CLEAR F3 A-B-A unit, whaddyathink?

A novelty to be sure. Lionel produced a (very) few of these back when they first introduced the F3 in Santa fe & NYC. They used the clear ones do demonstrate the workings with the twin motors in the lead unit and horn in the non-powered A unit.

They became quite valuable as collector items and were rarely seen, much less offered for sale.

Since then, both MTH & Lionel have produced some sets that had various degrees of minimal paint on them. Not hard to find if you look for them...

I have a set of the MTH remakes, but it's still in the box. I never got around to putting it on the tracks.

I have no idea what they are going for now.

Oh yea, welcome to the OGR website Carey.

I have seen the old and the new but never had an interest in owning one.

At one time i did have a clear pair of ZW handles but sold them. I was offered too good a price to pass on.

I have a set of new MTH clears.  They have been under glass for years.  Anyone who loves them more than me can hit my email.

If I got one cheap I would paint it!

I have the first MTH clear body Loco made. The GP-9 that introduced Proto One. Don

c.sam posted:

A novelty to be sure. Lionel produced a (very) few of these back when they first introduced the F3 in Santa fe & NYC. They used the clear ones do demonstrate the workings with the twin motors in the lead unit and horn in the non-powered A unit.

They became quite valuable as collector items and were rarely seen, much less offered for sale.

Since then, both MTH & Lionel have produced some sets that had various degrees of minimal paint on them. Not hard to find if you look for them...

Sam:

With all due respect, are you sure about the Santa Fe 2333 UNPOWERED unit with a clear shell?  I’ve seen single A powered-unit examples but never a double AA.  These came out in 1948 when the horn was in the powered unit like all Lionel F-3 production from 1948 through 1952, so there is nothing to display in the unpowered unit. 

Bill

As for the clear shell F3s Lionel made in 1948, there were only approx. 200 sets made.  And, yes, they were AA units, but most only had interest in the powered A unit because of the inner workings.  The dummy clear unit did not gain as much interest, and is much harder to locate today.  In 2000 Lionel did issue a clear AA set of F3s, and a matching 3 pc set of clear Madison passenger cars.  However, this set did not have a B unit, either.  Perhaps the F3s (?) you saw were the MTH issued set.  If you, anyone, should ever see the original 1948 Lionel clear shell F3s, they are no longer clear, but have aged and are all an opaque yellow, now.

Hope this is helpful information.

Jesse

I had an EMD Demo F3 A-B-A years back. My (not yet at that time) ex sold it, and then found out he did later. gosh, I l love that big blue baby. I miss having that with al the station noises, and the SOUND of it! Maybe I should buy it again, and not go with the clear set. But would also have to find the specific controller set that works for it it, too.

Definitely just a cool novelty for me. IMHO I'd rather spend the dollars on something  I'll run. 

The EMD demos are pretty nice too. I'd run those though.

There are 4 versions of clears.   The originals used to demonstrate the new twin motors.... these sold for 10k in front of me in a hotel room at York last year....my 8500 offer wasn't good enough... these were originally in pairs not individual...   second version were Lionel platinum ghost remakes.    Then they made blank shells for repairs in those.   And also Williams made a clear Aba unit.   

I have the MTH DAP clear shell set.  I purchased it here on the forum some years ago for $200.00 NIB.   If anyone wants a photo, hit me over the weekend as it is in my glass case.  It was done in Santa Fe.  I have told Mike to do it in NYC with the postwar number.

I have a few of the recent issue Lionel clear F3 shells. I thought they'd look cool in my F3 paint mask.

To my mind, the original postwar Lionel clear F3's that were made as demostrators are interesting because they were made in very low numbers specifically as a sales tool.
All the newer stuff made as collectables are of no interest to me because they were specifically made as collectables.

I have a few other postwar items, like a whistle mechanism with a clear whistle chamber and a 4454 boxcar with a clear body (after stripping the paint). To me they are of interest because they are odd ball items, and were not made specifically as collectors items.

Were any of the postwar diesel engines made out of clear plastic and then painted?

aussteve posted:

Were any of the postwar diesel engines made out of clear plastic and then painted?

I have seen Lionel whistle chambers, caboose,gondola, tank and boxcars molded in clear plastic. I have not seen any postwar Lionel diesel shells. Also the LW handle should be molded in clear plastic and painted black on the outside. (Recent reproductions are molded in black plastic and therefore do not light the dial properly.)

According to an interview with Maury Romer (American Flyer) that I read many years ago, they would occasionally run clear plastic through their molds so they could study how the plastic flowed. I guess they could see flow lines in the clear plastic.

American Model Toys molded some of their shells in clear plastic. They would mask off the windows and then paint the shell.

The folks reproducing helicopters molded some of them in clear plastic.
They might have done boats in clear too, I am not sure on this.
They did make a boat in green that even had a green windshield instead of clear.

Both 6026 and 2761/2046 reproduction tender shells have been sold in clear plastic. I don't think these shells are lettered, not positive.

There are several sets currently available on the bay.  I have ZERO interest in these things.

As C.SAM said, pure novelty.

These are definitely collector toys, not model trains - - Clear prototype?

prrjim posted:

These are definitely collector toys, not model trains - - Clear prototype?

They are all toys, regardless of whether there is a prototype. My recommendation: buy what you like and can afford. Don't expect your purchases to have any resale value.

It has occurred to me that my comment above was too negative.    There is nothing wrong with being a collector.    A lot of people are, probably more that model Railroaders.     I hope I did not offend anyone.

They would be more interesting if they had flashing lights inside showing I dont know current flow.

prrjim posted:

It has occurred to me that my comment above was too negative.    There is nothing wrong with being a collector.    A lot of people are, probably more that model Railroaders.     I hope I did not offend anyone.

Your response sounded fine to me.  Ive never seen any transparent railroad engines in real life.  But then Ive never seen a giraffe or rhino car on the railroad either

AlanRail posted:

They would be more interesting if they had flashing lights inside showing I dont know current flow.

I  agree.  I have a USB charging cable for my phone which has leds in it that imitate the flow of electrons to the phone.  Fast flow down to a crawl as the phone gets near 100%.  It would be cool to have that wire in a transparent engine shell.

SantaFeJim posted:

There are several sets currently available on the bay.  I have ZERO interest in these things.

As C.SAM said, pure novelty.

I’ll buy them all lol

C W Burfle posted:

prrjim posted:

These are definitely collector toys, not model trains - - Clear prototype?

They are all toys, regardless of whether there is a prototype. My recommendation: buy what you like and can afford. Don't expect your purchases to have any resale value.

Sounds good.   Got any that are cheap lol

PostwarKID posted:

SantaFeJim posted:

There are several sets currently available on the bay.  I have ZERO interest in these things.

As C.SAM said, pure novelty.

I’ll buy them all lol

The clear items that I saw were a relatively recent full production items. Are you into them?

aussteve posted:

prrjim posted:

It has occurred to me that my comment above was too negative.    There is nothing wrong with being a collector.    A lot of people are, probably more that model Railroaders.     I hope I did not offend anyone.

Your response sounded fine to me.  Ive never seen any transparent railroad engines in real life.  But then Ive never seen a giraffe or rhino car on the railroad either

 

I haven't seen any trains collecting power to run from an inside center third rail. Or with the deep flanges most toy trains have.

I have a set of the Lionel cars, A-A and 3 Madison cars.  They are command ready.  They have been on a display shelf  for a long time.

People always ask about them.

Norm

Norm posted:

I have a set of the Lionel cars, A-A and 3 Madison cars.  They are command ready.  They have been on a display shelf  for a long time.

People always ask about them.

Norm

Platinum ghost set?

Yes---I forgot their name.  

 Interesting post. With 30 replies there is yet to be a picture of a clear F3 ABA . Doesn’t someone have a picture they could post?

Jim 

anybody able to snag the mth clear gp30 from 1995 looking pics and catalog number

O Gauge Jim posted:

 Interesting post. With 30 replies there is yet to be a picture of a clear F3 ABA . Doesn’t someone have a picture they could post?

Jim 

Can't be photographed... because they're, well... clear!

Rusty

PostwarKID posted:

Thanks, nice capture. Are the MTH units their scale pieces or the RailKing line?

Hi. I have both the GP9 at the right price I would consider letting it go

Ive changed the battery to a BCR

I also have the MTH RailKing GP 20 clear shell.  

Ok, call me insane.. but I love to collect the clear shell locos!   From what I know, there were no generally available Clear Shell production locos released until the Platinum Ghost.  (upper shelf, far right)  There are "preproduction/prototype/test" shells that made it out of the factories - "lunch box specials." ;-)  (I would bet there are many more out there, I was fortunate to find and obtain a few.)  The 4 (upper shelf, from the left) F3 shells are from the 1990's and each has unique differences in their molds such as nose vents, vertical lines low along the sides, mounting tabs for antenna, crew cab, roof fan volume mount, etc...  All have Lionel Chesterfield or Mt. Clemens stamped inside the rear roof.   On the bottom shelf (L to R) is a Lionel GP20, Williams F7, Lionel SD60M,  MTH GP9 and MTH GP30.  As I understand it, the MTH Clear Shells were a limited run and only sold to dealers as part of a promotion display.   My prize clear shell is a genuine 1948 Lionel F3 Salesman Sample.

I have an entire clear train somewhere in my catacombs. Some of the postwar freight cars were cast in clear plastic and then painted. The two dome tank car is often made with clear plastic and the silver paint strips very easily.

Clear is cool.  William did mold some clear F7 shells.  He did not do the AA's.  They were for someone else.  He did not do ABA's because at the time he did not have a 'B' Unit mold.  The B&A F7 AA is Williams.  The powered 'B' in the MTH ABBA appears to be someone having fun over at MTH.  I picked the powered unit up from Perry.  The camera is not really a train but it is clear.

The long traveled Williams clear shell F7 AA arrived today after traveling from Canada to Texas twice.