ERR Cruise Cmdr M in a K-Line E-8?

Cruise Ms are about 1/10th" longer than a DCDR. Most times you can get them to fit with little problem. I'd suggest removing the shell as see how much room you have. There should be plenty of room in an E8. I just installed one is a much smaller K-Line RS-3.

Pete

Weaver E8 with EOB.  I moved the cylindrical weight forward.

Cruise M will overheat if you try to run 4 motors with it.  The "regular" Cruise Commander can handle 4 motors (as could EOB).

The EOB systems were designed to handle (4) motors.  I opted for two complete EOB upgrades in the AA Weaver set. Then combined the two units as an AA consist.  The only item that required change of wiring was bidirectional/bicolor LED's powered via the smoke unit terminals on the EOB board in the A unit running backwards.  One of the better eye catchers where ever it goes.

I knew I should've asked before I made the purchase.  Well, I am still wanting to convert a MTH premier PS1 steam locomotive over to TMCC.  If I bought their ERR Commander Kit, could I use this Cruise Commander M with that?

Thanks!

The Cruise M is designed to work in a engine that already has Lionels Modular TMCC. Your best bet is to used the Cruise Commander in the MTH engine. I am surprised the Cruise M would overheat in an engine that already has a DCDR driving 4 motors. I just assumed they used the same triacs or at least triacs with the same current rating. I will have look closer next time.

Pete

I took the shell off and I don't understand why the Cruise Cmdr M won't work.  It is the same size as the one currently in it.  It looks like it is a simple install.

The issue is the Cruise M's ability to handle 4 motors.  Is your E8 an AA set with both units powered?  If so it may be too much for the M to handle.

One option is to remove the tether and install a regular Cruise Commander in the slave A unit (in addition to the M in the master).  That's what I did with my K-line F-3 set.

Both units are motorized.  I don't understand how to install a cruise commander in the slave unit, since all the wires to the motors are coming by tether from the master unit.  Once a cruise commander is added to the slave unit, wouldn't that make it an independently controlled locomotive?  If so, I might as well add sound to be completely realistic.

I decided for now to leave it alone and return the Commander M.  I will instead purchase a Cruise Commander Kit and Railsounds to convert my MTH Crescent Limited to TMCC.  I wish I would have never bought a locomotive with cruise in it, I want all of my locomotives to have it now.  Thank y'all for all your help and suggestions.  

Yes, you remove all the tethering and you wind up with an independently controlled engine.  You can MU that engine with the original master, which of course retains its sounds. 

A simple fix is to install the cruise M and wire the motors of each unit in series. The top speed will be drastically reduced and the speed steps will be a little odd if you are used to ERR cruise. But it should work.

I believe the real issue with the Cruise Commander M and four motors is the issues of sensing the back-EMF properly to do the speed control.  Perhaps Jon Z. will drop in and give us the official word.

 John,

  That's the reason Jon gave before if I remmeber correctly.

Bill

I believe the real issue with the Cruise Commander M and four motors is the issues of sensing the back-EMF properly to do the speed control.  Perhaps Jon Z. will drop in and give us the official word.

The data points that I can provide are:

1) Cruise M installed in MTH F-3 AA (installed with transplanted K-Line guts from an RS-3) and 4 motors wired in parallel.  Cruise M ran hot (heat sink very hot to the touch) after a few minutes and would shut down after 15 minutes or so.  After cooling, would run again for a while.  When running, cruise functioned well.

2) Cruise M/K-Line stuff removed from MTH F-3 and replaced with regular Cruise Commander and Digital Dynamics RailSounds boards.  Performance is excellent with 4 motors in parallel and no overheating.

3) Regular Cruise Commanders also regularly running in MTH Centipedes (4 motors), MTH Sharks (4 motors) and an Atlas RS-1 pair (4 motors) with great performance and no overheating.  Speed control in all cases is smooth and steady.

As I recall, he stated that the stand-alone Cruise Commander would have similar issues.  It's not that it doesn't work, it's just that the cruise performance is not as good as with one or two motors.

FWIW, I have a Cruise Commander M in a K-Line E8 A-A set with both powered.  They seemed to run well, and would pull the five 18" passenger cars I had at the time.  I'll have to do some extended running with it and see if it has issues with a longer passenger car and grades.  I think one of the issues of overheating is proper heatsinking, I have a large heatsink on the CCM with a good bond to the chassis.  I also properly installed the heatsink with thermal compound.

My first ever TMCC upgrade involved installing a Digital Dynamics standard board in a Williams F3. Initially only one A unit was powered and was pulling a dummy A, dummy B and  10 15" aluminum cars.

I installed a small 12 volt DC fan from a computer video card. This train would run for over three hours on the club layout with no problems.

I would suggest a fan before going though the hassle of getting two Cruise Commanders.

These fans don't draw much more current than a smoke unit so a simple diode and regulator would suffice to power it.

Pete

Actually, a fan suitable for the task should draw far less than a smoke unit I would imagine.  A 30mm computer fan would probably be ideal, attached directly to the heatsink.