New Lionel E8 problems

Stalling video....note that the throttle is kept constant as the train suddenly slows down due to the rear unit stopping. Then I jiggle it and read unit comes back on (cab light goes off).

Background static. Sounds like an old 33 1/3 Lp that was played too many times.

I have the same static issue.  I'll test for the whistle/stopping problem and report back later.

Thanks Mike H. Yeah I’m pretty sure the static issue can’t just be my layout, and the one I returned had that same static.

Update! When I tested the rear unit running by itself I had it running forward cab pointed ahead. But the problem is happening when it is running forward with the cab pointing to the rear as the second unit so I tried running it by itself that way and sure enough activating the whistle or the crew talk, even though there is no sound without the front unit, caused the locomotive to stop!

Video

@JamesRx I could not duplicate your other issue.  Would you mind sending me an email (mine is in my profile).  I didn't see an address in your profile.

Totally reproducible..here’s a better one where I didn’t block the cab light coming on...

I have no idea if my issue is the same as your, i will copy my post.  For whatever reason my new E9 AA will not run well on my ZWL.  Runs great on my Z4000 and PW ZW.

I had the same issues sometimes I would hit the horn for the AA and one would stop but not the other.  No idea if you have another transformer, but worth a try.  Worked for me, no problems now, just can’t run it on two of my tracks.

https://ogrforum.com/...2#152899748986379832

Sounds like a bug in the new board design. We’re all beta testers now 😜. In all seriousness I have a custom run E9’s set that so far runs great. Other than in sequence control it sometimes says it’s stopped while still moving. Dave Olsen already said that was a software bug so no worries

Maybe @Dave Olson can comment and if he can recreate the issue

If it is a software bug, I am guessing to get it fixed it would have to back to Lionel if we wanted it fixed.

Waiting to hear what James is using for a transformer. The fact that the engine works with two sine wave transformers may provide a clue. I have E7s on order and assume they will be identical save the shells.

Pete

I’m using the Legacy system powered by a 180 watt brick.

Do you have another transformer to try to see if you have the same issues.  I have issues with the ZWL, but not a KW, PW ZW, or Z4000. No idea what the wave the brick puts out.

The brick is a pure sine wave like the postwar transformers and the Z-4000. I see a TPC there. It has a triac in it and that might make it more chopped, I would try using the 180 brick straight to confirm if it’s only liking a pure sine wave

FWIW - I am using a PH180 with Legacy (no TPC) and my E8's aren't doing it.

Dumb question but....how do I use a brick without a TPC? I set this up years ago so I could run an MTH engine and now it’s all I know!

@JamesRx posted:

Dumb question but....how do I use a brick without a TPC? I set this up years ago so I could run an MTH engine and now it’s all I know!

For command engines you can wire the brick right to the track. You only need a TPC for conventional trains.

Pete

I have the UP custom run version from Mr Muffins.  I am using a ZW-L.  I cannot replicate the problem you are having.  However, I have a problem with mine that may be an issue with just my engine.  I will describe my issue in a new thread.

We tested this morning and could not replicate the issue of one of the units stalling. I recommend doing a reset of both units and see if that resolves the issue. The reset procedure is in the manual.

As for the static at low volumes, that is normal. On older Legacy engines with the RCMC/RSL3, at low volume, you could hear faint beeping noises. That was caused by noise in the system of the commands constantly being sent back and forth. The mild background pops you hear in your E8 that has the new Legacy electronics is the same thing. With so much going on in the system, there's no way to avoid it. I recommend turning the volume up!

Hi Dave, I reset several times using the R button on the controller, but it did not help. As far as the static, I have your 2017 E8 and the 2019 PA sets And neither of those have any static sound whatsoever that I can hear any volume. Whereas with this new E8 the static is quite prominent. FYI so far there are 3 of us as far as I see On the form who are having some sort of issue with these new E8 units Fighting each other on the track either at speed or when coming to a stop. by fighting I mean they are not running at the same speed and one locomotive is trying to drag the other.  I first noticed the problem when I would bring the train to a stop when I heard the wheels of the front unit still spinning after the train had stopped. But now it sometimes happens at speed even without blowing the whistle. If it were just me having a problem I would guess it’s something about my system although my set up is very simple. But now there are at least three people having this problem.

This is a video of the original issue which happens when you throttle down to zero to get a rolling stop...the front unit is still going after the rear unit has stopped....

James have you tried eliminating the TPC yet? It appears everyone reporting problems is using a Lionel programable power supply, either TPC or ZWL.

Pete

Pete I literally do not know how to hook up a brick to the track without the TPC! I’m on my way to work now but when I get home tonight I will look into it. Any tips? All I have is a brick and legacy no transformer

@Dave Olson posted:

As for the static at low volumes, that is normal. On older Legacy engines with the RCMC/RSL3, at low volume, you could hear faint beeping noises. That was caused by noise in the system of the commands constantly being sent back and forth. The mild background pops you hear in your E8 that has the new Legacy electronics is the same thing. With so much going on in the system, there's no way to avoid it. I recommend turning the volume up!

Hi Dave - Do you anticipate the static/beeping/popping issue with any steam locomotives that will be coming out in the near future?  Thanks.

@Phoebe Snow Route posted:

Hi Dave - Do you anticipate the static/beeping issue with any steam locomotives that will be coming out in the near future?  Thanks.

If the popping and clicking is part of the new normal, there are going to be some very unhappy customers soon.  I have 8 Legacy engines from 2018-2020 catalogs and NONE of them sound like this.

@Dave Olson posted:

We tested this morning and could not replicate the issue of one of the units stalling. I recommend doing a reset of both units and see if that resolves the issue. The reset procedure is in the manual.

The problem I am reporting on the thread "2020 Lionel E9 Sync Problem" is not corrected by reset.  My problem only occurs when momentum is below 6 or if the Brake button is used to slow the train.  My issue is the A unit with sound.

@MikeH posted:

If the popping and clicking is part of the new normal, there are going to be some very unhappy customers soon.  I have 8 Legacy engines from 2018-2020 catalogs and NONE of them sound like this.

It is a very faint sound at the lowest volume levels. Seriously nothing to panic about. Older electronics have feedback. Newer electronics have feedback.

@JFC454 posted:

The problem I am reporting on the thread "2020 Lionel E9 Sync Problem" is not corrected by reset.  My problem only occurs when momentum is below 6 or if the Brake button is used to slow the train.  My issue is the A unit with sound.

We saw that thread and tested at all the various momentum levels and also could not reproduce any issues. I can't solve what I can't reproduce, so I would recommend calling in and sending in for us to look at them.

Ok thanks Dave. I emailed TalkToUs yesterday for an RA.

@JamesRx posted:

I’m using the Legacy system powered by a 180 watt brick.

If you wanted to bypass the box on the left, remove the white wire shown in the picture.  It should have spade connectors on the end.  Connect those ends to a terminal block along with your Fastrack wires.

Do these have Odyssey switches?  Are they both “on”. I didn’t see it mentioned although it might have been.

Not too clear from the video, but at appears that you are running this as Engine 1, which is the default engine number.

Might not make a difference, but have you tried re-programming it to a different, unused engine # and setting it up as a Legacy engine ?

@Dave Olson posted:

We tested this morning and could not replicate the issue of one of the units stalling. I recommend doing a reset of both units and see if that resolves the issue. The reset procedure is in the manual.

I check the owner's manual for these new E8/E9 and noticed that the reset instructions have changed.  If I follow exactly what is now on page 33, the engines are rendered completely unresponsive.  If I leave out step 6 (Press and hold the Reset button until the ding) which is a new step, and use the old steps which would require after pressing SET the power be turned off for 10 seconds and then move the switch to Run, the engines are restore to operating conditions.  The problems I have with them are still there, but they at least run.  So, either I have a real problem with the boards or the new instructions for reset are wrong.

@MartyE posted:

Do these have Odyssey switches?  Are they both “on”. I didn’t see it mentioned although it might have been.

They do not have Odyssey switches.

@JFC454 posted:

They do not have Odyssey switches.

Thanks. I was unsure.

@JamesRx posted:

Hi Dave, I reset several times using the R button on the controller, but it did not help.

I think what Dave means by reset, is to reset the engines to factory default settings.  There are new instructions for how to do that on page 33 of the manual.  Having said that, if I follow those instructions the engines become unresponsive to all commands.  To get them running again, I had to change Step 6 (Press and hold the Reset or 0 button until the ding) with the step that use to follow pressing SET which was turning off the power for 10 seconds before moving the switch to Run.  Before sending them back you might try resetting to the factory default settings.

@JFC454 posted:

I check the owner's manual for these new E8/E9 and noticed that the reset instructions have changed.  If I follow exactly what is now on page 33, the engines are rendered completely unresponsive.  If I leave out step 6 (Press and hold the Reset button until the ding) which is a new step, and use the old steps which would require after pressing SET the power be turned off for 10 seconds and then move the switch to Run, the engines are restore to operating conditions.  The problems I have with them are still there, but they at least run.  So, either I have a real problem with the boards or the new instructions for reset are wrong.

The reset instructions are not wrong. Make sure after the bell ding, you put the switch back to RUN.

I can confirm what Dave says.Following the instruction manual dated July 20 2020, I reset my units and no issues. After the bell "ding" switch back to Run, and away we go.

I also don't get the slow down/fighting each other that the op has.

@Dave Olson posted:

The reset instructions are not wrong. Make sure after the bell ding, you put the switch back to RUN.

Dave,

I did exactly what the directions say, including waiting for the bell ding.  Horn blows and engine comes alive when SET is pushed.  Hold the Reset (0) until the ding, move the switch to run, engine remains powered (sounds and lights) but will not respond to any command from the remote.  If I turn the power off and then back on the engine will not start up using the engine number.