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19 replies

New PS3 engines no longer run in conventional mode

MA Matt AOGR Forum Member

I've had trouble getting two new PS3 diesel engines to constantly run in conventional mode. I think I can rule out connectivity problems with the track. The Lionel tubular track was new last Christmas and is only used at Christmas time. The track is clean, the pins are tight and I've ohmed out every rail joint on the 4'x10' layout. All of my other engines run just fine on the layout. Transformer is an old Lionel 275W ZW.

The first engine I'm having trouble with is a PS3 SD-9043MAC 20-20297-1. Brand new, right out of the box this engine refused to power up in conventional mode. The headlight didn't even come on after a minute of operation (the caboose I have on the track is lit during this time). Several hours later I put the engine back on the track and it powered up like nothing was wrong. The engine moved about 3 feet and died. I cycled the power to the track and the engine powered back up but with no sound. I put the engine in forward and blew the horn and the sound returned. Ran fine for a week. Now the engine randomly refuses to start up and move. I called MTH and got an inexperienced HO technician who could only recommend I reset the engine thought a DCS system. I got out my DCS system (Rev L, Ver 4.20) and performed a feature reset and a factory reset. I was able to add the engine to the DCS system and it runs great however I now have a different problem in conventional mode. The engine starts up, the horn blows, sound works normally but the engine will not move. I let the engine sit over night and still have the same problem today. Tried resetting the engine again today and it still doesn't work. DCS operation still works great. The smoke unit is also quite noisy.

The second engine is a PS3 SD40T-2 20-20441-1. This engine is also brand new. This engine ran fine in conventional mode but after adding it to my DCS system it also refuses to move in conventional mode. Same problem as above, startup sound, lights and horn work just fine. I've tried resetting this engine and the problem still persists. The engine also runs great with DCS. I've got a second road number of this engine (also new) and even after adding it to the DCS system, it still runs in conventional mode.  

I tried calling MTH again today and sat on hold for about as long as it took me to create this post (I gave up waiting). Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

 

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Dennis LaGruaDennis LaGruaOGR Forum Member

I wonder why more remote control engines did not use the toggle switch on the engine as on the K-Line units did. You just turn switch off and you run conventional. The only remote control engine that I own is a K-Line Reading RS-3.  It starts and stops fine and has run only conventional. If you get a schematic wiring diagram for that engine you might be able to figure out how to add this switch.

MA Matt AOGR Forum Member
GGG posted:

In conventional do a conventional reset with voltage around 10V.  1W and 5B.  After you hear the 2 toots see if it will move.  Sounds like a conventional lock in neutral.   G

Thanks GGG. I had forgotten about the conventional mode controls. I will have to build a bell controller since my ZW does not have one. Might take a few days before I can report back.

MA Matt AOGR Forum Member

I finally had a chance to get back to this after several busy weeks at work and a vacation. I borrowed a WBB transformer with the whistle/bell buttons and reset the engines. The SD40T-2 reset ok and resumed normal conventional operation. The SD9043MAC wasn't so nice. The SD9043MAC blew its horn twice after the reset command and then went completely dead on the tracks. No lights, No sound, No directional control. I shut down the transformer for about ten seconds and still nothing when I powered the transformer back up. I let the engine sit for a few minutes with the transformer off and eventually it did power up and operate. I'm going to try another call with MTH's service department and see if I can send the engine in for service.

mike.carusomike.carusoOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Found this thread after doing a search of a problem I'm having with conventional operation.  I have a Dash-9 Proto 3 engine that won't run in conventional mode.  I tried the 1W and 5B approach but did not hear any blasts from the horn or any other sound.  When I start it up in DCS mode it seems to run fine, with all movement and sound functions.  Any thoughts/suggestions as to what else I should try?  Thanks.

S stan2004OGR Forum Member
mike.caruso posted:

Found this thread after doing a search of a problem I'm having with conventional operation.  I have a Dash-9 Proto 3 engine that won't run in conventional mode.  I tried the 1W and 5B approach but did not hear any blasts from the horn or any other sound.  When I start it up in DCS mode it seems to run fine, with all movement and sound functions.  Any thoughts/suggestions as to what else I should try?  Thanks.

So when you power up in conventional mode (no TIU) does it just sit silently?  Could the conventional mode volume adjustment control be turned down to minimum volume?

Barry BroskowitzBarry BroskowitzOGR Forum Member MEMORIALIZED MEMBER

Mike,

On the conventional track (no TIU) it revs up and has sound, lights.  When I place it on a test track connected to a TIU, it sits silently until I use the DCS remote for start-up.  Then it has sound, movement etc.

That's normal. When it sees a DCS watchdog signal from the TIU, it automatically goes into DCS mode.

To make it operate conventionally user a TIU, do one of the following:

  • Before powering a track, use: Menu/System/DCS Setup and press oft key AOF to turn off the DCS signal on all channels. Then apply power and your engine should respond to conventional control. You can operant it using the remote via the TR screen.
  • Disconnect the output of the TIU from the track. Then apply track power and wait about 2 minutes. Then, connect the output of the TIU to the track and your engine should respond to conventional control. You can operant it using the remote via the TR screen.
S stan2004OGR Forum Member
mike.caruso posted:

...I tried the 1W and 5B approach but did not hear any blasts from the horn or any other sound. 

Just to be clear, are you doing this from the DCS remote with the engine set to conventional mode on a Variable Track?

Or are you doing this from the transformer?  The timing can be a little tricky.  Here's a video illustrating the timing on a Z-4000 and a Z-750 with the double-horn-blast acknowledgement.

 

mike.carusomike.carusoOGR Forum Member SUPPORTING MEMBERDIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
stan2004 posted:
mike.caruso posted:

...I tried the 1W and 5B approach but did not hear any blasts from the horn or any other s

Just to be clear, are you doing this from the DCS remote with the engine set to conventional mode on a Variable Track?

Or are you doing this from the transformer?  The timing can be a little tricky.  Here's a video illustrating the timing on a Z-4000 and a Z-750 with the double-horn-blast acknowledgement.

 

Stan, the video helped because I don't think I was pressing the buttons fast enough to get the desired result.  (I was kind of doing a "One Mississippi, Two Mississippi" method)  Just now I tried to follow the video, and after two or three attempts the double horn blast sounded and now she's off and running. Many thanks.  

Barry, thanks to you as well for taking the time to help.  I think I may have not stated my dilemma clearly enough, in that I wasn' trying to get it to run conventionally on the track with the TIU.  That's just a test track in the basement, used for loading engine info into the remote....which I then bring to the Club.  My home layout doesn't have any command wiring.  Yet.  LOL

Thanks to both, and may you have a Happy Thanksgiving!  

MA Matt AOGR Forum Member

For what its worth, I sent my SD9043MAC engine back to MTH twice on my dime and both times MTH claimed no problem found and yet I still have problems with it every time I cycle power. Basically what I got out of one of there tech support representatives is that there is a capacitor on the board that does not drain down in time and does not allow the board to reset. I need to sit there and wait for like 2 minutes with the power off or my engine will not move when I turn it back on. You would think the second time around, they would just replace the PS3 board and be done with it. I'm quite irritated with MTH having called them a half dozen times about this. 

A Andrews-s-cOGR Forum Member

I have a similar situation with a starter set ES44 loco.  When it starts in conventional, it tries to move forward but stops almost immediately and goes into reverse.  Runs in reverse fine, but no neutral and no forward.  In DCS mode, it is fine.  Called Mikes and was told to load the chain file into the loco and that would repair it.  Spent tonight doing that and it's no better.  Any ideas?

 

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