Right now, best bet is to keep one eye on eBay, unless you are an accomplished machinist with at least a 9" lathe. If Slaters is that outfit in the UK, you get nice drivers for British prototypes, but they do not have the massive look of US steamers.
If nobody is responding, what good does it do to lock them, awaiting a request to unlock so somebody can post?
Well, I tried to and people are responding. I would ask, why lock them in the first place? Does it service a purpose?
I did call Bob Stevenson today. He was a lot of fun to talk with and I might, very helpful. Why I'm interested in 0 scale drivers, is I plan on using them for a S scale engine up grade. I've been looking for an 80" S scale driver -- with 17 spokes -- did some math and learned a 60" 0 scale driver is the correct diameter for an 80". However, it's not that simple, other things to consider is tire width and hub diameter. It's not a perfect one to one, but I have a candidate from Bob. There even a 19mm back to back narrow gauge axle in 0 scale that would be just about right for S, available from Slater's which is where Bob gets his axles in he first place.
Proto 48 drivers/wheels/tires, etc. are great for S Scale. Not Flyer/tinplate or P:64, just regular S Scale. Same with turnout parts such as frogs, guard rails, and points. I didn't realize it until I looked at the NMRA specs.
Proto 48 drivers/wheels/tires, etc. are great for S Scale. Not Flyer/tinplate or P:64, just regular S Scale. Same with turnout parts such as frogs, guard rails, and points. I didn't realize it until I looked at the NMRA specs.
Jay
I’ve only looked at the online catalogs so far and have only found a few that I thought would be likely candidates. Mostly it’s the size of the hub – probably too fussy on my part. Have you done much with them in S scale? Someone also warned me about the spoke size, too.
Bob Stevenson will machine, drill crank holes, and insulate them for a very reasonable charge. I finally heard from Slater’s. Their centers are nylon and don’t need to be insulated.
In the pix I'v attached, 0 scale on the left S scale on the right.
Too fussy huh? Good to know. Yeah, I'd probably not be able to meet your standards. I'll let you and Bob work it out.
Jay
I'm not that fussy. I do hi-rail,, somewhere in between hard core scale and tinplate. Because I can count, I don't do rivets... However, I do like to be close if possible. In this project, I'll probably leave the original Flyer wheels on the pilot. And who knows about the tender?
I thought the threads lock automatically after a while to prevent really ancient threads (which might contain very out-of-date info such as disconnected e-mail addresses) from being dragged out by someone posting on it, not realising that the thread is stale. I've seen a good example where a person has posted thinking they were joining in on a current conversation, only to have their parade rained on when someone else points out, "Uh, check the dates; that thread is three years old."
I thought the threads lock automatically after a while to prevent really ancient threads (which might contain very out-of-date info such as disconnected e-mail addresses) from being dragged out by someone posting on it, not realising that the thread is stale. I've seen a good example where a person has posted thinking they were joining in on a current conversation, only to have their parade rained on when someone else points out, "Uh, check the dates; that thread is three years old."
Paul
NYCSHS #7172
Understood, but some groups are very inactive… for example: Railfane.net’s Reading Railroad sub-group. Yesterday I responded to a thread from 2007. Reading Modeler is not much better, however there is movement. The Cast Drivers is another, old but the info is still relevant.
I’m not saying the policy should change, I mean, how hard was it for me to start another similar thread? BOTOH, the thread lost some of the people with the knowledge I seek.
I guess it has to be each thread on its own merits. There will always be situations where it's worth reactivating an old thread....more photos come to light for a prototype thread on a freight car, for example - makes far more sense to keep it all together.
Regarding Slaters driving wheels, I want to make a general comment that they have such a wide variety of wheels available that it is usually possible to find something quite close to what is needed for 1:48-scale US-prototype locos, and I am surprised that they are not used more in this market. The current project on my workbench is installing a drive in an AHM/Riv IHB 0-8-0. There are numerous reasons for ditching the chunky wheels that it came with, and I found Slaters' #7851K wheels are a reasonable match; overall diameter is only slightly under-size, it has the correct number of spokes, and the piston stroke is okay, 28.7" as compared to 32" for the prototype, but the screw-together, self-quartering assembly more than makes up for any discrepancies....so easy to use! I have successfully machined brass wheel castings in the past, made my own split axles an'all, and now that I have given Slaters wheels a proper look, I swear they will always be my first choice.
I guess it has to be each thread on its own merits. There will always be situations where it's worth reactivating an old thread....more photos come to light for a prototype thread on a freight car, for example - makes far more sense to keep it all together.
Regarding Slaters driving wheels, I want to make a general comment that they have such a wide variety of wheels available that it is usually possible to find something quite close to what is needed for 1:48-scale US-prototype locos, and I am surprised that they are not used more in this market. The current project on my workbench is installing a drive in an AHM/Riv IHB 0-8-0. There are numerous reasons for ditching the chunky wheels that it came with, and I found Slaters' #7851K wheels are a reasonable match; overall diameter is only slightly under-size, it has the correct number of spokes, and the piston stroke is okay, 28.7" as compared to 32" for the prototype, but the screw-together, self-quartering assembly more than makes up for any discrepancies....so easy to use! I have successfully machined brass wheel castings in the past, made my own split axles an'all, and now that I have given Slaters wheels a proper look, I swear they will always be my first choice.
I agree about Slater's. Self quartering and nylon centers make them a must explore caster. For me using their 7mm for S scale makes it a bit more difficult. The hubs are really large, the wheel I was looking at, 7861, looks great however the hub would be over 2 scale ft for me. More than twice what it should be.
I agree about Slater's. Self quartering and nylon centers make them a must explore caster. For me using their 7mm for S scale makes it a bit more difficult. The hubs are really large, the wheel I was looking at, 7861, looks great however the hub would be over 2 scale ft for me. More than twice what it should be.
Tom Stoltz
in Maine
Tom, it has only just dawned on me that I should mention 3D-printed wheel centres. I have been experimenting with them for myself for quite a while,
O-scale wheel centres printed in Shapeways Black-Strong-Flexible & fitted with Protocraft P48 tyres - scale 63" dia.
I have been pleasantly surprised by how accurate these turned out, printed with crankpin hole an'all. The tyres must be secured with locktite or similar because any tighter fit distorts the centre. They are accurate, the price is right, they are already insulated, they don't need painting and the slightly rough surface texture is quite like the somewhat rough finish on the real thing - sorry about the photo, it is really sharp on Flickr but something seems to have got lost in translation!
That's more like it....I had forgotten which method to use to include photos, used the wrong one. I upload to Shapeways as a set of eight centres sprued together, costs me US$24.33 for the centres, freight and tyres extra.
Bob, no they really are not printing in metal. They might say they are but what they're really doing is investing the prints and casting them. Just like you & I do with wax and plastic. Sounds good to say, printed in metal though.
Tom, it has only just dawned on me that I should mention 3D-printed wheel centres. I have been experimenting with them for myself for quite a while,
O-scale wheel centres printed in Shapeways Black-Strong-Flexible & fitted with Protocraft P48 tyres - scale 63" dia.
I have been pleasantly surprised by how accurate these turned out, printed with crankpin hole an'all. The tyres must be secured with locktite or similar because any tighter fit distorts the centre. They are accurate, the price is right, they are already insulated, they don't need painting and the slightly rough surface texture is quite like the somewhat rough finish on the real thing - sorry about the photo, it is really sharp on Flickr but something seems to have got lost in translation!
Hi,
I’m looking at purchasing a WC68 wood chipper from you and your website states delivery won’t be until July 31. Because delivery is so far in the future, do you require full payment at the time of the order?
You have numerous extra parts listed with the build & price page. What would you recommend, if anything, be bought with the initial purchase?
I purchased your stump grinder and had trouble with the trans-shipper (trucking company) used by your shipper. They have small trucks but always want to use a semi when they have delivered to me in the past. Can your shipper put ‘small truck required’ on the bill of laden? Their semi’s can’t get within a ¼ mile of my driveway because they can’t turn the semi at the end of the town road.
I read somewhere that they were printing metal jet engine components in titanium. I will check further.
There was a poster designing the back end of the Milwaukee "Sky Top." I was watching, because sooner or later I am going to do an all metal Skytop, using lost wax for that complex window arrangement. He seems to have given up.
Edit: here you go. Sintering, laser beam, electron beam. All very expensive at the moment, but as with all of this, prices come down with increasing experience and capabilities:
Shapeways does have the ability to direct print some metals (no interim lost wax casting required) for the higher melting temp metals, such as steel and stainless steel but for the lower melting temp metals, such as brass, they will use the lost wax method. In some higher temp metals they need to use another metal as a binder, such as bronze. 316LSS, however, does not require a binder alloy. Below is a video of a someone who was making a custom micro sensitive drilling attachment for a lathe tailstock and had the handle printed in 420 steel, which included a bronze matrix, printed by Shapeways from a solid 3D model. At the time this video was posted, (back in 2019), I think he said it cost him around $80 to get this custom handle printed by Shapeways. Also, the technology allows you to print an object with a different metal inside that you could not do with conventional casting methods like a titanium sphere with a stainless steel core.
So Scott, what they're basically doing is the same thing as sintered iron. The binder makes it so. Way too porous for my needs. Obviously, other's mileage may differ.
Thanks for sharing. Your knowledge of what they do is far greater than mine.
Tom, I suspect you have the wrong Woodsworks on the line here. I don't sell wood chippers and if I did, you probably wouldn't be able to afford the freight ;-)
Wow, I wonder what button I pushed? I sent Woodland Mills email via their website and they responded. Yet what I don't see is what I thought I sent to you??? What a funny coincidence that your name also has Woods in it. Anyway, don’t worry about the shipping, turns out shipping is free with the chipper.
IIRC, what I thought I sent was something like Great work --- oh yeah… $24.+ was that for all 8 drivers? What about the cost of the tires? Bob Stevenson will machine, insulate, and mount his centers for $25.00 each. Do you have a total cost per finished driver so I could compare?
And with the possibility of center distortion due to the soft material used by Shapeways, could they use something stiffer?
What program did you use to draw your centers? I don’t see why you couldn’t make your axle hole square to match the Slater self-quartering axles. Unfortunately for me the 0 scale hubs are way too big for S scale, but they sure do look good.
I have used Shapeways steel/bronze, just a test-piece to see how it behaved. I made up a replacement part for a large die-cast toy that was my son's favourite, a swivel-steer truck. It had this dinky little fitting that formed the hinge, so it was under enourmous stress and being made of die-cast zamac metal, 'twas hardly surprising it broke. I had to include some close-fitting pins in the new part and not knowing how much to allow for shrinkage or inaccuracy, I intentionally went a bit undersize with my design so that I could drill it out as required. First thing that struck me was the lovely smooth finish of the new part, and second was how incredibly hard and strong this stuff is - while not overly difficult, it still presented a few challenges drilling it out, needing quite substantial clamping and metal-cutting lube because I started out treating it like bronze but it was stalling my cordless drill. That toy truck has survived the attentions of both sons and is still in service, eight years on! I am a mechanical engineer used to working with somewhat exotic materials in the marine engineering industry so I am not easily impressed, and it exceeded my expectations by quite a bit. Screenshot of swivel-steer hinge CAD-rendering attached below.
My preference for wheel centres is still sintered nylon because it is far cheaper, automatically takes care of the insulation issue and is accurate enough that it doesn't require machining, although I will happily admit that setting up tyres and axles to run true is a bit of a fiddle. That said, my first stop is always Slaters' drivers to see if they have something close to what I want. Right now I am trying to turn a static AHM/Riv IHB 0-8-0 into a working model, and Slaters' #7851K driver is almost perfect. When 18 GB Pounds gets you two wheels that screw onto self-quartering square-ended axles, and crankpins, you'd be crazy not to. This steel/bronze stuff would be okay for driver centres except that the economics don't make sense - ordinary brass castings made using high-res 3D prints as masters will cost about the same or perhaps slightly less and require about the same amount of machining but at the same time have much finer detail.
Great work --- oh yeah… $24.+ was that for all 8 drivers? What about the cost of the tires? Bob Stevenson will machine, insulate, and mount his centers for $25.00 each. Do you have a total cost per finished driver so I could compare?
And with the possibility of center distortion due to the soft material used by Shapeways, could they use something stiffer?
What program did you use to draw your centers? I don’t see why you couldn’t make your axle hole square to match the Slater self-quartering axles. Unfortunately for me the 0 scale hubs are way too big for S scale, but they sure do look good.
Tom Stoltz
in Maine
Hi Tom
$24 got me the set of eight centres. Then came $8 each for the Protocraft tyres, and I cut my own axles using stainless shaft from a scrapped inkjet printer. While that's less than half of what Bob charges, his brass centres will still be much stronger and stiffer, plus no effort required by the purchaser so in my mind, it's really no competition.
I did consider using Slaters' square-ended axles but the square is quite short, only 2.5mm long - not an issue when used in a Slaters wheel because these have a matching brass bush moulded into the wheel, but in my D.I.Y nylon wheel I felt it would not be sufficient to hold the wheel in alignment so I went for a plain hub with straight hole, 3/16" through. I have not found softness of Shapeways' sintered nylon to be an issue, and it's actually very accurate, too. I think it was only called 'Black-Strong-Flexible' to distinguish it from the high-resolution resins which are quite brittle. Incidentally, I have used Shapeways 'Fine Detail' acrylic resin to make some spoked wheel centres 16mm diameter for a 1:48 NZ Railways freight wagon, worked great and ran true with very little effort, but definitely on the pricey side.
I use an ancient copy of Bentley Microstation dating from 2004. It's more obscure than the likes of AutoCAD and Solidworks (which I have also used in various jobs) but it does everything I need for drawing up parts for 3D printing and has a nicer interface than anything else I have ever used so I have stuck with it.
Well, after some time, I have an assortment of drivers. From the left in the photo is a Stevenson Preservation Lines, O-scale, WC-53L 61"-63" (about 80" S-scale), a SSL&S 78", S-scale (not available anymore), an American Models 79" (closer to 76") S-scale, and an original American Flyer 64", S-scale.
The O-scale driver is not as heavy in detail as I was afraid in might be. Interestingly, the O-scale flanges are much bigger than the Flyer's. That's probably because Bob turned down his tire to a S-scale 80" for me. If I use the O-scale driver, I will have to turn down the flanges a bit. The SSL&S were available only with S-scale flanges, a bit smaller than I would prefer because I run S-scale, Hi-rail flanges typically.
I bought 19mm narrow (O-scale) gauge axles from Slater's and they perfect for S, standard gauge. I did a trial fitting with the O-scale drivers and rolled them down the track -- great, so far. (Does anyone know what size the Allen wrench is for the Slater's axles?) I have found with converting O-scale wheelsets to S, the familiar back to back measurement to be useless because of the difference it flange widths in O-scale in general and compared to S. It's the measurement of the B-B plus 2 flanges that really matters -- It's got to fit the track gauge first.
I'm still interested in 3-D print centers, but if the cost is about the same as making a lost wax master and having it cast, then I guess there really is no point... I have way too much invested in this project already to bother with being more accurate.
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