Looking for drover caboose information

T4TT posted:

After a bit of web browsing decided to ask here for info and pics of UP or ATSF drover caboose.  I am not aware of an o scale drover and would like to build my own. Any info will be appreciated. Thanks. 

Kevin

A believe both roads had "side door" cabooses, however whether those were truly for "drover" use, I'm not sure. The CB&Q had a good size "fleet" of coach-caboose cars, and LaBelle Woodworking offers an EXCELLENT wood kit for one style of those CB&Q cars.

Are you looking for something along these lines?

Hallmark made a couple of different O scale brass ATSF drover's cabooses that ONCE were found cheaply and commonly in shows. The one l picture did not have a cupola. l think there is a similar ATSF version with a side door. Hallmark also made a commonly found T&P "muley" side door in brass, and 3rd Rail did a UP CA-1 side door in red and yellow. These are not "drover" cabooses, but the ATSF versions are.  The Burlington and the MoPac are the two roads that had a wild and interesting variety of side door, combine, and drover cabeese. Many shortlines in the south were also independent and creative.

I want a car for the cow hands in my cattle car train. I think the UP used a combine passenger car until the mid 20s. I think after that they used drover caboose.  

If I use a 60' combine I am guessing that would go behind the tender ahead of cattle car....i wouldn't want to be downwind! 

Thanks!

mwb posted:

Are you looking for something along these lines?

REALLY NICE!

Did that start off as a kit? Thanks.

Commonly found O scale side door kit is the Bob Peare "Traincraft" #500. (not that above) That series has a kit #506, that is a "NYC Riders Car", NYC terminology for a drovers caboose.  It is a long multiwindow caboose with no cupola similar to one of the ATSF's.  I was surprised the NYC needed a drovers caboose.

Matt01 posted:

mwb posted:

Are you looking for something along these lines?

REALLY NICE!

Did that start off as a kit? Thanks.

I did not think so and I actually have a 2nd one that is nearly identical, but after consultation with "experts", there is some belief that there was a kit available albeit transiently from someone, some time ago.

I've also scratchbuilt 2 others.....

If there is a kit for that CVRR caboose, l'd like to know more about it.  There are a couple of mystery caboose kits including a MoPac drovers and a MoPac side door in my favorite wish book, the 1940 Vandenboom catalog.  Wonder if any of those kits were sold?

 

The Santa Fe had four of them. Two that I know of survive -- one at the Orange Empire Railway Museum (918D in wood) and the other at the Mojave Museum (D932 in steel). Hallmark/Ajin produced D932 in O scale and a 2312 "Mixed Train Caboose" (what at least one was modified into) in brass. They both show up on eBay from time to time.

Operationally, my understanding is that the drover cars rode ahead of the livestock cars (sure hope the caboose was up front, too). Drovers rode in the cars during livestock moves, but rode back in regular passenger service after the cattle arrived at the stockyards while the cars returned as part of regular freight movements for the return trip. My understanding is that cattle cars remained in service until the early 1970's but were supplanted by trucks and more widely distributed meat processing.

I still need to paint the Drover car and do some work on the mixed train caboose. I'm not 100% sure on 2312's fate. As for color, For the paint color, the combination (Floquil and possibly ScaleCoat) is 3 parts caboose red; 2 parts tuscan red; 1 part reefer yellow. The roof should be black. My ultimate plan is to paint my unpainted Drover car and strip/repaint the mixed-train car and make interiors for both.

I don't know if UP had drover cars, but it would not surprise me given they did a number of livestock moves. I also have photos and drawings of a Chicago & Northwestern drover car #10802 which was restored. CNW's were built on modified caboose frames -- first from wood, then from steel. Hopefully I can catch Malcolm at a slow point and have him build one for me.

ATSF Drover Cars -- the Models

The Prototypes

CNW Drover Caboose -- the surviving prototype

The O scale model

Good synopsis, Matt. The CNW drovers cars were of the same design as their "waycars", just a bit more length and w/o a cupola. The one in North Freedom's Mid Continent Ry Museum is a marvelous example. The Burlington, to the best of my knowledge, never used a "waycar" for drover service. Rather a handful of decrepit coaches were kept on hand for that service. Have always gotten a kick out of the reason for drovers' cars........the railroaders didn't want the cowboys accompanying livestock shipments in their cabooses, because they stank too badly !!

Colorado HiRailer...that 1940 Vandenboom catalog is my favorite wish book also.  (Along with similar vintage Walthers catalogs).

How nice it would be to be able to place an order for some of the great things included in them.   And I'm glad to see I'm not the only person who remembers Bob Peare.  

A lot of people would be amazed how much was available in O scale and Hi-Rail just prior to WWII.   (Much of which didn't come back on the market after the war).  I don't think Vandenboom's hobby department survived the hostilities.  Do you know?

Memories are some of the good things about growing older.   We old timers  gotta make sure someone remembers.

                                                                                                                                      Logan

Guess I'm seeping into the "old-timer" category, but I remember Paul Larsen, editor of Model Railroader Magazine, 1955-1961, mentioning the "old Vandenboom Hobby Shop in Kansas City", in a  profile of Harold "The Beard" Schopp, who did a nice write-up and plans for a MoPac coal dock in central MO. That was about 1959, w/o digging up the article. Paul and Harold used to hang out there.

Schopp and Larsen are recognized MR names..l know nothing about Vandenboom other than their green catalog, understood shop was long gone, and have no kit or anything else boxed with their label. That catalog lists dozens of billboard reefer kits in O, OO, and HO, and l wonder if Atlas has done them all?  It offers kits for several other unusual cars and a C&O K3A Mikado, none ever offered in three rail. In today's world in which our truck supply has dried up, V.B. shows 34 types available.  I do have and have built Train Craft (Bob Peare) and Walthers kits, and am researching what prairie road:  RI, MP, Q, or C&S gas electric, last preferred, is closest to the Walthers kit for a C&NW gas electric. EMC built a hundred or more similar gas electrics that used either St. Louis or Pullman bodies. These are the longer cars. St. Louis also built a lot of almost identical shorter gas electrics for a lot of roads, that can be modeled with the American Standard Car Co. kit.  In some ways, Vandenboom was "the good old days".

There is one near Rapid City, SD (Hill City) on the "1880 Train" that you can go visit and check out.  Often you can even ride it.

https://www.1880train.com/roll...ock-restoration.html

 

Kent in SD

You can ride two different two foot Maine combine cabooses in Portland, and Boothbay, but they are not drovers. They are handier to population centers. You can ride in those cupolas.  In addition to Hill City, l wonder if there are any other drovers cabooses you can ride...at Ill. or Wisc. RR museums, etc.?

I was in Kanarado this afternoon, cruisin' main street ya know, and saw this one behind a chain link fence at a small museum. Museum wasn't open but was able to walk around the side and get a shot of this drover's caboose. According to a sign I could see through the fence, it was dated 1913. Don't know how accurate that info is. Thought you guys might enjoy looking at it.

Never posted a pic to this site before, so we will see how this goes.

 

That Kanarado side door looks like one of the many varieties of MoPac side doors.

Oops..did not enlarge photo enough...that is a RI caboose..l'd like a model of it.

Here is a link to a much better photo taken 10 years ago - paint was much fresher back then: http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=976944

I also noticed that it had "rpkd oil" in 1972. I didn't know that they were still using these things at that late of a date but they were apparently still doing some maintenance on it.

The Rock Island side door caboose could be modeled employing a San Juan Car Co D&RGW std gauge boxcar,   albeit with a fair amount of surgery.  Neat car !   The 1913 built date would be for the donor box car.