Hi HOSO

Maybe reading is a forgotten art.  But....re read mine

"What you want will cost $$$. You have the transformers. The size of your layout would be the next question. You probably only need TMCC.  A cab1/command base set offered occasionally on the buy/sell forum but certainly on ebay would do the trick. A TPC would be next"

Ralph

I am reading some later posts to this thread and feel the issue as regards to the Command Base is getting blurred. You do not need a command base to run conventional trains the way the original poster wants. All that is needed is the Cab1, Powermaster, and 6-12893 power adapter cable.

Two methods:

#1- CAB-1 and Powermasters. PowerMasters receive the signal directly from the CAB-1 Remote. Use your existing transformers.

#2- CAB-1 with Command Base or CAB-2 Legacy System. Use your existing transformers. One TPC per loop and you need either a TMCC Command Base or the Legacy system to address the TPC's.

In both examples you will need one PowerMaster or TPC's for each loop of track.

Method #1 is the least expensive and simplest method. PowerMasters can be had on the secondary market for between $50-60. Transformer connector cables are less than $7.00 each.

I've bought the 135W PowerMasters on eBay for less than $20 several times.  If you set up a search for them and just keep sniping with a lowball offer, one day you'll score one.

There is a product that is being developed by Aristocraft trains called the "train engineer". It is a remote control unit that communicates with a circuit that you install install a locomotive for hand held operation. As far as I know it was designed for DC can motor control only and it likely doesn't work with AC motored post war trains but who knows what might be coming down the pike. There is a possibility that if you use bridge rectifiers and run your engines on DC the Train Engineer might work but having little info to go on, I cannot say for sure.  Walt at RMT might know. 

You have to add these to each locomotive, and they're only for DC motors.  I don't think this is what the OP had in mind.

The 135W PowerHouse can be found for $20 plus, but the PowerMasters are more expensive and do seem to run around $50.

I'm specifically speaking of the 135W PowerMaster, Lionel 6-12867.  There are two starting at a .01 bid right now on eBay.  As I said, just snipe at your price, say $25, and you'll score one within a few weeks.

Would this get me what I need or is it overkill?

Lionel #6-12969 Trainmaster Command Set / Cab-1 Remote and Command Base

Spud

Spud as I said before you need these items:

A - Cab1 with or without the command base (what you posted above will take care of this part) I have this for sale.

1 - 6-24130 TMCC PM-1 Powermaster and 6-12893 power adapter cable PER LOOP OF TRACK that you want to run a separate engine on at the same time so 4 trains running at the same time individually controlled equals 4 powermasters and 4 cables using your transformers.

Ron

This is great thread with so much info specially for a newcomer like me. is there a thread which talks about the options available for a transformer to be used. currently i am using a 80W but looks like it will not be enough soon as i plan to increase the length of my track. can i use two of these 80W on the same track or shall i have to invest in a new transformer. if someone can point me to such thread, will be very helpful.

thanks

Spud, stay focused.  Three choices. 

Powermaster - Cab1 - no base - old aged - cables and go, one for each oval - cheapest, availability as individuals migrate to the newer issues. Some on the forum can repair, but not too many others, IMHO. $$. Relatively easy setup, the Cab 1 use will need education.

TMCC - Cab1/Command base - middle aged - needs tpc and cables, different cables, one for each oval. Going away, but availability from those who migrate to legacy. Lionel support for a while, though the Cab1 is a less available item. $$$. Relatively easy setup, the Cab 1 use will need education.

Legacy - Cab2/base - current - adolescent aged - needs tpc and the tmcc cables, others come with the legacy buy. Current release by Lionel. $$$$ A little more complex for a novice.

Railfan Ron, Please send me an email. I would like to correspond with you off list.

Thanks,

Spud

The TE RC is already out there. I understand Aristo is working an update that will include sound. The system seems to be straight-forward with control of the train separated from the power requirements of the track - thus allowing full RC capability even on battery power. Should you go the route of battery, that allows you to play your trains on anyone's layout as you are not dependent on power from the track.

I'm anxiously awaiting the release of the update (57000s) and will be converting several engines to the system. The Williams E7 AA's have plenty of room for the electronics - and the dummy can house the batteries. A tether connects to the power unit. A simple dpdt throw switch could allow dual sourcing (battery or track power)so you would have the best of both worlds.

My intent is to use it indoors as well as outdoors. It is reasonably priced and the reviews that are out there have all be good.

Spud,

I think I'm right in saying this...DON'T GET THE POWERMASTER BRIDGE!!!

Make sure it's the POWERMASTER P/N 6-12867.

The PM BRIDGE is for use IF you have Legacy

(Please correct me if I'm wrong).

There's so many ways you COULD go, but getting a CAB-1, PowerMaster, Cable, and transformer (if you need one) has got to be the cheapest way to go, or it was when you could easily buy them.

The ability to follow your train around your layout is well worth the cost.

The PowerMasters *OR* TPCs are still required whether he goes with a CAB-1 or a CAB-2.  The benefit to the CAB-1 is that it will talk directly to the PowerMasters without a command base.  So, it isn't 3 choices...  it is more like:

1. CAB1 + *EITHER* PowerMasters *OR* TPCs.
2. Legacy + PowerMaster Bridge + *EITHER* PowerMasters *OR* TPCs.

As far as I know he can also use the PowerMasters and TPCs in any combination.

Spud...  You do realize that once you settle in with all this stuff, you are going to see either a Legacy or MTH engine you can't live without, don't you? 

I have been running postwar and prewar (O and Standard Gauge) from DCS using a variable channel for years now (since about the time DCS came out).

Works great, although it makes the E-units buzz a bit more at low speed.

i have a question for legacy, if i am using legacy i guess i can just use a TPC and then i do not have to use a power master and a bridge. is this statement correct?

the reason i am asking is that i am just starting and have only one legacy diesel. i am yet to invest in a system and i think i will get legacy and may have a conventional locomotive in future, so with that configuration, TPC along with a 180 powerhouse is looking to be a good option.

Yes you are correct. The Bridge is only needed with the powermasters. If you don't have the Powerhouse yet you could look for a new style ZW. It would have 2 powerhouses which would be either 135 or 180 watt depending on the age of the unit. The new style ZW would give you 4 built in powermasters that can be controlled by the legacy remote. You could use these in place of track power controllers.

Ron

Will this be for both TMCC and Protosounds??

Yes and no.  the Z4000 was designed for the QSI/Protosounds 1 programming which is based on conventional running of trains as it has been for over 100 years. TMCC equipped locos can be run in conventional mode with this system and basic items such as sound/horn & bell will work. Some TMCC features will not work when the locomotive is in conventional mode such as crew chatter on/off, Oddessey on/off, etc.

Remember the original question was to run trains conventionally with NO fancy electronics but just a remote option to see the model trains without being tied down to the control stand.

Truth be told, to have access ALL functions of TMCC/DCS equipped locos they are not compatable with convetional running trains because the TMCC/DCS functions need the constant 18V  across the tracks and the built -in electronics limit the amount of power fed to the loco's motors-while convetional control the transformer limits the amount of power to the track and loco's motors.

Thankyou Ron for the reply but i am slightly confused now. to clarify here are the three options as i understand using legacy

1. to use conventional and legacy: Use Legacy remote + power house + TPC
2. to use Legacy only: use legacy remote + power house + Direct Lockon (as overload protection)
3. to use conventional and legacy: use legacy remote + ZW-L (powerhouse inbuilt)

Kindly verify if option 3 is correct and thats what you referred above. if so, it looks better as less equipment but i guess is getting  costly as well for a starter like me.

but since i do not own anything than an legacy engine, i can build the right set up even if it costs a little more.

thanks

Puc

The ZW-L has the transformer internal to the unit, it's a single box.  The ZW-C uses external Powerhouse supplies.

In 2009 I returned to the hobby after retiring, I too did not know about command and control. 

After posting my questions here on the forum members said to purchased a MTH Z1000 transformer, a TPC; track power controller, and a Legacy system.  I did and I have no problem running anything I purchase.  Easy to hook up and simple to use.

I found if you think about this too much you make it harder then it is.

http://www.mthtrains.com/content/40-1000

http://www.lionel.com/media/se...ents/71-4189-250.pdf

OK, let's try this again. Please read the original post. bja does not know all this terminology. He only wants to control his post war engines and he only wants to run them conventionally. He does not want to spend a lot of money. Now some of you are trying to get him to install a whole new wireless system in his engines!! Some have mentioned the ZW-L!!! Some still are telling us you can control TPC's with a CAB1!! Gentlemen, the term CAB1 refers to the hand held controller only unless you say it includes the base unit. If a CAB2 is just the Legacy controller then the CAB1 is just the TMCC controller. The poor guy is probably so confused. Please, If you can't stay on subject and in the parameters listed then start you own thread.

Thankyou

Al

see my post above.

get a Legacy system and a TPC.

the only thing you do not need to buy is the Z1000. you can use what you have, TW, ZW and the 1033.

Too expensive.  Way overkill.

Used/New CAB-1                 $50-80

Used/New PM-1          $20-50(1 per track/loop/circuit/district)

PM-1 to transformer cord      $6-10(1 per PM-1)

Existing 16-20 volt transformer of your choice    FREE

The cord is optional - these can be made up very easily on your own.

Is all that's required to accomplish the OP's goal.  That's it.

Guys, let me thank you all. This has been a great learning experience. Between this post and the Lionel Customer Service You Tube videos I feel I have a handle on exactly what I need.  ADCX Rob nailed it on the nose (as did some others). Thanks.

BJA / Spud