Legacy engine responding to another engines command

Try changing both of their TMCC addresses, making sure they don't overlap.

What Legacy ID are you giving each engine when programming?

Are they assigned to a TRain?

The 1931190 is ID 4 the one that is having the problems is ID 6.  The other AA unit that does not have problems is ID 7.  I will change 6 & 7 and see if that fixes it.  When i run the two AA as a train, the same thing happens to the one AA, #6 but not #6.  When i was doing my test today, i was not running the two AA together as a train, just individually.

Have you tried clearing the lash-up to see if that helps?

@Tony H posted:

The 1931190 is ID 4 the one that is having the problems is ID 6.  The other AA unit that does not have problems is ID 7.  I will change 6 & 7 and see if that fixes it.  When i run the two AA as a train, the same thing happens to the one AA, #6 but not #6.  When i was doing my test today, i was not running the two AA together as a train, just individually.

Im pretty sure that the newer AA sets with Legacy are supposed to be programmed with the same ID #.  I seem to recall Dave at Lionel mentioning this in one of his latest videos.  The boards in the AA sets are setup to automatically change motor direction for the trailing A unit.  

Program the AA set as ENG 6, then see if the problem persists. 

Also, make sure to check that those engines are not assigned to a TRain.

John, I remove the lash up and see if that does anything.

Dave, I will see if I can program both as one engine.  They are programmed individually and as a train as well.

This will be a tomorrow project.

@DaveSlie posted:

Im pretty sure that the newer AA sets with Legacy are supposed to be programmed with the same ID #.  I seem to recall Dave at Lionel mentioning this in one of his latest videos.  The boards in the AA sets are setup to automatically change motor direction for the trailing A unit.

That's true, however if you want to use something like the SS Diner with them and use the Train-Link feature, you still need to make a consist. In any case, they should work in an MU or individually.

Ok, I deleted/cleared the lash up, I did the same with the AA units.  I gave the AA units a new engine ID 11.  To test I ran the one AA unit that gave me problems with the other engine whose commands were being received by the AA unit and the same issue, possibly not as often.  When I hit the direction button on the legacy controller for the one engine the AA unit will sometimes respond to it.  I will put both AA units on the track as see if the both respond to the wrong engine’s commands.  One other thing, when I go back to start the AA unit that stopped, it remembers the speed it was at before it stopped and when I turn the dial it does not go backwards, it goes forward at the old speed and the same direction it was going before it stopped.

I think you need to start eliminating variables.  Can you take these to a different layout and see if it's the engines or the command system?

John, I don’t know of anyone local that has a layout, I am sure there are, I am 20 miles west of Chicago.

To test, I put both AA units on the track to see and the one AA unit stopped and the other did not when I addressed the other engine.  I had to stop the AA that was still moving, but when I started the AA pair up, they were still going forward, where you would think the would go backwards since they stopped and they should have cycled direction.  

I will try another TMCC engine with the AA units and see if i get the same problem.

I addressed an engine that is not even powered up, hit the direction button a few times and the one AA stopped.

I addressed that same engine that is not powered up with the other, non AA, engine running and no issues.  I will probably reach out to Muffins on Monday.  Since it was a custom run, we will see, might have to go back to Lionel.  Could be the command system, but everything else the Legacy system controls has no issues.

Or i just don’t run those two at the same time, not ideal.

One other twist, just running the AA units and a LionChief+ unit, i also have the LCS system, went to throw a switch with my remote, the problem AA unit stoped, the other AA unit kept going.   Was able to duplicate this again with no other train running.  This switch issue also happened when i used my iPad to throw the switch.  Different switches as well, not the same one.

The switches are all Ross and the switch machines are all 2500.

John would your guess be engine or command setup, knowing it would only be a guess.

Don't know, but I'm thinking the way to isolate this is to simplify the configuration and debug one piece at a time.  A loop of the track on the floor with just the problem engines and Legacy base would be a start.

Your description of the layout with Legacy and LCS indicates all the other command components work OK, so the Legacy base appears to be transmitting valid commands.

As GRJ recommended, setup a test track or loop and connect the Legacy ground wire directly to the test track.  If you have the LCS WiFi and can connect to it with a Windows PC, download and run the LCS WiFi Monitor.  You can observe the commands transmitted by the Legacy Base.  (Note that this captures the commands the base sends out the serial port - but the base transmits OK to other components).  If the engines respond incorrectly to commands addressed to them, back they go.

@Tony H posted:

I addressed that same engine that is not powered up with the other, non AA, engine running and no issues.  I will probably reach out to Muffins on Monday.  Since it was a custom run, we will see, might have to go back to Lionel.  Could be the command system, but everything else the Legacy system controls has no issues.

Doubt the special run has anything to do with it, that is just other decorating added on to the standard production run.

@DaveSlie posted:

I'm pretty sure that the newer AA sets with Legacy are supposed to be programmed with the same ID #.  I seem to recall Dave at Lionel mentioning this in one of his latest videos.  The boards in the AA sets are setup to automatically change motor direction for the trailing A unit.  

Program the AA set as ENG 6, then see if the problem persists.

Also, make sure to check that those engines are not assigned to a TRain.

That is correct about the Legacy A-A units, including the newest ones with both units powered, although annoyingly you won't find it in their manuals. I've avoided putting the ones I have in a lash-up or Train because of finding in the past that such settings are "sticky" in the sense that they are not easy to delete. On the other hand, lash-up settings in TMCC engines don't seem to stick reliably or at least not when set up with a CAB-2. I don't understand why but it appears to be other people's experience too.

Ok, well back to the drawing board.  I put the one AA, the one that had issues on my layout, on a test track, 16 foot of straight track, I don't have any leftover curves, and I could not duplicate the problem it never stopped.  I only had a KW transformer and the legacy base hooked up to the track.  I will go back to my layout and not power up the LCS items and remove the legacy booster and see if that does anything.  My Legacy based is plugged into a three prong wall outlet via an extension cord, not a power strip. 

I am wired for DCS, so power goes from transformers to TIU to distribution blocks to the tracks. I can't imagine this should cause any issues. 

Do you have the amplitude adjustment feature on the TMCC Booster?  If not, you might consider adding that.

Yes I do, do you think I would need to turn it down, CCW or up, CW.

Tony

Start all the way CCW and see how that works.

Tried the problem AA on my layout with no LCS items powered up or plugged in, the booster not connected or plugged in, same issue, it will sometimes stop when I address another engine via the Legacy remote.  Might try the test track again.  Not sure what else to disconnect from my main layout.  I unplugged the other three transformers.  The engine in question is running on a ZWL.  Could adding the booster back on help?  My fear is that if i send it back to Lionel they might not be able to duplicate the problem. Is there a board that I could “resit”

Ok, I might have found the issue.

Ok, put it on rollers powered by a Z4000 no issues.  The test track was a KW with no problems.  Moved it to tracks powered by a PW ZW no problem.  Only has problems when it is on a track powered by the ZWL.  Still don’t have the booster or the LCS items powered back in.    I have 6 main tracks, the ZWL, ZW and Z4000 all have two tracks.  They are all wired the same, transformer to circuit breaker to tiu to blocks.  

I would have thought the ZWL would be the best of the bunch. I am using the other two post on the ZWL for accessories, can’t think that would be an issue, but i might look there.  Any thing else to look for on the ZWL.

Tony

Connected everything back, LCS components and the booster ran fine on all the transformers except the ZWL, both AU and DU, no idea.  Fine for now, it just can’t run on my two most outside loops, but can run on the others, maybe some day I will dig into it more.