TIU blown fixed 1 output?

Doesn't sound good.... Perhaps 15 amp is  too much. quite a few  use  32 volt 10 amp fast blow glass fuses.

  THe ZW capable of   a  40 amp  power surge .  In  case of a derailment, the surge has to go through the tiu before it get to the fuse beteen the track and tiu,  If the fuse is between the ZW and TIU input it(power surge) can't get to the tiu.  Just my opinion.  You could try an aux power supply and try the other 3  channels,, If they work you could put both tiu in super  but I'm not sure if there is an advantage,

I just replaced a blown "20 amp" fuse in my grandson's TIU. All of the fuses are 20 amps. Works fine now. 

Makes sense.  I was advised to do it that way by MTH.  I will add another fuse between the ZW and the TIU.  Still not sure why the internal fuse didn't go.

I'm not sure if switching TIU's will work without a fixed 1 working in both for correct super TIU setup.

JerryG,

    Sounds like you are frustrated buddy, lets start at the beginning, 1st your fuses or resettable breakers should be placed between your Transformer and your TIU on every Red line, that Red line should be wired to the center rail in your layout.  2nd that fuse or resettable breaker should be 6-10 Amps no bigger.  I even use them between my Z4K's and the TIU, although some call this over kill, it works every time all the time safe guarding my TIU.  The Built in TVS in your TIU will safe guard your engines.  Use the Aux port to power your TIU, with an RS 18/24 power supply, this opens another running channel, and the e-stop from the Hand Held Remote control works fully in this manner.  Definitely replace the fuse in your TIU if needed, and wire as I explained above then your layout will run correctly, if you have your track layed out and wired correctly.  

Have fun, not frustration!

PCRR/Dave

JerryG posted:

Makes sense.  I was advised to do it that way by MTH.  I will add another fuse between the ZW and the TIU.  Still not sure why the internal fuse didn't go.

I'm not sure if switching TIU's will work without a fixed 1 working in both for correct super TIU setup.

Yes super will work , you're just not going to have fixed 1 and will have to use an aux power supply.

 I have a very slightly melted fixed one hot output fixture.

Open up the TIU and check the 16 nuts on the input and output posts for adequate tightness.  Add nuts size M4 - .70 and internal start lock washers to keep them tight.  Loose nuts can result in overheating and melting even if current isn't enough to open even a small fuse or breaker.

Thanks guys.

 What is a radio shack 18/24 volt power supply?   A search provided no hits at all, and a lot of 12 and 13.8 volt hits.  If I have to use the aux port I will need something specific with the appropriate barrel jack.  Any more ideas on an auxillary power supply that works? 

If you have an MTH brick (like a z500) from a starter set, that will work for aux TIU power. Barry's book lists a Radio Shack part number for an aux power supply, I think it's still in the new edition too, so they probably still carry them.

RJR, 

Brilliant.  Each nut has a tiny blue pen line on it that shows face up.  When I checked fixed 1 the hot side output was missing the line.  Not sure how that baby got loose, because I never move the TIU.  Have power to fixed one.  

Only have control of one of 4 engines.  The others start on their own, and don't respond to commands.  Out of RF range, but the engines do come up in the remote.  The TIU is open but wired.  Do I reset everything?  Why would I have complete control of one but not the others?

 Perhaps track signal.... If a engine has already been added to the remote you may be able to communicate with it  even with a very low track signal..... with the same low track signal you probably won't be able to add a new engine..... Can you try a track signal test?

Now, remote keeps shutting down on its own.   Loose board inside?  I'm afraid to open it up to reseat anything. 

Are the batteries  fresh and in there tight?    I wouldn't open it....There is a power down feature but unless you've set it up to a lower value the remote should  stay turned on for 60 minutes.  

Gregg,

Track signal varies between 4 and 7 with engine sitting still.  It was ten the last time I checked a few months ago.  No changes to the track except I am using a small lighted tower that is getting track power, but that was a month ago.  I have 14 and 16 volt lamps.  Do I need the 18V lamp to do the Marty F thing?

Maybe try the 16 for testing... I don't think you need full power with the PW ZW... cut it back slightly.   The bulbs do make a difference. don't know why though. We have a bulb hooked up to each channels   terminal block right on the terminal block.

Beyond belief.  Of course, I changed the batteries yesterday.  Changed them again after your post, must have been a bad one in there. Complete control of all engines except for three things:  1)  Three of the four engines start up on their own.  Can shut them down and control them normally on startup.  2) The remote still keep shutting off intermittently.  3)  All sections read signal of ten, but found the one weak spot on one track that varies between 5 and 9 with engine sitting still.  Will work on that one.

Engines starting on their own indicates some problem.  Wiring hasn't changed at all and looks ok.  Could this simply be setup driven?  I will scour Barry's book again. 

Jerry,

2) The remote still keep shutting off intermittently.

First, ensure that there's a piece of something affixed to the inside of the remote's battery cover to assist in keeping the batteries in place.

Second, use a tweezer to gently stretch the springs in the battery compartment to make a tighter fit for the batteries.

Third, see if you can find batteries that are a tiny bit longer. All AAA batteries are not necessarily the same length.

Engines starting on their own indicates some problem

Does this happen when only one engine at a time is powered on, or only when several are powered on at the same time?

Barry,

1) There is, but, I could add a soft foam piece in addition.  I will give the springs a try, but they seem tight.

2) Three of four start up on their own shortly after power is applied to the tracks.  The PS2 starts right away (battery) and the two other PS3's take a few seconds (supercapacitors).   The fourth (PS3) stays silent until I access it with the remote.  I don't touch anything else.  Usually, when this happens I have no control, but now I have full control of all of them.  

after power is applied to the tracks.

This is ambiguous.  The watchdog signal, that tells the loco to start in command (DCS) mode,  is only sent for a few seconds after power is applied to the TIU channel input.  If that is powered, and you then send power to the tracks by throwing a toggle switch, the locos will start, usually in conventional mode.

When the remote shuts off, gently slip the battery cover off and see if they're all in place.  Be sure to check the shutoff time in the remote; it's a variable setting.

Jerry,

Onde more time...

Does this happen when only one engine at a time is powered on, or only when several are powered on at the same time?

Also, are the tracks being controlled by toggle, or other type, switches?

Well, what I have always done is to move the ZW handles to full.  This powers the TIU which powers the two mainline 100 ft tracks at nearly the same time.  Cars light up, etc.  There are no toggles, except on the spur to the yard, which is never powered on startup.

I will check the remote setup again.

Barry,

No toggles on the main lines.  Yes, two engines each are on the two main lines.  Have tried switching them in and out with no effect.  Do you think I should try one at a time?  Why does one stay silent and normal?

Do you think I should try one at a time?

Yes.

Guys,

I think the problem is solved.  I know enough to check the wiring when these things occur.  I think RJR was right about the loose TIU nut causing the initial problem.  With all my jostling in checking everything, I finally found a loose connection in one of two plugs to my variable 1, which is the yard and it's switches.  The Gargraves track power is off, but the output still lights the Lionel switches and their controllers. There is one switch to each main line, and two more in the yard.  It looks cool, so I leave it on at 10-12 volts.  I removed the plug and stripped the wire because I am out of those plugs.  

It seems the loose connection to the switch power was interfering with the watchdog DCS signal on the mainlines.  The engine that was normal was the closest to the two switches.

I only tried it for 5 minutes, but the engines are now normal and remote seems steady.  I will run the whole business this PM to make sure.

Thanks.  You guys remain the best...

Jerry G.

JerryG,

  I recommend using the Gold Banana Plugs to eliminate all these kinds of problems, I even retrofitted the old ZW & KW Transformers with them, and have never had any problems from loose wires, or over heated TIU channel fittings.  

PCRR/Dave

Dave,

You read my mind.  I am tired of this stuff.

There is a local RS, but, every time I go in there, they are out of them.  

I checked to see if they have the 18/24 volt power supply as an auxillary.  Even Amazon is out of them.  Only one hit on ebay and the guy wants three times the price.

Do you know where I can get either of these guys?

Jerry

JerryG

   Here ya go.

I do not know why the attachment will not post, something is blocking it, use the ident below and do an e-bay search, they will both come up.

E-Bay has the RS 18/24 Power Adaptor for $15.99 New right now.

They also have the Gold Banana Plugs for 5 Pair for $8.50

PCRR/Dave

Thanks Dave.  Just put in the orders...

Jerry

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

I do not know why the attachment will not post, something is blocking it, use the ident below and do an e-bay search, they will both come up.

Dave, if you just copy the eBay ID as text, it makes it easy to go to an exact item.  OGR has stated they don't want direct links to eBay, so they may block URL's that point to eBay.

Guns,

    Thanks buddy for the heads up.

PCRR/Dave 

JerryG,

   You are welcome sir, I try to help when I can.

PCRR/Dave