Williams by Bachmann 2014 Catalog

I just bought one to run on my 'Streets for $149, so I think the $319.95 is fantasy on Bachmann/s part.  I was surprised that Amazon had them for $165 to $192 - normally they beat just about every price I can find when they have something I want. One-fifty for that little jewel strikes me as a very good price for what you get.  

The Dash 9s, the Trainmaster, the E7, the dummy Genesis, the GG1s (pretty much), scale Hudson, BL2s,44tonner,NW2,EP-5,Rectifier,PAs, Sharks,U-boats,FP45,SD45,F7,Berkshires and Js all gone. The FAs are now powered FA, dummy FB.

I do like the traditional sized 209 New Haven FA's and the Conndot/New Haven Genesis with sounds. No one has mentioned separate sale the Sound cards. That's my first impression.

I'm a little fuzzy on who bought what from K-Line, having only returned to the hobby about a year ago. I thought RMT had bought the tooling/molds. It was WBB? Please enlighten.

I noticed in the Golden Memories section, WBB's going to be doing the 208 Santa Fe, 209 New Haven and 210 Texas Special O-27 FA2's.

 

About time, but at $470 a pair, YOIKS!

 

Rusty

I wonder if the Bachmann people will put the heritage schemes for the Norfolk Southern GE ES44ACs on a new O Scale GE ES44AC model, or be extra frugal and decide bring back the GE DASH 9 later.

 

Andrew

GP38 says new tooling. Isn't the market already saturated with these? Weaver, Lionel, MTH & K line all made a GP38.

 

 

This is a 1960's built GP38 not a 1970's era GP38-2.

 

The Lionel traditional O GP38-2 is a shrunken compromise shell on a GP9 frame.

 

Andrew

My bad, the "HO" model threw me off - I go back to the old tried and true way of I don't buy until I see!

 

WBB got the Super Streets track and renamed it E Z Streets. WBB may also have gotten some engine molds, not sure on this.

 

RMT got the K-Line Snap track and Snap track switches.

 

Lionel just leased the rights to market K-Line items, at least that is my understanding of things. Lionel don't sell anything by K-Line currently.

 

Lee Fritz

Some of the steam engine molds were held by Korean producers and Lionel did keep access to those, e.g. two truck Shay.  Who got what is pretty complicated.

I looked at the catalog yesterday online and they have less N5C cabooses listed then in other years. I did not see too many new items, just the E Z Streets starter set that would interest me.

 

Lee Fritz

Round and round it goes, where this lands........nobody knows.

Glad to se that WBB will be making some new small Alco FA2s.  About time, but I think the asking price of $470 is crazy for a small engine with limited detail.  I'll consider buying the NH if the street price is around $300.

With the use of the HO Scale models with the wire handrails, that might show that the K-Line O Scale GP38 or GP38-2 is being used to replace the earlier O gauge GP38.

 

Andrew

Wake me when, IF, they produce a Consolidation or Mikado to go with the Ten Wheeler.

I ASK again!! WHO is the first to POST "PREORDERS"????

 

FREDSTRAINS

I don't know FREDSTRAINS, but I hope it's Wholesale Trains. 

 

I got the best deal out there when I pre-ordered the B&M F3 AA and B.

 

Fred

Are you guys sure that the catalog shows each and every variation of each and every product that WBB will be offering for 2014?

If I may make an observation about Kader-Bachmann-Williams; it seems that they are testing the waters on other than traditional operating trains. They now sell remote control dump cars a couple of operating cars and a few accessories. I envision the Williams O gauge line growing steadily larger and the company trying to edge out MTH and Lionel with a broader offering. Kader-Bachmann-Williams has the distinct advantage as they have complete in-house manufacturing, do their own importing, marketing, sales and can undercut the competition any time that they wish.  Unless Lionel and MTH setup to manufacture here in the USA, Williams may very well be the last brand left standing. The train market is either stagnant or shrinking and the only path to growth is to try and take away the other guys share. 

Somehow, I doubt that.  Kader/Bachmann/Williams has time to market issues, too, along with dividing their resources among the N, HO, On30, WBB and G product lines.  They're still trying to unload some old Williams stock.

 

They have a long way to go to wipe out MTH and Lionel.

 

Rusty

I also doubt it, especially considering that they are offering FEWER products this year compared to before.

 

Fewer means they are responding to a shrinking market with their limited resources. They are investing in the parts of the business where they are bringing in the most money, or shrinking the business as a whole.

The stuff they are "testing the market" with is the stuff that K-Line wasn't selling well enough to stay afloat.  While the law suit may have been the straw that broke the camels back, K-Line was in trouble long before any of those issues surfaced.

 

If WBB sacrifices it's core business (low cost, low tech, well made trains) to pursue a market that may not exist, they may be the next in line for the "used to make nice stuff" threads.

The train market may be stagnant or shrinking in the US, that's why MTH is smart in selling their European line. Remember, they said that the French Chapelon is their largest selling loco ever.The market for the rest of the world is quite large, I'm really surprised Lionel have let MTH grab this market share without a challenge. Lionel could very easily make some "foreign" trains that would be a hit everywhere including the US, but so far, haven't really done much apart from the Harry Potter stuff, which has been a big seller for a long time.

 

The reason why they have less items in the catalog is because the guys there over-extrapolate potential sales based on the sale of one item in one railroad name. They are being too cautious on trying new railroad names and paint schemes every year.

 

Andrew

Bachmann has no intention of phasing out the Williams line....

I'd say they pretty much already have, if you look at what's gone.

 

I would guess that Williams's greatest challenge is their dealer network.  Some dealers still harbor ill feelings about the way Jerry Williams ran the company and undercut his own dealers with direct sales.  The biggest brand name in O gauge has been, is, and will be Lionel and they have the largest dealer network.  The dealers may grumble about some Lionel policies here and there, but they know this is the line that most people know of and want, and it sells, particularly the sets in the holiday season.  MTH is a strong second and has a substantial dealer network and group of loyal customers.  There really isn't much room left for Williams or Atlas, and their reduced offerings suggest that the combination of decreased market size (beyond the initial set) and economics have not been kind to these companies in recent years.  They have their adherents, but they do not have extensive dealer networks (for their three rail products) and do not appeal to the broad base of three rail customers the way Lionel and MTH do is my take.  Bachmann and Atlas have had extensive success and dealer support for their HO and N products, but O gauge is a different story apparently.

Hmm... In my honest opinion.

Greats:

EZ streets and cars

Animated billboards

 

Dulls:

No step in scale equipment, but prices are going up.

No new developments

Still no command? This is what will kill Williams

 

Again, just my opinion, you have to keep up with the technology if you wish to compete.

 

There's still a fair amout of new old Williams in the catalog to go:  2046 Hudsons, 15" aluminum passenger cars, GP9's, Madison cars, 72' heavyweights, etc...

 

I don't think there's going to be any significant WBB expansion until this old stuff gets cleared out.

 

Rusty

I agree entirely.  I think anyone who concludes that is reading the tea leaves all wrong.  

 

Maybe they won't expand the Williams line a lot, quickly, but they have almost entirely a sunk-cost in it - no requirement to spend a lot -- to keep it alive.  Going forward it can only make money for them if managed conservatively.  All the evidence of their catalog offerings indicates they are being tremendously conservative.  

 

When I look at the 2014 Bachmann, MTH or Lionel catalogs (when they come out), foremost in my mind are the tremendous problems and risk all three have with production problems and labor issues in China.  I don't want to make this another thread that devolves into a discussion beating up on that topic, but all three know they are facing great uncertainty on the dependability and on-time/on-quality performance of their Chinese sources of products.  It is causing major heartburn for all of them (and probably Atlas, too).  When uncertainty like that happens, any smart company pulls in its horns until it finds a way to manage/work around it better.  Bachmann's 2014 catalog tells me they don't have confidence they have done that well enough yet to be aggressive in investment and/or promises to their market.

 

Their development of new sound cards, their continued expansion, however modest, of E-Z Street, shows where they want to go, even as their lack of aggressive expansion in their catalog signals they don't want to go bold just yet.  I'm sort of impressed with them, actually.  

Generally speaking it is way too early in a transitional period to determine the course of their direction, despite an abundance of opinions. I did not expect them to run out of the gate with the peddle to the metal and then you add this lackluster scenario of shrinking disposable income. Of course they will be conservative, wouldn't you do the same thing if you were in their shoes?

I think many modelers have all of what they need or want right now, except fpr things like the ATSF high level cars which another company is taking care of.  Steamers are also something best left for very small runs.  Once this excess is run through in terms of both comany stock and consumer need, then the floodgates will open.

I forgot to add that the Sharks are also gone in the 2014 catalog.

 

If you look at every catalog since 2009, you see a very sharp drop off in offerings in 2014.  Almost all traditional Williams designs (not just paint schemes) have been discontinued.  There is a definite pattern.  Perhaps this marks a transition from Williams by Bachmann to K-Line by Bachmann -- adding one new former K-Line engine per year  (I should live so long).

 

Bachmann may have fewer production problems in China, since they are owned by Kader.

 

Will discontinued traditional Williams designs return?  Who knows...  The answer to that is purely speculative.

 

I may be the dumbest duck in the pond, but I believe Bachmann intends to shrink  the Williams brand.

 

Then again, maybe the 2014 catalog is incomplete and rushed to print hastily.  There are some strange oddities in the language and format.  For example, there are recommendations for match-ups for equipment no longer produced.  And how about power upgrades for dummies that are no longer made?  Maybe the employee who worked on it has been reprimanded for leaving out items and leaving in irrelevant text.

 

I think not....

 

I don't think Bachmann rushes their catalogs.  Bachmann has been the most consitant compay when it come to releasing catalogs. 

 

Their catalogs tend to have the fewest typo's and/or poor artwork.  They are perhaps the most guilty of using a product from a different scale to represent a new offering.

 

I think I've only heard of one product cancellation once the catalog was released and that was in G gauge.

 

Rusty

I bought one of their NEW products.  The 4-6-0 set, Lakeshore Limited.

 

What a great Starter Set.  Only one thing with it   The 16 pieces of Roadbed Track look very nice buy the do NOT match up to ANYTHING else on the market.  I think the track in this set is ACTUALLY  ATLAS INDUSTRIAL RAIL ROADBED TRACK as the included 80 Watt Transformer w/variable accessory power is the ATLAS 80W Transformer with a different decal on it.

But overall it was a GREAT BUY AT UNDER $ 200.00 us RETAil.

 

iT  CAME TO $  260.00 Canadian DELIVERED TO ME IN Calgary. tHE CHEAPEST  LlONEL STARTER SET I COULD FIND IN Calgary WAS OVER $ 400.00 cdn

 

As oposed to all the cut and paste errors in the MTH catalog, poor illustrations and vague information in the Lionel and Flyer catalogs catalogs...

 

Never said Bachmann was perfect, but they do much better than most as far as cataloging is concerned. 

 

Plus, Bachmann doesn't play mind games with the catalog releases.  They come out pretty much like clockwork after Toy Fair.  Plus, the online catalog is a simple .pdf file, not some fancy-schmancy graphic-driven program just so you can hear the pages rustle as you flip through them.

 

Rusty