Trains run fine until whistle button is pushed on the Z4000 remote. What is wrong?
The TMCC remote and functions fine.
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The trains stop when whistle button is pushed on Z4000 remote.
I moved this to the correct forum. This is a MTH post and not a 3-rail scale discussion.
Exactly how is this a TMCC post when
"The trains stop when whistle button is pushed on Z4000 remote."
It sounds like an MTH question to me! This is a problem with having so many sub-forums.
@Bob posted:Exactly how is this a TMCC post when
"The trains stop when whistle button is pushed on Z4000 remote."
It sounds like an MTH question to me! This is a problem with having so many sub-forums.
BOB...my bad. I saw the TMCC part of the question and had not scrolled up properly, I have changed it to the MTH forum. Thanks for the heads up.
@JTaylor posted:Trains run fine until whistle button is pushed on the Z4000 remote. What is wrong?
The TMCC remote and functions fine.
What train stops, the MTH DCS one or the TMCC ones? If you're running command, why are you pushing the whistle button on the transformer, that's for conventional mode.
Both trains stop immediately.
I have several other TMCC and Legacy engines that run fine with N&W Class J Proto 1 engine on track 1 of the Z4000. All the Lionel run on track 2.
The engine running with Class J is a Lionel Bigboy 6-28029
@JTaylor posted:Trains run fine until whistle button is pushed on the Z4000 remote. What is wrong?
The TMCC remote and functions fine.
Let's be clearer what you really have. When I read that, I think you might have a Z4000 remote and remote receiver set plugged into the Z4000 transformer. I personally use that setup and run into range issues or interference issues on the 900MHz radio communications between the remote and the transformer. So yes, I have seen where pressing a button can cause the voltage to change, drop to 0, whistle or bell offset gets stuck on. Typically it's range based when the remote is too far away, the batteries are low in the remote, or for example my cell phone is nearby and it can and does interfere.
Again, when the system is on the fringe of range or interference is happening, then output can be somewhat erratic out of the Z4000 transformer. Like I said, pressing a button on the remote can result in total drop of all power.
Also, I have several remotes and several receivers (was gathering for the 4 Z4Ks we have at our club), and it's not a bad transmitter or receiver, just interference and or limitations of the 900MHz which is partially why they were discontinued.
yes, this is the setup I have. I bring one Track up from Remote Control to 18 volts for Lionel TMCC and use a CAB1. The other Track I use the z4000 remote. With the Class J on one track and the Bigboy on the other pushing the horn button brings both trains to a sudden stop killing transformer power. My layout is 13x33. Why does the problem occur only while the Lionel Bigboy on the track.
Remember, when operating via remote, the Z4ooo transformer has different short circuit current protection. If you short circuit even momentarily unlike when the handle is used, the delays before power is turned off for safety is massively different than using the handle.
I was trying to find in the manual or instruction where it states that this aspect of operation is different but I assure you it is very different.
Again, when using the remote, the power trip cutoff is very different reaction to a short or overload than the same conditions being operated via the handles and no remote. This is an added safety feature of when using the remote that you may not have been aware of.
Hint, your bigboy may be causing a very brief short circuit somewhere on the track.
Simple to check, run it without the remote using the handles and watch the current meters on the Z4000 transformer.
Again, I've been searching manuals and topics and do not remember where I read it, maybe the DCS companion, but there are 2 basic real world differences I know of about Z4000 operation that is very different under remote control using the receiver and remote, or a DCS remote and Z4k track.
#1 The voltage displayed on the remote and transformer match. By that, I mean a complaint sometimes by beginners with the Z4000 using handle control only, when they set say 18V on the handle and then the train load increases when running (smoke, load, etc) the voltages tend to sag and the display shows the actual track voltage and this sag. Raising the handle under load corrects the sag but then when load is reduced the voltage rises to this new higher handle setting. However, under remote control, it's output remains fixed matching the remote regardless of load changes, kind of a self regulating feedback loop where you set a voltage and it maintains that voltage (obviously within current limits). Again, if you set 18V on the remote display, the transformer will output 18V even if the load varies in a way that does not happen or maintain this exact voltage when under handle operation only.
#2 The overcurrent or short circuit protection is very different under remote control than when compared to normal handle control operation. Since the remote control does not display amperage, nor does the Z4000 indicate amperage when under remote control, so as such, the overcurrent protection is much "safer" under remote control operation. It trips instantly and kills power where overloads and minor shorts that won't trip under handle operation will trip near instantly under Z4000 remote control operation.
Would it help if I moved the z4000 and remote base closer to the center of the layout?
@JTaylor posted:Would it help if I moved the z4000 and remote base closer to the center of the layout?
Determine if / when / you have a remote interference problem / radio range problem
VS
Are you having a short circuit overload that then stops you dead due to how overcurrent safety works when using the remote.
If the remote works fine 2-3 feet away from the receiver and you can run the trains and everything works, but when you move to your normal position to run trains whatever distance that is and it doesn't work- bingo, move the transformer closer.
If you try running using the handles and everything works, but using the remote and things keep stopping- especially with one specific engine- suspecting a short circuit current limit trip that is lower and faster when using the remote VS using the handles. Also implies there is something happening with that engine.
[ Why does the problem occur only while the Lionel Bigboy on the track. ]
The remote receiver will drop the voltage to zero on the Z-4000 transformer with the slightest spark going through a switch track and also when drawing slightly more 9 amps. Maybe the Big Boy is drawing to many amps when you blow the whistle.
As far as i know there isn't anything faster reacting to a spark from wheel shorting such as going though a switch than the remote receiver. I used a Dremel to shorten an offending rail on a switch track causing this.
Just scroll up the remote voltage and you are going again. Nothing to reset. Easy Peasy 
Could it be the MTH N&W Class J sparking?The horn button that stops everything is on the Z4000 remote, Which is running the MTH Class J. Pushing the horn button on the TMCC remote running the Bigboy never stops the trains.
I am going to test the AM drop aspect this morning. The Bigboy is pulling seven MTH lighted passenger cars.
Are the engines running on the same handle of the Z-4000? Running both on the same one can be close to pulling 9 volts. Unplug the receiver and run with the handle of the transformer to see the amp pull.
No. MTH Class J is on the Track 1 handle.
Lionel Bigboy is on Track 2 handle.
Wire from Lionel TMCC box is connected to Track 2 U terminal.
With z4000 remote unplugged and on handles:
Track 1/MTH Class J / 13 Volts / 4.3 Amps / 5 Amps whistle
Track 2 /Lionel Bigboy / 18 Volts / 4.6 Amps / 4.9 Amps with whistle
Bigboy on TMCC
