Interaction of Lionel CW80 Transformer and Lionel TMCC CAB-1/Base and Lionel Legacy CAB-2 Base

1. Confused about which loco/engine you're trying to run on the simple loop - the DC motor conventional or the Harry Potter ?

2. Is the main layout electronically connected to the simple loop - if so, TMCC/Legacy requires about 18acv to operate; that's too much for conventional operation.

3. If the main layout and simple loop are electronically connected, why do you need the CW-80 ?  What transformer powers the main ?

Johnny,

My suggestions:

1.) Set the conventional loco (Hogwart's) aside for the time being.

2.) Treat the whole layout as one.  (I realize that this is stretching things a bit, but if you push the CW's throttle to max then all tracks are identical, i.e., all are powered at 18 VAC.)

3.) Try to run a TMCC or Legacy loco into the loop powered by the CW, entering it from the other (TMCC/Legacy) section.  Does the loco run smoothly as it enters?  Can you run it smoothly around the loop once it gets in?   You should be able to do this because the ground rails should carry the TMCC/Legacy signal into the loop allowing it to be used for TMCC/Legacy, even though you may not have intended to use it that way.  With the CW at 100% throttle your TMCC/Legacy loco, command-wise, won't know the difference.  If it's not smooth you likely have a power problem in the loop, perhaps poor track section-to-track section tightness, or dirty track, etc.

Mike

First off, lest anyone thinks I forget, THANK YOU to Richie C and Mellow Hudson Mike for responding to my post!

Before I answer your questions, let me give you a further observation/experiment I did.

In my original post, I said I had not wired the Remote Controller to the O36 FastTrack switch (6-81947) that allows the turnout from my main layout into the simple O36 (read FasTrack supplied with the Harry Potter Hogwart's Express set) loop. Well, I didn't wire it to the controller (ran out of multi-conductor cable...) but did strip the ends and tried connecting the thru or turnout leads, in sequence, to the ground lead from the switch.

Snapping to the turnout position (desired normal operating position in this layout) for the O36 was OK, but for the thru position, the switch sat there chattering away, i.e. the swivel rail was vibrating, the lantern kind of dancing, and the switch itself making motor noises (as if not decided which way to go). The TMCC/Legacy control did not work at all!

Climbing up (no scenery yet applied to layout, thank goodness), I unscrewed several pieces of FasTrack around the switch and pulled it out.

Taking it to the workshop (edge of the layout), I opened up the metal plate bottom. First thing I noticed was some type of residue or waxy, burned looking stuff near a corner. Operating the switch by the attached cable, again same thing, turnout OK, thru chattering away. I reset the mounting of the little DC switch motor inside, thinking the arc of plastic actually throwing the switch was off by a tooth or two, but no difference. Pulling out the connector cables from the limit switches to the control board only allowed operation in the direction where there was still a limit switch attached, and that was still flawed for the thru (striaght) position. Finally, I pulled out the cable to the TMCC radio board. Well, I tried gently to pull it out, wouldn't give. More or less yanking the cable out, I tried operation and the switch worked perfectly! No chattering on the thru position. Snapped back and forth OK.

Looking at the TMCC radio board, I saw I had damaged the connector that its cable plugged into. OK, Careless Me (again!). But, examination with a magnifying glass of the connector and the board, and the cable end showed they had melted together! What!?

Yes, the discrete plastic encased transistor nearest the connector socket and board end did not look good. More magnifying glass looking at the board showed what appeared to be small holes blown thru the transistor case in the direction of the cable socket. The socket connecter and Cable end were melted in that area. The underside of the board looked somewhat toasted in that area.

OK, onto the Lionel web page to find parts replacement. Couldn't find 691-FTSW-B00 ! The TMCC radio board for a FasTrack switch. Searching this site, I found a post about adding TMCC to an old manual switch. A few replies further showed 691-FTSW-B01 was the number. I ordered two!

So, awaiting the part to fix the switch.

Meanwhile, back to the flickering Hogwart's coach light when the TMCC/Legacy electronics are on and the Hogwart's is CW80 powered. With that bad TMCC radio board O36 switch physically taken out (Watch Out! Tracks Out Ahead!), the coach and locomotive lights still flickered, but the Hogwart's Castle loco ran back and forth between whatever track there was when using the CW80. When using a post war ZW, there was no coach light flickering, but the loco headlight was not always working (it did using the CW80).

So, there is definitely some TMCC/Legacy "radio" interaction with the CW80.

The flickering might be nice... Don't recall from the movie(s), but how where the Hogwart's Express coaches lit? Was it gas? Candles?

If, dear reader you have followed this far... (thank you)

RichieC: 1) the DC motor loco I referred to is the loco from the Hogwart's Express set; 2) the spur turnout into the Hogwart's set loop is physically connected, but the power isolated by pulling the center rail jumper off the O72 turnout from the main layout into the simple loop. Yes, the 18VAC would probably send Harry, Hermione, and Ron flying, so I try to run the main layout on 14-16VAC; 3) the CW80 powers the center rail electrically isolated Hogwart's loop, and post war ZWs power the main layout.

Richie C., hope that answers your questions, and Thank You once more.

Mellow Hudson Mike, I will try running another conventional loco, and a TMCC loco into the Hogwart's loop once I get the O36 switch into it repaired and installed back into the layout. The Hogwart's curves are O36 and I have a loco to fit that. Thank You once more.

Til next time...

A couple of quick comments:

1. I would not use the flickering lights in a passenger car as the sole diagnostic tool indicating anything necessarily wrong with your layout wiring, especially if the lights are not LED's and do not have a capacitor. Better to use a multi-meter or DVM to check voltage all along your layout. Passenger car lights are notorious for flickering even on layouts with good wiring.

2. If the CW-80 strictly powers the simple loop for conventional running (which you seem to indicate is true), then I would use pins to also isolate the outside rails to that loop; disconnect the CW-80 from the common bus wire (no need to phase it); and just connect both track power output terminals of it directly to the simple loop and see if that helps. If necessary, you can run additional drops from the CW-80 to the simple loop track.