Z-500 glitch

Robert,

 

Reversing the wires to the tracks should correct that.

True, but it's nice to uniformly have red connected to center rail.  Phasing gets involved, since all modern transformers have polarized plugs.

Robert,

 

I've found that using a Z-brick with a barrel jack connector rather than the Z-Controler will sometimes reverse the Hot and Common.

I wonder if the fabricators put the colored caps on the wrong studs.  They are captive threads so I'm reluctant to force them off.  I wouls appreciate it if someone out there who has a Z500 could tell me which color is nearest the input power jack.

 

 

If you're looking at it from the back, the red cap should be on the left.  Which is odd, because the pictures I find of the Z750 it's on the right!

 

I'd reverse the caps and be done with it.

 

GRJ, that makes the most sense.  Due to experience, I hate removing nuts with captive threads and then trying to get them back on. 

I know the feeling.  You could open it up and swap wires...

 

I'd measure the DC offset, it should measure positive on the red terminal when you hit the whistle and negative for the bell.

I put as much torque as I dared on the nuts, and they would not come off.  So I opened tha case and swapped the wires.  Internally, the red wire now goes to the black terminal and the black wire to the red terminal.  Taking the Z500 to my layout, it now is in phase with my Z4000.  So I attribute the glitch to a manufacturing/fabrication error and deem the issue closed.

 

Thanks BB & GRJ.  Now it's back to renovating my old ZWs

Robert,

 

Did you use an Barrel Jack connector to connect the brick to the tracks? If so, I'd be willing to bet (a vary small sum) that if you now instead hooked it to a Z-Controller and then to the tracks, that the voltage would again be reversed.  

Barry, from what he wrote, I'm assuming he was using the Z-controller, he spoke of a red and black jack.  The barrel plug on the brick doesn't have colors.

Joh,

 

OK, in that case I'd bet that substituting the barrel jack connector for the Z-Controller will reverse the Hot and Common.

GRJ is correct.  I used the Z-500 controller, to control voltage on the test track.  When testing DCS, I use the fixed terminals of the spare TIU so as not to distort the wave multiple times.

Does the Z-500 use the same banana plugs at the Z-1000?  If so, be aware...

 

I bought 12 Z1000s with 12 MTH banana plugs.   Seems like nearly 1/2 the plugs are backwards...   Or 1/2 the Z1000s are backwards.   Hard to tell which :-/

 

Made to getting the phasing right a bit of a pot luck surprise!

Trevize, thanks for the warning.  When you say banana plugs, I assume you mean the sockets for banana plugs.  I think they are the same on both models; in fact, my Z4000 uses the same.  Looking at the units, were the colors of the sockets in the same position but the differences were internal?

The issue showed up for me in 2 ways:
(1) In late 1990's, I wired a yard so that at the throw of a single switch, it could be run from a Z500 by the grandkids at the yard, as opposed to being run from the main control panel.  I found that, to get phasing correct, I had to connect black output to center rail.  After I went to DCS in 2001, the Z500 only got used under the Christmas tree, running a 1941 #224, whose whistle was not polarity sensitive. 
(2) Last week, I used it on a test track with a modern loco, and found bell & whistle were reversed.

So, as noted above, I switched wires internally and now the set works ok.  FYI, for one wanting to take the controller apart, there are 2 visible screws near rear on bottom, but you have to pull off the rubber feet to access the front screws.

There have been any number of postings about various phasing issues with Lionel and MTH transformers, so this is not that surprising.  It just points out the fact that when working with this stuff, never assume that something is built correctly when the symptoms are telling you it's not.

 

GRJ, I agree with your statement, except I would omit the last 8 words.

Ya it wouldn't surprise me if it was a Mix of Lionel and MTH.   What surprised me was that I purchased 12 Z-1000's and 12 banana plugs all at the same time and got mixed results.  I likely got a mix of old stock and new stock from the store I ordered from.  

 

So anyway, ya on some of my Z1000 / Banana plugs I have the black going to the red input on my TIU and some are matched.   Looking at the banana plugs there is no visible difference.   It could be that some of the Z1000's are backwards internally.  

 

 

A very likely scenario.

I did not pull out the chassis to ascertain to what components the red and black wires were connected.  Just switched the ring terminals on the screw ends of the terminals.  With the problem solved, I didn't feel a need to go furtjer merely to assuage my curiousity.