mlaughlinnyc posted:I just looked through the J R web site and can't find anything that indicates to me that they would be familiar with older Lionel.
They typically do not catalog their pre/postwar inventory online, but I have personally purchased pre and postwar items and parts from them. Or better yet, why not ask them yourself @JR Junction Train & Hobby?
Some symptoms mentioned here could also be aggravating things by running dirty.
Pumping more power at it alone and walking off may work, but still be leaving something in place that addressed can vastly imorove things.
#1 How old is the track? Nice INSIDE the tube where pins connect? (carefully feel for heat on rails after a hefty run where transformer and engine(s) really have time to heat any areas of resistance at track joints. Resistance= heat.
#2 Wheel, track, and armature cleanliness, good brushes and SPRINGS will often allow a lower voltage setting to run. My Marx may need 10v to 18v to get a crawl if the armature commutator gaps are full of bush dust. (especially if it is oily dust)
bmoran4 posted:gg1man posted:Actually, that puppy has more power per channel then the old ZW's.
As Gun- Runner said don't forget a fast blow 8 amp circuit protector and a TVS Diode.
Have Fun.
How do you figure? The smallest ZW can provide all of its power (250 Watts) out a single channel whereas the KW is only 190 Watts.
It is possible that you may be thinking of the VW transformer rated at 150 Watts, but this would be the first time the VW came up in this conversation and thus not necessarily applicable.
Well if you average max output among all available variable channels you have available the KW kinda wins.
2- 1033s = a KW in watts per varible; 2-KW > any ZW in watts per variable.
I mentioned a VW. As a med & med or small & large 2 train unit I think 150w would work out ok.
Physcal use I like the VW/ZW, but I like the looks of the KW. It reminds me more of real throttles and thottle stands in diesels, electrics, trolley, etc.. (the AF15b with deadman handle is the closet to the looks of a real thottle stand I know of. I'd like to see Lionel remake that with O features on controls resembling stand controls, even if function is not like original; whistle/bell... direction control on a deadman handle is really kinda cool.
An advantage of zw vs kw vs 1033 is when the option/ability to use more than max average, but total max for any single throttle comes into play. If thottle A's train uses only 60w, 180w - 60w=120w left for throttle B to use (kw)... and note I guess these are actually input values vs true outputs, but good enough for comparisons. I tend to prefer to amp/volt specifics for working out issues anyhow.
One more post to catch up......😌
Blade posted:I’m glad to see this post. I have been having the same problem with my 1033. I have now decided to switch to a different transformer. But, i think it caused problems with 3 of my engines. My new Williams Pennsylvania S2 is now being sluggish about going into reverse. My Lionel Postwar 224 is having the start stop issues. My Williams FM Trainmaster rear motor will not start up. I was not experiencing these issues before. Any guidance on how to proceed? Or do I need to put these in the shop?
This kinda needs a post of it's own but quickly..
The new engine going better forward than reverse is most likely wire, board, motor or gearbox, not the transformer or track.
The 224...pw (just incase thats a repeated number) could be dirty commutator, brushes/spings, wheels, track/track joints or weak e-unit .
The other Williams could be any of the above.
Few issues like these are caused by weak transformers.
The excess power these issues draw is more likely to affect a low rated transformer negatively long term.
Really the weak link in a 1033 is usually the breakers are getting old and need a retrofit, or at least need a PROPER adjustment, cleaning, and rivet reset due to metal tarnish. (a napa sold self resetting automotive thermal breaker at 6a is the closest to original I know of. Replacements I have seen aren't adjustable (a 1044 part maybe?))
Adriatic posted:Well if you average max output among all available variable channels you have available the KW kinda wins.
2- 1033s = a KW in watts per varible; 2-KW > any ZW in watts per variable.
Penalizing the ZW because it has 4 variable outputs is just an example of How to Lie with Statistics, especially since all power is available to any one variable channel. Additionally, the 1033 is capped at ~16VAC, the KW, VW, and ZW can do ~20VAC (not accounting for the Whistle Boost).
I don't see it that way; more a matter of which combo might serve a situation better.
Your point of watts per one throttle is just as valid, and two KW likely more costly than ZW.
Most folks never use the ZW short throttles as such either. So if you look at the ZW as a two throttle unit, with 2 unused var. acc. taps.. it's now easily on top.
"If" usually carries a lot of weight with me.
Adriatic posted:Blade posted:I’m glad to see this post. I have been having the same problem with my 1033. I have now decided to switch to a different transformer. But, i think it caused problems with 3 of my engines. My new Williams Pennsylvania S2 is now being sluggish about going into reverse. My Lionel Postwar 224 is having the start stop issues. My Williams FM Trainmaster rear motor will not start up. I was not experiencing these issues before. Any guidance on how to proceed? Or do I need to put these in the shop?
This kinda needs a post of it's own but quickly..
The new engine going better forward than reverse is most likely wire, board, motor or gearbox, not the transformer or track.
The 224...pw (just incase thats a repeated number) could be dirty commutator, brushes/spings, wheels, track/track joints or weak e-unit .
The other Williams could be any of the above.
Few issues like these are caused by weak transformers.
The excess power these issues draw is more likely to affect a low rated transformer negatively long term.
Really the weak link in a 1033 is usually the breakers are getting old and need a retrofit, or at least need a PROPER adjustment, cleaning, and rivet reset due to metal tarnish. (a napa sold self resetting automotive thermal breaker at 6a is the closest to original I know of. Replacements I have seen aren't adjustable (a 1044 part maybe?))
I love transformer topics. One of the great things about pre-war and post-war trains; trying to diagnose problems and solutions teaches you patience. Modern era trains do also I guess but the electronics and computer board stuff is too advanced for me.
Anyway, It is entirely true that dirty commutators, worn brushes, weak springs, dirty track and a myriad of other problems can cause our motive power to run poorly. Nevertheless, pesky transformer problems are also in the mix. Worn carbon rollers and even worn out circuit breakers can cause engines to stall, reverse and stop altogether. I recently had two ZW transformers cause me all kinds of grief because of these issues. I did everything I could with the track and locomotives to cure the erratic locomotive performance to no avail but then I checked the transformers and one had a badly worn carbon roller on the right handle and the other a faulty circuit breaker. After I replaced the carbon roller and circuit breaker locomotive performance returned to normal.
Toy trains have helped me improve my patience and have drastically improved my mechanical repair and maintenance skills. In closing, I'd like to say I really like the post-war Lionel ZW transformers but I 'm nuts about the KWs. I think they look neat and are incredibly reliable. I got 5 of 'em. Sorry, I didn't mean to hijack this thread but couldn't help myself.
The bottom line is everyone has a future vision for their model railroad empire. As such, one should have a plan of how to meet power requirements: start small and trade up over time or invest big up front and have power to grow on. My future plan was to have two ZW's providing 8 throttles. I always provided space for two ZW's. At the beginning I had one KW which I had from childhood. At some point I replaced the KW with a ZW. Finally, I added the second ZW. Both ZW's only power trains. Accessories are powered by separate AC and DC supplies. I expanded accessory power as needed.
bmoran4 posted:mlaughlinnyc posted:I just looked through the J R web site and can't find anything that indicates to me that they would be familiar with older Lionel.
They typically do not catalog their pre/postwar inventory online, but I have personally purchased pre and postwar items and parts from them. Or better yet, why not ask them yourself @JR Junction Train & Hobby?
Our available vintage items turn over to quickly to labor uploading it on our website. As the popular saying goes, we just never know what is going to walk through our door. I too am thinning my collection of rare and unusual items I’ve collected over the years in the business and I mix a few of them into the selection for sale too.
Forest posted:windhund42 posted:I agree. I have a local train shop that charges 80 dollars an hour labor even though I would save shipping charges it's still an expensive proposition. I think the RW is looking better all the time assuming no one thinks its a bad choice. I only have my starter 4x8 train board so it should be more than capable of handling that assignment.
$80.00\hr. Where is that?. I've been told I don't charge enough, but $80.00. Are other shops charging this much? I would never dream of charging anywhere near that.
Yes, because demand for vintage train repairs has risen so much in the past five plus years we cannot keep up with incoming repair jobs locally. Add to that the fact we lost one of our primary repair technicians who moved to a warmer climate last fall, we often have more work load than we can handle. Over the holidays we have to pick and choose the repair jobs we take on now which can seem like a good thing but it really isn’t.
We don’t do “bandaid” jobs here and because of that we have an excellent customer satisfaction reputation. We either do the whole complete refurbishment job or we don’t take it in. Complete refurbishment of an average postwar steam locomotive takes us two-plus hours to complete. We dismantle the entire locomotive including e-units, whistle mechanisms and smoke units and thoroughly clean each individual piece sometimes ultrasonically cleaning. All worn or broken parts are replaced with OEM or equivalent parts (we use a lot of original factory parts!) We don’t restore (repaint).
Refurbishing transformers enter more strict repair and refurbishment guidelines since there is a certain degree of liability involved for safety purposes. We take our vintage transformer repair jobs very seriously and therefore we have had to drastically limit the number of repair/refurbishment jobs we take in. We have in our inventory a mountain of vintage transformers all waiting to be rebuilt and refurbished. We tend to add to that mountain more than we take off!
Unfortunately there are less than four hobby stores in all Upstate NY anymore that take in vintage repair jobs.
Our modern Lionel & MTH train repair department is just as if not more busy than the vintage. There are times we limit those to just factory warranty jobs during the busy holiday/hobby season.
Sadly even at our present labor rates, we cannot afford to hire additional trained and experienced full time help here in a commercial facility of New York State to meet the demand.
Thanks to J R Junction and other commentators on this subject. I just tried to call him and left a message so I hope we'll confer soon. My immediate objective is to compile a list of repiat and parts sources useful to those of us in the New England region, so I'm ready to talk with anyone who can help me have an accurate list for handout at our meet on april 28th.
Check out the below OGR link for discussion of transformer output.
https://ogrforum.com/...44#76607711758254044
Charlie
mlaughlinnyc posted:windhund42 posted:J R Junction in Syracuse NY. They have a website so you can check them out for yourself but I don't reca!! seeing there any mention of their labor rates
My comment s generally pertain to pre-MPC prewar and postwar trains, so ignpore this if your interest is the modern stuff.
I think we should be very careful about whether a repair place is doing modern Lionel or the prewar/postwar era. If they are not selling parts for that era, it is unlikely that they have repairs to do repair work without a wait.
I just looked through the J R web site and can't find anything that indicates to me that they would be familiar with older Lionel.
I have found that repair of anything made before MPC can be learned by someone like myself who is handy with old fashined tools. The more modern stuff has electronics that I don't understand at all.
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On a related subject. I'm assemblin a list of parts dealers and northeastern region repair shops for a repiar clinic at a New England TCA meet on 4/28. I'll share it with this forum when I'm done. In a few days I'll post a preliminary list and ask for those that I have missed.
I'd like to put in a good word for J R Junction after earlier expressing doubts. I spoke with the proprietor of J R this morning. He told me he is one of those who have bought parts inventories from Lionel service stations leaving the business - sounds like he can work with all ages. Definitely a place I would look at if I lived in central New York.
Yes, it's a reputable place. I just can't justify paying 80 dollars an hour for labor but since I have nothing to compare it to, maybe this is the "going rate" at train shops?? Based on the explanation above, I can only think it must be their way of dissuading people from having work done there since apparently they can't keep up with the demand.
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