3rd Rail Mohawk LEGACY Conversion

Brass legacy conversions. We know all about that don't we Bruk 😅😅. Looking good.

Did you add all this detail?  That looks really good!

That cab is astounding!

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Did you add all this detail?  That looks really good!

John,

As far as I know its factory painted.

Your Challenger was Bruk painted though 😉

Bruk, the Challenger and that Mohawk both look great.   I was surprised to see that much painted detail from the factory, even in a 3rd Rail.

This should be cool to watch! Curious as to what components you’ll use. I hate smoke and use it sparingly in a few diecast engines. Can it be dummied out?

This is a great model but I sold mine off during my NYC purge last year.

Awesome.

I am more curious to see how it will run without its lead weight. I assume that has to go to make room for the added smoke units.

Pete

What’s a ballpark figure to convert one?  Would the displayed speed number on the Remote correlate well with other legacy engines?   If I set my engines to the same number they run close to the same speed and trains don’t catch each other.  It’s one of the features I like over tmcc as there is much less speed adjustment to do during a run session.

David, you can "tune" the tach tape to get them close as long as the gear ratios aren't in the western weeds.

No tach tape with Legacy. You have to find a RCMC for an engine with the same wheel diameter and gear ratio.

Pete

@Norton posted:

No tach tape with Legacy. You have to find a RCMC for an engine with the same wheel diameter and gear ratio.

Pete

Yep. Like Pete said there is no tach tape. Instead there is a sensor with an encoder ring, which the encoder ring is the same on all locmotives. The difference is the gear ratios programmed into the RCMC. Most common one being 16:1. The gear ratio is what will determine the locmotives similarities at speed steps. I believe this Mohawk has a near 20:1 ratio. Bruk may be able to tell us exactly what it has.

@davidbross posted:

What’s a ballpark figure to convert one?

Send me an email.

@Norton posted:

I am more curious to see how it will run without its lead weight. I assume that has to go to make room for the added smoke units.

Pete

The RCMC board is going into the engine the lead weight will stay. I had to cut and remove 1/2” of material off the lead weight on motor side for the board to clear the motor. Ill show pictures later of the board mounted in later postings. Its a real tights fit in there.

Lionels DSMK smoke unit will be used so I wont need space for two units.

@Norton posted:

No tach tape with Legacy. You have to find a RCMC for an engine with the same wheel diameter and gear ratio.

The mohawk has a 25:1. Ill be using a board that has 20:1. Lionel does not have anything. That a RCMC board can support. The B6 has a 28:1 but the board does not support whistle steam.

I had success using this same set up on the 3rd Rail T1 I converted. It shifts the beat. But it doesn’t give you a weird chuff rate.

I’m finding wheel size is not an issue with these.

I would think matching gear ratios will give the 4 chuffs but unless wheel diameter is the same will they still match speed with other Legacy engines?

Pete

Bruk, my question is similar to davidbross above.....  I went ahead and sent you an email.   Chris a

@Norton posted:

I would think matching gear ratios will give the 4 chuffs but unless wheel diameter is the same will they still match speed with other Legacy engines?

Pete

The chuffing is part of the RCMC. It Chuffs every quarter based on how many rotations of the flywheel.

@Norton posted:

I would think matching gear ratios will give the 4 chuffs but unless wheel diameter is the same will they still match speed with other Legacy engines?

Pete

Gear ratio is everything

@Bruk posted:

The mohawk has a 25:1. Ill be using a board that has 20:1. Lionel does not have anything. That a RCMC board can support. The B6 has a 28:1 but the board does not support whistle steam.

I had success using this same set up on the 3rd Rail T1 I converted. It shifts the beat. But it doesn’t give you a weird chuff rate.

I’m finding wheel size is not an issue with these.

Bruk, if may ask, when does the red flags show up?...is there a certain cutoff point where the 20:1 RCMC just isn’t gonna cut it?...so if the Mohawk’s 25:1 works ok with the 20:1 RCMC, I’m just curious based on your experience, does 27, 28, or 29:1 start to get challenging as far as chuffs are concerned, ......I’m just asking, since a lot of brass stuff can have quite an array of gearboxes......sometimes at or above 30:1 .....or can you “get away” with the 20:1 RCMC to save the whistle steam feature??......

Pat

@harmonyards posted:

Bruk, if may ask, when does the red flags show up?...is there a certain cutoff point where the 20:1 RCMC just isn’t gonna cut it?...so if the Mohawk’s 25:1 works ok with the 20:1 RCMC, I’m just curious based on your experience, does 27, 28, or 29:1 start to get challenging as far as chuffs are concerned, ......I’m just asking, since a lot of brass stuff can have quite an array of gearboxes......sometimes at or above 30:1 .....or can you “get away” with the 20:1 RCMC to save the whistle steam feature??......

Pat

Well there is a variety of RCMC gear ratios. There is a 16:1, 20:1, 28:1 and a 36:1. While the RCMC may be an option, the encoder pcb must be able to mount onto the motor and have the flywheel with the encoder ring. If that can't happen, then no go on the RCMC. There of course is the BEMC, but that's a whole different story.

@harmonyards posted:

Bruk, if may ask, when does the red flags show up?...is there a certain cutoff point where the 20:1 RCMC just isn’t gonna cut it?...so if the Mohawk’s 25:1 works ok with the 20:1 RCMC, I’m just curious based on your experience, does 27, 28, or 29:1 start to get challenging as far as chuffs are concerned, ......I’m just asking, since a lot of brass stuff can have quite an array of gearboxes......sometimes at or above 30:1 .....or can you “get away” with the 20:1 RCMC to save the whistle steam feature??......

Pat

If we are talking about whistle steam, I know the 16:1, 20:1, and 36:1 have an RCMC with whistle steam available. 28:1 I do not know.

@Sid's Trains posted:

If we are talking about whistle steam, I know the 16:1, 20:1, and 36:1 have an RCMC with whistle steam available. 28:1 I do not know.

Ahh, ok,...makes sense, there are other options as gear ratios can change, ...especially in brass conversions, ....those gear box numbers can be everywhere’s,...

Pat

gut it and run command!

It rules!!!

Sorry, copied from another post. Carry on. I admire your great work. I love smoke. I want any steamer on my layout to have smoke. All the bells and whistles too.

@harmonyards posted:

Ahh, ok,...makes sense, there are other options as gear ratios can change, ...especially in brass conversions, ....those gear box numbers can be everywhere’s,...

Pat

Tell me about it. That's why I didn't do a RCMC in my 611 J. It has a 44:1. Plus if I did that I couldn't fit whistle steam.

@Norton posted:

No tach tape with Legacy. You have to find a RCMC for an engine with the same wheel diameter and gear ratio.

OOPS, thinking about PS/3 here...  Of course I know what a Legacy encoder looks like.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

OOPS, thinking about PS/3 here...  Of course I know what a Legacy encoder looks like.

Everyone has their moments. At least you were still thinking about trains.

Looking forward to the video of this running.  How much do you want for it????

@superwarp1 posted:

Looking forward to the video of this running.  How much do you want for it????

IDK if you are being sarcastic or not so I thought I might mention that's its a customers locomotive. I highly doubt it's for sale LOL.

I don’t care, how much does the customer want for it

Bruk needs to buy up all the old  reliable tmcc stuff and upgrade it.

I have half a mind to dump my legacy h10 and replace it with an upgraded tmcc h9 . At least it would have a bullet proof gearbox as well as a Pittman motor to go with it.

I forsee some factory legacy power train failure posts in the future ,with that 4 gear gearbox. I've already had one on its way out.

@RickO posted:

Bruk needs to buy up all the old  reliable tmcc stuff and upgrade it.

I have half a mind to dump my legacy h10 and replace it with an upgraded tmcc h9 . At least it would have a bullet proof gearbox as well as a Pittman motor to go with it.

I forsee some factory legacy power train failure posts in the future ,with that 4 gear gearbox. I've already had one on its way out.

Or see if Bruk or Sid would Legacy a dead MTH H10?.....

Pat

@harmonyards posted:

Or see if Bruk or Sid would Legacy a dead MTH H10?.....

Pat

We are an email away.

@harmonyards posted:

Or see if Bruk or Sid would Legacy a dead MTH H10?.....

Pat

Good point Pat. Then it would actually look like an h10!

@Bruk posted:

We are an email away.

There ya go @RickO ....act now, operators are standing by, reserve your spot today! Spots are filling fast! Don’t delay! Call or click today!

Pat

I’m well into this project:

But here is a SNEEK PEEK at speed step “1” off the RCMC

That belt drive strikes me as much better than a worm and spur gear. Less wear and easier/cleaner maintenance.

MELGAR

@MELGAR posted:

That belt drive strikes me as much better than a worm and spur gear. Less wear and easier/cleaner maintenance.

MELGAR

Never have had an issue with 3rdrail belt drives.  With legacy added that engine will be smooth as silk

Bruk, is that motor running on straight DC or an RCMC? 3rd Rail belt drives are very smooth right out of the box.

Pete