Z1000 to Variable 1 on TIU

KnobKnee posted:

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My plan was to use the 18 volts normally provided to the track via the Z-controller. Since that isn't recommended I need to wire out the Z-controller. Unfortunately the cable from the Z1000 brick to the Z-controller has a connector that I will require an adapter or I'll need to cut the connector and wire directly to the TIU. Any suggestions? 

https://mthtrains.com/50-1017

KnobKnee posted:

I have 2 main loops isolated from each other with power coming from the fixed outs on the z4000 to the fixed in 1 and 2 on the TIU and then on to the power drops for those tracks. All is working well.....

I'm not using the Variable Out 1 or 2 on the Z4000. Any advice on this proposed set up?

 

Just to be clear.  By fixed outs on the Z4000 you mean the 10V and 14V outputs are powering the two Fixed TIU channels?

Thanks Stan2004, that's helpful to know that I can order direct from MTH.

Stan,

By fixed outs on the Z4000 you mean the 10V and 14V outputs are powering the two Fixed TIU channels?

I believe that he misstated and meant the handles of the Z4000.

Barry is correct. I'm not using the 10V or 14V  outputs on the Z4000, yet. Probably use the 14V for some accessories later. 

I'm wondering if the 18V output of the Z1000 is sufficient for track power when running all DCS.

This is no doubt explained somewhere in one of Barry's books, but it's a question of available power.  

Perhaps over-complicating matters, but the Z4000 can supply ~400 Watts of power total.  The Z1000 can supply ~100 Watts of power total.  The nameplates on the devices kind of break it down as to how the available power can be split between the various outputs.  It's somewhat annoying that the ratings use a mix of V, A, VA, Watts...all related but can make your head spin.

As I see it, your Z1000 (~100 Watts) will have plenty of power for what you're proposing; I figure you're not zooming your engines around in your yard - it's high mainline speeds and going up grades that really demands power.

If for whatever reason you see your Z1000 breaker tripping, you can move your Accessories/Switches over to the Z4000's 14V output.  That is, the 100 Watts of Z1000 power is shared between its 18V and 14V outputs.

Stan,

you can move your Accessories/Switches over to the Z4000's 14V output.

That's very good advice!

Not really sure. When I was testing the layout I used the two handles on the Z4000 to power all the track. Ran two passenger trains with 5 lighted cars each and AB powered PS2 and 3 Diesels. I also had three other PS3 diesels running around in the yard. I have one other ABA PS2 Diesel passenger train that will bring 2 three the number of passenger trains running at the same time. I had no issues with power or signal on my large layout. 

How do I determine the amps I need?

Thanks Stan. So, if I move the power to the switches off the Z1000 and instead use the 14V out on the Z4000, that would allow the Z1000 to utilize it's total amperage powering just the yard tracks?

Since you have a Z4000, you can use the V and A indicators for each output to ball-park some number.  As you're running your various configurations watch the V and A.  The V will probably be somewhat stable at 18V or whatever.  The A will bounce around depending on what's going on.  Multiply the V and A readings to get an idea of VA or Watts (same thing for this application) you're demanding from the Z4000.  For example, V reads 18, A reads 4.  That's 18V x 4A =72 VA or 72 Watts.

You can temporarily power your yard with one of the Z4000 mainline outputs set to 18V - this will let you get a handle on the power requirements for yard activity.  Mess around with whatever you do in your yard.  Again, the V display will be stable around 18V...maybe bouncing around a bit but very close to 18.  The key is to watch the A reading.  Again, the numbers will bounce around but you'll soon get a feel for what's going on.  Multiply V and A to get the VA or Watts total.  Then compare if this is anywhere near 100 Watts.  I don't think it will be anywhere close to 100 Watts in a yard.

Separately, if you're so inclined it might be "fun" to note the power requirements of your passenger cars.  In other words with 18V on the track, watch how the A (Amp) reading changes if you add/remove the lighted cars.  I'm assuming you have incandescent (vs. LED) cars.  These cars can draw about 10 Watts each!  That's why a lot of guys convert to LED lighting where each car might draw closer to 1 Watt.  Obviously 10 Watts per car can be a burden if you only have 100 Watts total available!

So, to answer your question, "yes".  If you move your Accessories/Switches to the Z4000 14V AC output, you'll have the "full" 100 Watts of the Z1000 to power your yard engine(s) and passenger car(s).

There won't be any speeding trains on my layout. Here is a PDF of the RRtrack layout.

Thanks Bary and Stan. All my passenger cars are currently incandescent. I will be converting them and most accessory lighting to LED's. I do have the Woodland Scenics Just Plug system and will be experimenting with it for much of the lighting of buildings and street lights.

I have a 911 train with 3 MTH PS3 911 diesels several lighted cars plus two passenger and a lighted caboose. At the same time I have 6 Lionel 21" passenger cars on the same Z1000 and have NEVER had a problem yet! 911 train is 36 cars so it draws so amps with three engines and all those lighted cars.