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My layout is wired for Legacy with 2 power blocks.  Each block is powered with a separate PH-180 feeding a TPC 400 which is connected to a PSX=AC circuit breaker and then to the track.  Both blocks share a common ground or return.  Both command and conventional engines run fine within the blocks, but short out when crossing the middle rail gap between blocks.  Both PH-180s are in phase as they have polarized plugs.  I have checked and re-checked my wiring, and don't see where I have crossed power and ground connections.  The PSX breakers are set to trip at 8 amps.  Both TPCs are set for full voltage.

 

I believe I read somewhere that a common ground is OK with multiple TPCs.  The PSXs try to reset after the short, but then re-short again.  Could these be the problem?  Any advice is appreciated, as usual.

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 Did it ever run right with this setup ?  I'm guessing you are talking about one loop divided into 2 blocks. Each fed by a separate power supply and breaker. Can you eliminate one power supply and breaker setup and run the entire loop off of one setup. You should easily have enough power with a 180 to power one train around the loop. See if the problem goes away or is still there.

 If not one long loop. Are you talking two separate loops connected by a crossover and this is where the short occurs ?

 Just trying to determine your setup. Often times you have to rule out what it isn't. In order to find the problem.

 

Originally Posted by Dave_C:

 Did it ever run right with this setup ?  I'm guessing you are talking about one loop divided into 2 blocks. Each fed by a separate power supply and breaker. Can you eliminate one power supply and breaker setup and run the entire loop off of one setup. You should easily have enough power with a 180 to power one train around the loop. See if the problem goes away or is still there.

 If not one long loop. Are you talking two separate loops connected by a crossover and this is where the short occurs ?

 Just trying to determine your setup. Often times you have to rule out what it isn't. In order to find the problem.

 

I think he described the problem area - at the gap [middle rail] between two blocks.

 

If all engines have this problem would point to the transformers being out of phase

 

If the two PH180s are plugged into different wall sockets, there is a good chance that they are on different legs of house power. Put the volt meter leads on the center rails at the block joint and you should get a zero volt indication when they are in phase. You could read as much as 36-40 volts if they are out of phase.

As usual, you guys know what you are talking about.  I didn't have bulbs readily available, but, when I hooked up the multimeter across the gap with the power set at 10 volts, I got a reading of 20 volts.  So, it must be a phasing problem.  I don't understand how that can happen with polarized plugs on the bricks and both bricks plugged in to the same house circuit.  Do I have to change the plug on one of the PH-180s?

The black wire coming out of the powerhouse brick is the hot. The white is neutral. Follows house wiring. The A and U from the TPC to the PSX-AC and then to the track is whichever colors you choose.

 

 

When you say the same house circuit that the power houses are plugged into, is it the same receptacle or power strip in one receptacle? What junkman said.

There is also the possibility your plugs, or even the house's wires, are not correct.

 

 If you are stepping down high voltage to get at 120v, there are also situations that require a properly staggered breaker box positions on each line used.

Way to deep and somewhat beyond me to be explained well here.

 

 Not extremely related here, but things like staggering, and whether you come off a wye or delta feed, can make a difference on the performance of modern electronics on occasion too. No manufacturer of anything can know when, or where this might occur, but it does.

Well, thanks to your help, the problem has been identified, and, hopefully, is fixable.  I bought one of the PH-180s on E-Bay as a used item (could not find one in the stores at the time.)  When CAPPilot mentioned something about the bricks that were "wired wrong," it rang a bell.  I recalled a note included in the box about a run of PowerHouses that were not in phase.  When I checked, sure enough I have one of the bad items.

 

The note referred to an available Phase Adapter, but this problem occurred years ago and I would doubt that one of these gadgets is still available.  So, I guess I will resort to Gunrunner's approach and file off the wider blade so that I can reverse the plug's orientation in the power strip.  If this works, I will replace the plug on the offending PH-180.  If not, it may be easiest to just buy a new brick, whenever they become available again.

 

So, once again, thanks for all the help.  But, Dave C, you have me worried that I will be facing another problem down the road.  My next track extension will add a third power block connected to the existing layout via a #4 RCS crossover switch.  Will that cause another phasing problem?

I had a pair of the 2000 48 first issue of the 180 PoHos that were out of phase with most O-Gauge transformers. Gunrunner john offers the simple,easy solution by filing the wide blade for rotation in the receptacle. [Lionel originally offered an adapter for the secondary side but that was too temporary for my druthers].

 

I opted to open the unit and change the primary conductors by cutting the wires beyond the stress knot inside the case enabling a switch of the 120 VAC hot and neutral conductors. I slipped on two sizes of shrink tubing before soldering the exchanged conductors, added some plastic tape on the wound and closed up. You need to modify a blade screwdriver by filing a slot in the center of the blade in order to remove the case's screws under the rubber feet.

Last edited by Dewey Trogdon

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