Shipping Costs Makes Sale of Trains Impractical

One tip, especially when buying your postage online.  Do not select "fragile" as this greatly increases the cost.  Go ahead and try it on the USPS website - found this out by chance one day.   Just write 'fragile' on the box yourself or ask them to stamp it 'fragile' if you drop if off (vs having them pick it up).

No doubt postage has increased.  You just have to figure it into the cost.  Depending on the freight car, $35 is a good price.  Your mileage may vary.

-Greg

There are two viewpoints to this. Shipping costs can be a significant part of the total cost in shipping an inexpensive item. Try using your own box and not a flat rate or priority mail box.  Also some items can be shipped in a $6.30 small flat rate envelope.

I have received many shipments via USPS and while a shipping cost is included, its always less than driving to a train show . Some of the train shows in this area are a 110 mile round trip.  Most often one or two rolling stock items come home with me.  With fuel and wear and tear on my late model full size car (2015)  this trip costs me $66.00. Is shipping really a problem? Ask all the advertisers here.

I ship diecast es44s all the time and most of the time fedex delivered is like 25 bucks even to the westcoast... I dont think thats bad..

Personal opinion - large sets are easier to sell at shows, like a five car MTH passenger set.

I have thrown out trains rather than sell them, for example, beat up postwar trains, just not dealing with all the bs of eBay. For example, I sold a phone case for all of $5 and the buyer claimed he never got it. It was easier to just refund the money than spend any more time on it or risk a bad review. I have different rules apply to selling on OGR or craigslist. Never, ever, try to give something away for free on CL. You will get five emails from people immediately that say they will take it, but only one of them will actually want to show up, and you can't tell which one it is. Instead I list it for $5 then give it away for free. In my opinion, of course.

I recently discovered that Priority mail regional rate is well suited for many of the things I mail. But it appears that you must purchase you postage online. When I've purchased postage at my local post office, they charge full retail priority mail rates for items in Regional Rate boxes. (or maybe my post office is overcharging me).

I agree with Bobby, the high shipping costs have certainly hurt the salability of trains.

Buying and selling group lots helps because the cost to ship multiple items together is much less than shipping each item individually. I see more and more EBay lots consisting of multiple items.
Now if only people would list there steam locomotives with the proper tender, and their multiple unit diesels as one lot.

You can bang away at your keyboard all you want.Shipping costs money.It is built in to every single thing that you need use and consume.If you buy any item for 10 dollars it costs 3 dollars to get it there.Go to any web site and order a part that costs 2 dollars the shipping will be the same or double.It is an order that has to be warehoused packed shipped and delivered.Those people all have to be paid.Do you get paid to go to work?Nick

The point as I see it is IT DID NOT USE TO BE BE THIS WAY!!

That is the whole and the entire point in its totality!

I have a HW sleeper on order with GGD as we speak. Paid for it OCT 27. (Say when are they going to ship anyway?) Shipping to Canada for this one $170 car? Ninety dollars!

Recently bought another GGD Depot 21 inch car used from a private seller. Paid him $100. Shipping?

His ACTUAL cost, as charged him by the USPS . . . forty-six dollars.

You bet shipping costs have escalated over the years . . . way out of actual inflationary costs.

I used to sell low-value items on ebay. Things like CDs, DVDs and books. It's been years since I could do that!

Shipping costs totally preclude such sales now. And this is equally true within Canada and to/from the states.

Canada is insane with their mail costs anymore. I feel for our friends in the Great White North (as I live a few hours from the BC border) who can't mail anything cheaply. I know of people there who have given up entirely on selling through eBay because no bidder wants to pay those shipping costs, not that I blame them.

I wonder, though, how mailing costs for parcels have gone up proportionately through the ages? In other words, is it a higher % of the average salary to mail something than it used to be? I know some people gripe about the costs of certain things today when in fact, it turns out to be proportionately much cheaper than it used to be...

Many, if not all of the shippers give tremendous discounts to high volume shippers.  I wonder whether they look to the occasional shipper to make up for some of those discounts.

Everything is relative, folks.  I "test-drove" Canon's new professional digital SLR camera, the EOS 1DX Mark II, for a live concert event I photographed a couple of weeks ago.  Shipping the camera back to Canon was on my dime, and it cost over $75 to ship from Pennsylvania to Virginia.  Now admittedly, a huge percentage of that cost was insurance, since it's a $6K camera.

Earlier this week, I received the preliminary invoice from 3rd Rail for the E8's due in March 2017.  I ordered two powered units at $649/each.  UPS shipping for both units cross-country is listed as $90.  The Public Delivery Track's cross-country shipping cost came in a little better at $60 for an Atlas-O Santa Fe F7 ABBA-config.

So whether it's a small-ticket or big-ticket item, shipping is now a significant part of the dollars we're shelling out.

David

Make no mistake - geography will affect your sales. A narrowing effect on your market.

The guys on the other side of the country have to pay more postage - and will bid lower.

But - that's not a defining scenario. (East>West Coast) - That IS expensive - and has gotten worse.

In the end, you just end up selling more stuff to people who live closer to you...they have the advantage when bidding.

They can bid higher - since their postage rate will be lower.

As long as you get what you want for a piece - I wouldn't worry too much about how much another guy is willing to pay for postage.

C W Burfle posted:

Many, if not all of the shippers give tremendous discounts to high volume shippers.  I wonder whether they look to the occasional shipper to make up for some of those discounts.

Years ago when shipping through UPS there came a time when UPS decided to focus more on catering to business's, (I don't blame them) but at the exact same time, folks like me who only used them 75-100 times a year ended up paying quite a bit more all of a sudden. That's when I quit using UPS and only shipped via FedEx... I think FedEx is after a little of that traffic these days although I haven't noticed a huge increase with them like I did with UPS. But when I used to sell alot online, I'd always suggest to folks, find a business that will accept packages for you, but no one ever took me up on that. Shipping to any business is most definately alot more reasonable...

It kind of funny. I have bought from Canada and shipping was just about comparable to be shipped in the US and was shipped priority mail.  Same as from international sellers. What you pay is dependent on the exchange rate. The reality if you want something you will have to accept the shipping costs. The price you pay for buying online.  With Local Hobby Shops going the way of the dinosaur or availability of what you need is limited locally, I don't see any other alternative.   Disadvantage to being in Florida is lack of O Scale items at train shows. When they are, they either are junk at high prices or just plain overpriced. At the recent Tampa show I saw PS1 engines being sold for 300 dollars  plus 

Perhaps a tip that might help out some of our Canadian friends?...

I have a good friend a few hours north of Detroit but on the Canadian side. He collects farm toys. He used to have them shipped to me as he purchased them, and then I'd pack them all in one box and ship them up to him, cheaper that way. Anymore though, he found a business in Port Huron that accepts packages for their Canadian customers, so he has his packages shipped there, they hold them for him, and every few months, he and his wife take a drive down and pick them all up at once. He did this when he was buying quite a bit, not sure these days. I have to think there are other business's like this near the border in various places.

I have absolutely no affilliation with these folks, and not sure it's ok to post a direct link, but the place is called SCC Parcel Pickup in Port Huron. Hopefully that will help someone out here! I know my friend sure used to appreciate their services, and he used to say how unbelievably busy they were whenever he stopped.

And it's only going to get worse/higher

Terry Danks posted:

...

You bet shipping costs have escalated over the years ...

The shipping companies are THE CRITICAL link in the chain that allows small businesses to appear like they're providing super customer service to their clients.  And without a doubt, there's a tremendous infrastructure in place that allows shipping companies to move packages as quickly as they do.   Heck, most of us can purchase our toy trains from the comfort of our own homes and have stuff in our hands within a day or two -- making it more convenient than driving in crazy traffic to a nearby (or not-so-nearby) train shop! 

The shippers know the important role they're playing, so they charge accordingly.  And ironically, the small businesses are able to pass on the shipping charges to us.  So at the end of the day, we're paying for it anyway -- not the small businesses.  So they're really able to take advantage of a tremendous service on the consumer's dime.

David

the first thing I look at after the price is how much this seller wants to make in shipping. A lot of times they mark it up so they can list the item cheaper to gain more attention to it. I know I can ship a boxcar from coast to coast for $10 or less but you see these that have it at $20 and more. ( and not businesses where they have to pay someone to pack it and but the packing and boxes) Heck I've seen businesses that offer less shipping cost than some individuals on the bay. I remember shipping a train set from VA. to CA. and it being right about $20 now you're lucky to get a quote for $35 normally like $50 or more.  Last set I did that was about a year ago and the actual shipping was like $32 so the $35 isn't out of line today. And I have accounts with USPS, Fedex, and UPS. I just kept them after I shutdown my home business about 10 years ago. 

On CL I often trade things for a bottle of soda.

Free can wait on the lawn. I don't use the curb so if folks drive far it is  still there.

Our CL used to be good, but there are two or three folks that began spamming it up with a million individual adds a year or two ago, so it is a rather "bumpy" search.

I just keep thinking "Please stop". Or at least condense them and cycle the repeats; we've seen them....Some for years

$25 fed ex seems OK since I never once had an issue with them

I had a friend who used to work for the USPS in Homestead Fl and he said to insure an item if you want it delivered undamaged. Reasoning he gave me is that the clerk who handles the insured package has to sign for it on some type of USPS paperwork. Also he said that writing fragile or breakable without insurance is asking for some employees to play football with it.

Lee Fritz

Terry Danks posted:

The point as I see it is IT DID NOT USE TO BE BE THIS WAY!!

That is the whole and the entire point in its totality!

I have a HW sleeper on order with GGD as we speak. Paid for it OCT 27. (Say when are they going to ship anyway?) Shipping to Canada for this one $170 car? Ninety dollars!

Recently bought another GGD Depot 21 inch car used from a private seller. Paid him $100. Shipping?

His ACTUAL cost, as charged him by the USPS . . . forty-six dollars.

You bet shipping costs have escalated over the years . . . way out of actual inflationary costs.

I used to sell low-value items on ebay. Things like CDs, DVDs and books. It's been years since I could do that!

Shipping costs totally preclude such sales now. And this is equally true within Canada and to/from the states.

Completely understood Terry, being on the Canuck side of the line myself. North American shipping has become a ridiculously inflated profit centre vs. what it used to be. I don't buy single train items online unless it's something I really want; I aim for groupings or sets and only have them shipped to a US-address parcel drop, not to Canada. Evil-Bay is definitely not worth it internationally - I would suggest online selling and shopping be done through the Amazon-style outlets (but not the Canadian ones either). If you can find your items there, pay your yearly fee and get free shipping.

I know the above can be described as "first world problems", but  I recently got a better deal on ordering a hobby machine-tool part from South Africa, another from India and having them shipped to me directly. Ali-Express is mail-order direct from China, another outlet worth checking out. It pays to shop world-wide and play the exchange a little. As far as I'm concerned, North American sales are a dud when shipping costs are added in - there has to be an incentive for me. Small auction-site selling/buying on this continent is out the window.

Gasoline was 14.9 cents a gallon when I was a kid.  Loaf of bread was a nickel and so was a vending machine can of soda.  Green beans were 7 cans for a dollar.  Postage was 3 cents, a new Volkswagen beetle was $1700.00.   Things definitely change.

I can usually pay for my whole trip to York in shipping cost savings.  Course I have to join TCA and pay dues.  I know the thought of paying TCA dues upsets a lot of people.  

Shipping is the key factor that limits most of us from shipping our engines back and forth for repair/upgrade.

Then if you decide to suck it up and pay the costs, you risk damage from the round trip. 

I shipped a 3rd Rail 2-10-4 to GunRunnerJohn.. $70 round trip insured. That was my discounted rate. It was $95 RETAIL and even higher if you take it to a shipping center.

I shipped something via the post office 2 days ago and they had a sign stating they would no longer accept packages smaller than 10 x 6.  Ouch this hurts since I've quite often sent out packages with small parts and USPS was the best deal going to ship these items.  Now you have to use a bigger box at a bigger cost!

Jim

As a buyer - I look at shipping as the real cost of ownership...If I pay $125.00 for a Holiday Themed set and pay 35.00 postage to me.

I use the set for a for a few years - and take good care of it.

It's not impossible I can sell it for $125.00 - so it only cost me $35.00 (postage to me) to own it...and maybe I get $150.00 for it...!

I think it's fair to say many of us have a "liquid" component to our collection - stuff that is coming and going - keeping our invested dollars, even.

If you broker the liquid part of your collection carefully - you can even come out ahead!

In the end - its all going to be sold, and monies recovered...shipping will be your only loss.

Yes, shipping has gone up. As a buyer the shipping cost is the first thing I look at. As a seller I only charge actual shipping cost. I pass on items where the shipping is a rip-off. 

I purchased an item off the for sale forum that cost $70 (it was a bulky building). Shipping was $45 to the west coast. I think shipping charges have gotten way out of control considering the price of fuel. Now I look at my local train store a lot more closely due to the steep rise in shipping. ie : Arttista figures at the local train store are $6.25 on a popular auction site they are slightly less but shipping is well over $2.00.  If i do buy on line I will purchase from Mario's Trains, Mr. Muffins or similar stores that offer free or reduced shipping. 

Roving Sign, above:

"Make no mistake - geography will affect your sales. A narrowing effect on your market."

Regardless of this thread's subject, I'm just pleased to occasionally find someone who knows the difference between "affect" and "effect".

Maybe we should just type uh-fect 

Blend your abilities,  a car for about  550 -700 miles is about  6.75-8.50,

if you are going across any aspect of country side, open up a FEd-ex account  FEDX   took a SD - 70ace  double packed ( Lionel shipping carton overpacked!!

of mine for about 28.00, where as USPS, cost $ 44 with Ebay discount,  and pack only enough to protect

what ever ur shipping , those things will add the ounces if you are not carefull.  But have all aspects covered

1) ebay shipping discounts,  2) Fedx account,  3) simple cars in simple boxes, that USPS will take as normal Priority.

arrsd90 posted:

Blend your abilities,  a car for about  550 -700 miles is about  6.75-8.50,

if you are going across any aspect of country side, open up a FEd-ex account  FEDX   took a SD - 70ace  double packed ( Lionel shipping carton overpacked!!

of mine for about 28.00, where as USPS, cost $ 44 with Ebay discount,  and pack only enough to protect

what ever ur shipping , those things will add the ounces if you are not carefull.  But have all aspects covered

1) ebay shipping discounts,  2) Fedx account,  3) simple cars in simple boxes, that USPS will take as normal Priority.

 

For sure - cross country - I've seen instances where FedEx is substantially cheaper - and USPS would have been prohibitive. I had to ship a few drums to the west coast recently (from PA) and FedEx was wildly cheaper.

aussteve posted:

Gasoline was 14.9 cents a gallon when I was a kid.  Loaf of bread was a nickel and so was a vending machine can of soda.  Green beans were 7 cans for a dollar.  Postage was 3 cents, a new Volkswagen beetle was $1700.00.   Things definitely change.

I can usually pay for my whole trip to York in shipping cost savings.  Course I have to join TCA and pay dues.  I know the thought of paying TCA dues upsets a lot of people.  

Yes, but go back and look at what the average salary was in the same timeframe. You'll realize people got paid a lot less back then.

Historical process must be judged in a context of salary ranges in the same region at the same time to see if they cost more or less now or then.

A friend of mine teaches economics at a university and he's always having to explain to older people that while things of course had a cheaper sticker price back in the day, you also got paid less, too. Some things are actually cheaper now, compared with median salaries in this country, than they used to be!

You want to try to buy something from the US when you live in Oz.    The USPS charge like wounded bulls.  Then it's exacerbated by the exchange rate, which not only applies to the US$ for the purchase, but also applies to the cost of the shipping, which is in US$.

It's only money. 

The USPS Priority Mail Shoebox is perfect for a lot of rolling stock - and you can join two together for longer boxes/locos.

These are free - you can order them at usps.com

https://store.usps.com/store/b...roductId=P_0_SHOEBOX

Buying toy trains is not a rational act.  Throwing a few more bucks to the wind for shipping to gain an emotional fix is insignificant in the grand scheme of things.  People will pay if they really want what you have to offer.  

What, me worry?

p.s. Most single cars shipped by Priority Mail will fit in a free box and require only a few handfuls of styrofoam peanuts, a few air pillows or a couple sheets of bubble wrap or packing paper that don't add up to an additional $10 (especially if you recycle rather than discard packing materials).

Roving Sign posted:

The USPS Priority Mail Shoebox is perfect for a lot of rolling stock - and you can join two together for longer boxes/locos.

These are free - you can order them at usps.com

https://store.usps.com/store/b...roductId=P_0_SHOEBOX

How come we cant get them at the post office? I haven't seen one till you posted it here! Plus it might be cheaper for those of use who buy and pay the shipping!

mike g. posted:

How come we cant get them at the post office? I haven't seen one till you posted it here! Plus it might be cheaper for those of use who buy and pay the shipping!

USPS will deliver a bundle to your home for free.  Why bother with a trip to the post office?  Be an informed, empowered consumer.

What, me worry?

mike g. posted:

Roving Sign posted:

 

How come we cant get them at the post office? I haven't seen one till you posted it here! Plus it might be cheaper for those of use who buy and pay the shipping!

Yeah, I'd never even heard of one of these until I saw this photo, and I go into the local post office at least once every week or two!

p51 posted:

Yeah, I'd never even heard of one of these until I saw this photo, and I go into the local post office at least once every week or two!

Spend that time on the USPS website instead.  They will even pick up the packages for free to save those trips to the post office.

What, me worry?