Making White Decals With A Printer ?

Cant be done. You need an ALPS.

Buy white Decal paper and reverse the print.

Scott Smith

I recently purchased some ink jet decals that were done on clear, and didn't really like the results. The color density is not heavy enough, so when they are applied to anything but a very light colored car, they just look muddy and dull.

If I was to make my own, I would only use white decal film as a base, and try to set the background as close to the car color as possible.

Didn't the Alps do gold and silver as well as white?

Alps supported metallic colors.  The technology is used in some dvd label printers.

Thanks Chuck. The loss of the Alps was really a blow to DIY creative printing. I do hope someone picks that ball back up and runs with it. I'd seriously consider getting one.

I have, on a couple of occasions, printed a decal with clear letters printed to be ironed-on & the background color-matched to the car body.  Then I  painted a white  under- coat where the decal went

.  I did that using Papiilio rub-on transfer film & adhesive. The white shows through the clear letters.  The problem is that the method uses up lots of ink geting the color match.

Yes.....The ALPS printer prints White, Metallic Silver, Metallic Gold, Metallic Cyan, Metallic Red, Mirror finish silver and mirror finish Gold along with the full CMYK spectrum. They are the most versital printers in the world. And if you could get some Kodak ink, which was ALPS under license to Kodak, you could print some neon colors as well. OKI also made ALPS clones.

The only time I ever see ink jet decals on clear film work well is on a bright white surface and even then just OK.

Decal art is also vital to making decals. That's part of what I do in the pplastic kit hobby.

Your better off using the ink manufactured but the same company as the printer. I had some cartridges refilled at a shop and the cartridges didn't make half the number of copies I get from HP cartridges. Also I was told if you use refilled cartridges it will void your warantee but not sure of that.

I have an ALPS MD-1000  (the base model), and the price of cartridges has skyrocketed.  The only place to repair them is in Japan, and that is also very expensive.  They are finicky too.  Still, I'm glad I have mine and I hope it lasts a while longer.  There are 2 Yahoo user groups for ALPS.

I haven't tried this yet but I found this site a while back that says they have the stuff to make white transfers:

http://www.pulsarprofx.com/dec...erview/Overview.html

You can get excellent results if you buy Coreldraw and practice drawing your own decals.  Then email it to a custom decal printing for about $30 per 8.5x11 page.  The results are just about as good as microscale decals. 

However, you will spend a lot of your time working with coreldraw and coming up to speed on how it works.  In short, there are no easy answers, but if you are willing to invest time and money you can get great looking white decals.

You'll have $200 into this before you produce a single decal.  Unless you're going to be doing a lot of them, it's probably a bit expensive for most folks.

I've heard so many horror stories about DecalPro that I am afraid to try. As long as my ALPS is going I'm not. If anyone here gets one I'd love to see a review.

John,

That's why I haven't bought the kit yet , but being choices are limited with no ALPs printers being available, it is an alternative.

Another alternative is to get Jerry Glow to make the decals you want:

http://home.comcast.net/%7Ejerryglow/decals.html

You may have to provide him with a photo or 2, but he's done great things for my Seaboard Air Line rolling stock.

White decals can only be printed by elves.

It seems.

I think I'd have them made unless I needed a ton of decals.

I have runs of 100 or more done at a screen printer and it is cost effective above 100.  For runs under 100 I use to have dry transfers made.....but that is becoming a lost art too.  And if you want 300+ I use a very good printer in Ohio I'll hook you up!!

My requirements are one or two of a specific decal, hardly a quantity buy.

Depending on what your image looks  like??

I had some lettering created on peel and stick vinyl decals.

Found the logo I wanted submitted it to a local vinyl decal company they cut out the images that I wanted in size I wanted and applied a backing trasfer sheet and just peeled off backing and with clear transfer sheet so you can see what you are doing layed the decal on and it sticks on. It is so thin you cannot see it unless under magnification and looked at from the edge.

Was about $20 for a whole sheet of the decals that I needed. With a light color like

White or yellow it covered a dark background color with no see through.

You have decal companies all over.

If you needed a mix of darker colors and white then you can print the darker colors yourself on a ink jet or laser printer and apply this layer the put the white decal over top with the cut outs to the colors below.

Your local decal company can do any image creation you want!

I printed Penn Central passenger car decals by setting up the fonts white with black background on white decal paper. The white letters will actually print clear and show from the white decal paper thru the black background. I would think you can get a printer that will actually print white but probably expensive. 

I tried the homemade decal thing using the testors decal set....it turned out ok. Black print on clear was fine and colors were only done over white decal paper. Though it took some time, I was able to make a colored background to match the paint of the model over a white decal paper- leaving white lettering...very time consuming! These were for my model cars. I did try a guy in canada who has a website for selling his decals...had him make my batmobile parachute pickup service decals...he did a very good job, but it wasn't cheap at $100 set up fee{which he knocked down alittle} and the actual decals at $50{I think}...this gave me all the A100 dodge vans used in the late '60s batman TV movies as well as gotham city police decals...hehehe...the things some of us build- huh? To buy something like this in quantity is far kinder on the wallet than individually, but as we all know, we all want different things.

Here's a link in case anyone's interested-

http://www.jbot.ca/space/batman.shtml

If you just want white logo's and lettering you MIGHT be able to use the laser printing foil method.  The printer/copier must use temperature pressure settings that are close to what the foil AND the decal paper use and the decals can only be white.  You are using the plastic bead/binder in the toner to fuse the foil to the decal paper.  To hot or too cold and you get a mess.

The foil itself isn't cheap and you need the right kind of printer so this is also a "cheap" route either.

Chuck....any details?? I have never heard of this method.....is this part of DecalPro???

This is actually older technology.  It predates color laser printing which is what most users wanted.  It is enjoying a resurgance in the fabric craft environment.  White film is available but not as popular in the U.S.  You need to use a laser printed document for the source and either a hot laminator or the laser printer to fuse the foil/film.

OK....so what is this method??? Does it have a name?? Thanks

Heat film.  You print your artwork out on a laserpriner.  The toner is bound to the paper by small plastic beads.  You place the foil/film over the paper and either run it back through the printer or a hot laminating machine.  The plastic binder for the toner melts and grabs the film/foil.  You peel away whatever didn't stick.  If you print on laser printer clear decal film and then film coat and then top coat with decal film (brush or spray) you shoul get a water slide decal.

After looking online about how an inkjet printer works and the problems associated with white inks, primarily they need to be shaken on a regular basis to keep the titanium dioxide suspended and that introduces bubbles which causes their own problems, it looks like unless I'm willing to spend big money on a commercial printer which can use white ink this is not going to be a do it yourself thing. I did find a few places that will print custom decals but again set up costs and minimum orders make it some what expensive but after spending $225 on a set of Lionel 2400 passenger cars and a 675 and tender in decent shape along with stripping and repainting them a set of decals for the set $150 doesn't seem out of line for a one of a kind, possibly 2 of a kind if I can fit all the decals on an 8.5x11 paper. Still would be nice if the white ink problem could be overcome to make it a DIY project.

HP does have a gray cartridge for printing BW photos but not sure how light of a gray it is or if it will fit the printer I have.

I did find one company that prints white invitations on black backgrounds but I haven't heard back from them yet.

Still looking if any companys local or in the US use or have these printers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd5yAG2c0d0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRh2Xa-v95Q

The FJ330HS printer here seems like the answer to our needs for white decals

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grB3sxxa7hk

The search goes on.

Jerry

That FJ330HS has a few issues that keep it from being a good solution. The liquid ink is heated for application.....being heated and liquid is fine for a mirror but I fear not good for decal paper. I feel your pain. If I didn't have access to a screen printer and my ALPS I'd be a frustrated modeler. 

Keep hunting.....

Try Ricky Rupp (rarupp@hotmail.com) from Modern Rails Decals. He uses an ALPS printer and can do white. His prices are very fair, and if you give him camera ready artwork correctly sized, the set up charges are minimal.

Jerry,

    Depending on what you want to print, engine numbers for example, you  could buy rubber stamps and water based white ink reasonably, of course you would have to do a number of them to make it worth it.

     On a related question for the owners of Alp's printers, what Operating System are you using. My MD 1000 won't run on anything but Windows 98, anything newer XP Vista etc. and it won't load the Alp's drivers, it want to use the Windows drivers which don't give me all the color and finish choices. Thanks

Regards,

Joe

Modeltrainparts, I think I'll give Ricky a try, thanks for the lead.

I originally stripped the trains in question to paint them red with black roofs but my grandson thought a purple Ravens train and an orange Orioles train would be cool so I thought why not? I've found the proper NFL fonts and MLB fonts along with the team logos so my that problem has been solved but printing on white paper with the coloring surrounding the white letters and matching the cars paint color around them seems like it's going to be a waste of a lot of decal paper trying to match the color, unless I get it right in the first couple tries. If I only needed white letters a stamp or dry transfers would work great but the jersey names and numbers are white with a gold border and the logos are a whole other story!

This is starting to become a major project but if things start to come together I'll keep you guys posted.

Jerry

Joe,  I am not sure ALPS ever updated the drivers as they left the market before they needed to. There is a ALPS user group on Yahoo groups that you might check with. I have not been on it in over a year so I don't know their currecnt status...but I think they had some fixes.

Joe, on the Yahoo Alps group they have a free XP driver for ALPS. Here's their site:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Alps/

Also, here is Ricky Rupp's website:   http://www.modernrails.com/index.html

It says he is currently on sick leave.

Dave and John,

     thanks for the help. I joined the Alps group but couldn't find a driver for the MD 1000, what they offered was Driver Detective, which I guess will update drivers already installed on my PC. I never could install the orginal drivers, had a Certificate error, even when I turned that function off. I was able to make a few decals when I first got the printer and was amazed at the results, would like to get into that again. I have plenty of the color cartridges including metallic gold and silver to last me a lifetime, and printer does work with Windows drivers, but the quality isn't there, ie does not allow for double striking and proper paper selection. So if there is anything else you come up with please let me know. Thanks again.

Regards,

Joe Geiser

Joe,

I just installed their XP driver last week.  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/...Drivers/Win2k-NT-XP/

If you have problems installing there are also some patches in this files list.

Yes, i'm aware Ricky says he's on sick leave. But, i'd suggest you email him directly and include a copy of exactly what you need done. If it's not too complex you may get an affirmative response; after all he can only say he's not up to doing it. I always prefer communicating directly with the source, opposed to reading a website or listening to what someone might be saying about it.

jackson

Again before you blow your wallet on the other options check with your local vinyl print shop.

You provide any image you want in one color and they can cut out a super thin white or any color they have in stock shape of any type for cheap! Should be under $20 for most projects! Just need to provide the digital file version of what you want in the format they work with.

Just peel and stick durable stuff no blead through of colors below and no noticeable decal edge works well and is cheap check it out at  your local decal shop.

No harm in looking at the web site to see what is offered, prices, and quality of work.  In Ricky's case it all looked very good.  I would always try to get as much info as possible before making an order.  Then I would contact him for particulars about making an order.  I would use Ricky myself if/when my ALPS printer dies.

That looks like an interesting alternative.  It looks especially well suited for making multi colored heralds for engines & rolling stock.  One limitation of the ALPS is that it uses dithering for some colors which is visible when you look real close.