapless buyers who found their “just gotta have it” set on the same auction site. So, they duked it out with the bidding until one of them ended up paying $3,800 for it.

So, with “whimsy” and “to each his own” aside, it’s still an absurd price to pay for what it is.

Crazy things are happening these days.   It seems Covid has also impacted folks ability to think clearly.

https://ogrforum.com/...3#160504835009891363

Yes Janet, I wonder who.  See you Thursday at Paradise and Pacific RR Club.

@Dave Benton posted:

Just purchased black bonnet MTH SD70Ace from Pats Trains. I love it.

Really great looking models Dave.

Maybe just fantasy and maybe the people on the auction paid an absurd amount ................but it's what we do.

I couldn't even begin to find the funds for the auction site purchase even though I indulge in my own fantasy modeling.              I look at what a single steamer costs and compare it to something that is needed by the CEO here for her ( our ) household...........and well...............it does seem a little absurd even with my budget.               I'm an extremely LUCKY GUY to have  such an understanding and loving CEO.

@Dallas Joseph posted:

Maybe just fantasy and maybe the people on the auction paid an absurd amount ................but it's what we do.

C’mon now, Dallas. “It’s what we do? 🤔 How about, “It’s what some do? Because I, along with quite a few others here, don’t do that.

@c.sam posted:

Anyone see the crazy escalating auction on a popular auction site this week for a 6 car set of K-Line Santa Fe 'Blackbonnet' aluminum cars?  Started at $1,199 and is now (Friday) at $2550 with 4 bidders. Is this a shill bidding war?  I don't know - what do you guys think? A couple of them have reasonably high numbers (706 & 729) with another at 2241.  If legit, it will be interesting to see what these finish at. 6 days to go...

Wonder what a baggage car will bring? Was one made for this set?

55 Million to fly in space.  Money has a different value depending how much you have.   The buyer will be the satisfied customer if he believes it is worth it to him.

in my business an item cost 20,000.  I tell them 1 million.  They fall on the floor.  When they get up I tell them, “yes expensive, but I only need to sell 1”.  

I think this thread has reached an end...🤨... time to put it to bed.

Mark in Oregon

@Yellowstone Special posted:

C’mon now, Dallas. “It’s what we do? 🤔 How about, “It’s what some do? Because I, along with quite a few others here, don’t do that.

Sorry Vern.             The fantasy thing and hundreds of dollars would only apply to SOME. 

@BigAl56 posted:

All it will take is for Williams to offer their own Black Warbonet set and that will wipe out most of the 'Midnight Chief' bubble.

Yeah, right. Williams makes great stuff but an entirely different level of detail.

Gerry

@Strummer posted:

I think this thread has reached an end...🤨... time to put it to bed.

Mark in Oregon

Ah, a new moderator.

Gerry

@Strummer posted:

I think this thread has reached an end...🤨... time to put it to bed.

Mark in Oregon

Well, this thread will end when it ends. But I'm afraid I agree. 😉

@Dallas Joseph posted:

Sorry Vern.             The fantasy thing and hundreds of dollars would only apply to SOME. 

Attaboy, Joseph.  

This makes me wonder..........if the reverse happened, and the seller of these cars put them on ebay for a "buy-it-now" price of $100.00 for the set, would some people here say that is absurd?

This auction simply proves that some people won't settle for a repaint or reproduction; only the original will do, and they are willing to pay. The K-Line cars today seem to be what the Lionel "State Sets" and "Blue Comet" were back in the 60s and 70s, before Williams and MTH started reproducing them. They are no longer being produced, there is nothing else like them on the market, and as a result, what little inventory is on the secondary market is going for high prices for people who want them badly enough. While $3800.00 is higher than many (myself included) would pay, I think saying it is "absurd" is going too far and does nothing to promote goodwill in our hobby. If someone wants the cars and can afford to pay, why not just let it go at that? There was a willing seller and 2 willing buyers, and in the end, the highest bidder won. Done deal.

@gmorlitz posted:

Ah, a new moderator.

Gerry

Spoken like a true attorney...😐

Mark in Oregon

@BlueComet400 posted:

......While $3800.00 is higher than many (myself included) would pay, I think saying it is "absurd" is going too far and does nothing to promote goodwill in our hobby. If someone wants the cars and can afford to pay, why not just let it go at that? There was a willing seller and 2 willing buyers, and in the end, the highest bidder won. Done deal.

Exactly. 👍

Mark in Oregon

@BlueComet400 posted:

This makes me wonder..........if the reverse happened, and the seller of these cars put them on ebay for a "buy-it-now" price of $100.00 for the set, would some people here say that is absurd?

This auction simply proves that some people won't settle for a repaint or reproduction; only the original will do, and they are willing to pay. The K-Line cars today seem to be what the Lionel "State Sets" and "Blue Comet" were back in the 60s and 70s, before Williams and MTH started reproducing them. They are no longer being produced, there is nothing else like them on the market, and as a result, what little inventory is on the secondary market is going for high prices for people who want them badly enough. While $3800.00 is higher than many (myself included) would pay, I think saying it is "absurd" is going too far and does nothing to promote goodwill in our hobby. If someone wants the cars and can afford to pay, why not just let it go at that? There was a willing seller and 2 willing buyers, and in the end, the highest bidder won. Done deal.

Well, BlueComet, yes, there could be a lot of "what ifs" in relation to this particular sale. And I didn't think using the term "absurd" was going too far in this particular case, considering what was paid for the item. After all, we're talking an odd-looking set of toy-size trains that run on 3-rail track here. And yes, we know that some O-scalers will go to great lengths to get whatever they want. But we don't see these blackbonnets in HO or N scales, do we?

I would say that a sale like this one does not promote good will in our hobby inside and outside of it. Outsiders who learn of sales like this among us O-scalers just shake their heads. They think we're weird enough already and situations like this one don't help. But I know, who cares what they think?

Again, I'm with Strummer. It's probably time to put this one to bed, before we overthink it to death.

There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey. John Ruskin.

A fool and his money are easily parted.

Yeah, now it's beaten to death.

Gerry

@BigAl56 posted:

All it will take is for Williams to offer their own Black Warbonet set and that will wipe out most of the 'Midnight Chief' bubble.

Doesn't Williams have the K-Line tooling now? Seems they have bailed on O Gauge products.