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*** 1st post was Edited to provide latest information so you don't have to read the entire thread to get the current Info! ***

I was cleaning up some stuff and noticed I had a pile of blue modules for my command base.  That got me thinking...  I popped one apart and checked inside, and they have two Atmel 24C512 EEPROM chips inside for 128kb of memory.  I got the datasheet for the chip and noticed there is a file protect that if tied to VCC inhibits writes, but if it's floating or grounded, writes are enabled.

I checked and indeed the WP pin was connected to VCC.  I picked the pin off the pad for the two chips and stuffed it into my command base and attempted to write a module.  No sweat, writes it just like a black module!  I then took an unmodified blue module and tried again, an immediate error popped out.

The White and Orange modules only include one chip, so they can't do the base or remote updates.  However, they can be made writable so you can make single or multi engine modules, see below.

*** Current and best modification method ***

On recommendation from an expert later in this thread, I found out that the other jumper pad was actually to ground the write protect pin to insure that write was enabled, so that's the direction I took for later mods.



I chopped open a white module, and as expected, there was only one chip.  However, the exact same technique yields a nice module you can use to create a single or multi-engine module with.  I dressed these up to use them as Legacy modules for my Legacy engines that don't have a module.

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Last edited by gunrunnerjohn
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I don't recall you saying they were the same chips, in any case I can now state that I'm 100% certain.

My point is that they're obviously charging for the additional capability, even though it didn't cost a dime, and actually saves them money!

For the black modules, you just produce them and stick them in a bag, for the blue modules, you have to program them with the version you're shipping.

Since I have half a dozen more blue modules, and it's easy to make the mod, I won't be buying any more black modules.

Legacy Blue-Black Module[2)



Alternate method suggested later in the thread for perhaps greater reliability.

It was suggested that since there is actually pads on the board to ground the WP lead that would be more reliable.  I haven't had a problem with the cut the lead method, but this is 100% bulletproof, so I have "updated" my method.  The trick is to remove the small surface mount resistor that is in the right hand position (see picture below) and move it to the left hand set of pads that are now unused.

I actually removed the SMT resistor and just used a wire jumper for the left hand pads.  Here's a couple using the "move the resistor" method.  I used wire to jump the alternate location as it's much easier to position it and cut it than position the little resistor.

Legacy Black Module N4

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Last edited by gunrunnerjohn

John, hacking in the finest sense helping those who are victims of the big boy's uncalled for price structuring. Now if only someone could hack MTH's proto and Lionel's TMMC and Legacy programs to allow consumers to customize station and crew talk announcements, that would be fantastic. Any computer savy programmers among our forum members who are willing to take on such a feat?

I'm glad it worked out for everyone.  Like I said, it was way easier than I imagined, I just opened one up because I was curious what was in them.

Originally Posted by ogaugeguy:
John, hacking in the finest sense helping those who are victims of the big boy's uncalled for price structuring. Now if only someone could hack MTH's proto and Lionel's TMMC and Legacy programs to allow consumers to customize station and crew talk announcements, that would be fantastic. Any computer savy programmers among our forum members who are willing to take on such a feat?


I think that's just a bit more complicated!

I just lifted the pins of the ones in the picture.  However, after verifying this works as intended, I just did six modules by simply cutting the pin off the chip right at the chip.  I verified all six modules work as intended after the surgery.  The black paint is drying on the shells now.

 

I also decided to change the topic, these really end up free if you do them yourself.

Originally Posted by Lionelzwl2012:
Wonder if an orange module has the same insides and can be done this way also. How about it john. got one you could try? I have a blank one from a mikado that was never programed at the factory. Still kept it thinking maybe one day it could come in handy. Hum maybe today?

I see no reason that the Orange modules would be any different than the blue or black ones, I'll bet the white generic ones are the same as well.

 

 

Originally Posted by bigdodgetrain:

Success!!!  took the module into the sun and saw the pin used an X-acto knife tip and fliped out the pin. 

Piece of cake!   I just made six of them, I even took the shells down and sprayed them black.  If I weren't so lazy, I'd probably buff off the paint from the Lionel logo and make them look just right.

 

 

Originally Posted by Nick12DMC:

John, Thanks for posting this great tip!.

Success, 1.51 installed (upgraded direct from 1.3)

 

I guess it's working for sure.

 

 

 

One tip for folks converting multiple modules at one time.  Keep the two halves of the shell together and put them together as one at the end.  When you pull them apart, the glue doesn't always separate exactly the same, so the best fit will be the original pieces together again.

As I said early on.  They are all the same.  Just depends on what they were originally purposed for if they were to be read only or writable.  I really don't see why this is such a revelation. 

 

I credit John for doing the discovery.  But you had to believe that the modules were the same and just were write protected in some fashion.

Thank you John!

 

You will be known as we called em in the IT a "Ethical Hacker" Breaking limitations on product so that you can do it yourself at home instead of incurring extra expense.

 

The original term of hacker was simply to change the physical "Hardware" and wiring so that a item modify a behavior to whatever it is you seek.

 

I feel that sharing these kinds of tricks are very useful.

I still suggest moving the zero ohm jumper, as the Atmel spec sheet states that the floating of the Write Protect pin is OK as long as the pin has less than 3pf coupling to the external circuitry. 

 

Floating the pin can cause corrupted data to be programmed into the module, and while it may seem that all is well, your upgraded Cab2 or Base may exhibit strange behavior from bad code. 

 

Not worth the risk, move the resistor, or get a black module to be safe.

 

John,

 

First off, Great tip on re-using those blue modules.  I plan to mod 2 of mine by moving the resistor.

 

I think people should be cautioned that they are not upgrading the system as per Lionel's specs.  If the CAB2 gets corrupted as Jon pointed out, and causes a problem, its really on the user since they did not want to spend the $17 for the black modules.

 

Odds are the upgrade will go OK, but if something starts acting weird, who would even think to ask the user how the system was last updated?  It may be hard to figure that one out.

 

Joe

Originally Posted by SantaFeFan:

I still suggest moving the zero ohm jumper, as the Atmel spec sheet states that the floating of the Write Protect pin is OK as long as the pin has less than 3pf coupling to the external circuitry. 

 

Floating the pin can cause corrupted data to be programmed into the module, and while it may seem that all is well, your upgraded Cab2 or Base may exhibit strange behavior from bad code. 

 

Not worth the risk, move the resistor, or get a black module to be safe.

 

has anyone who removed the two pins had any troulble with their update?  I have not.

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