Are the modelers disappearing in our hobby? The hobbyist who adds the extra details to make it more prototypical. The scratchbuilder! Are your engines and rolling stock going right from the box to the rails?
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I am a modeler, to get what I want, but....I am no spring chicken (except maybe as compared with Queen Elizabeth II and her classmates). This forum shows there are a lot of modelers and bashers and scratchbuilders out there, and skilled ones, too, but....they all may be up in years. I don't know if the cell phone generation can or has built any kind of a model....I strongly suspect many have not. Maybe, I hope, some activity is going on in HO and N. In shows it looks like some are building kits for those scales.
Not really able to address the issue. Lamententably, I lack the skills to do the incredible stuff "real" modelers do. When possible I buy rather high-end models, already highly detailed.
When I have to, I do what little I can to "improve" an off-the-shelf, "mass-market" product like this one . . .
The guys who have the skills to fix pilots, lower bodies, and repaint, have my greatest admiration. But, I'll never be there.
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I have never been a modeler, so to speak, in the O gauge arena, in the 48 years I've had Lionel (and now MTH) trains.
I do some electronic add-ons such as TMCC retrofits into my Postwar stuff, but other than that, I buy, I unwrap, I run.
My equipment customization is reserved for my music/touring gear.
I have no idea how you can actually get anything close to a reliable answer to that sort of question since the pool of responders is limited to just this forum's members.
Given the amounts of detail parts, kits, and "stuff" that was being sold at the last Chicago meet, I'd say that there's no shortage of "modelers" in the 2-rail community, although they may be a small minority of folks present here.
I have very few cars, rolling stock, etc., that came in a box except in many bits that had to be assembled. I have many cars, rolling stock, etc., that are entirely scratchbuilt. The great minority of items arrived here in a box and directly went on the rails.
I've read the same concerns about flying model airplanes. Those who like to build them from scratch or kits worrying about people purchasing ready to fly models.
Why be concerned? Folks should enjoy their hobbies as they wish.
Not quite a modeler yet, but I'm learning 
When buying a locomotive, I always check to see if sounds are accurate, lights are in the right place, etc. If not, then it's a pass!
My scratch building days are over! It is almost impossible to find scribed siding for freight cars. It is still fairly easy to find old All-Nation or Athearn cars on ebay and refurbish them. I refuse to pay 60-80 dollars for boxcars, reefers, etc. I still use analog controls but I have constructed my own power supplies using Variacs. With many more windings than Lionel transformers you can actually get a 1615 to creep around the track at a slow speed. Kool!!!!
Unfortunately, the population of the hobby as a whole is disappearing.
It's everyone, not just the modelers. Further, I expect that all aspects of the hobby are shrinking at about the same rate, with the possible exception of collectors, who may be disappearing somewhat faster.
They're out there. Since their hobby is centered around modeling as opposed to internet posting like many (if not most) here, you won't be aware of them by reading this board.
Bob posted:They're out there. Since their hobby is centered around modeling as opposed to internet posting like many (if not most) here, you won't be aware of them by reading this board.
Precisely my point!
"It is almost impossible to find scribed siding for freight cars."
You have got to be kidding me! 
It's readily available from Northeastern, Kappler, and Mt. Albert. And, I could have gotten stacks of it at the Chicago meet last month, but I don't need any right now.....
They're definitely out there. We have a few of them in the club but only one, Dustin, posts here.
You know, the 3 rail arena is not the best rock to look under to find "modelers". There are some. You'll find a lot more in the 2 rail world, all scales.
I don't happen to be one. I would rather spend my time doing other things on my layout. For me, it just has to look like a train and convince the casual viewer. 99% of people can't tell the difference between an E-7 and an F-7 anyway, one train is the same as the next. I actually have to look at the box or a diesel spotters guide to tell.
AGHRMatt posted:They're definitely out there. We have a few of them in the club but only one, Dustin, posts here.
You are definitely right Matt. I belong to a club too and the key word is a few..........
Big_Boy_4005 posted:99% of people can't tell the difference between an E-7 and an F-7 anyway, one train is the same as the next. I actually have to look at the box or a diesel spotters guide to tell.
I still have a problem telling the difference between an F-3 and an F-7 
Rusty Traque posted:
Definitely.
I am 58 now. I figure I have another thirty years of building structures left in me.
Alan Graziano
"I still have a problem telling the difference between an F-3 and an F-7"
4
Don
Penn-Pacific posted:Big_Boy_4005 posted:99% of people can't tell the difference between an E-7 and an F-7 anyway, one train is the same as the next. I actually have to look at the box or a diesel spotters guide to tell.
I still have a problem telling the difference between an F-3 and an F-7
Me too.
I was actually going to use those as my comparison, but that was too subtle. E's and F's are much more obvious, and non railroad types still wouldn't know.
I rest my case.
I have only built a few cars but consider myself a modeler. I have many, many buildings and wouldn't think of buying a ready made one. All my buildings are kits or built from scratch. Some built board by board. Same with trestles. Don
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Rusty Traque posted:All you got to do is look at O Scale Resource magazine.
Holy cow, I'd never heard of that before. Thanks for the link!
PAUL ROMANO posted:Are your engines and rolling stock going right from the box to the rails?
Well, Bachmann made exactly the loco I wanted (ET&WNC ten wheelers in On30), in a good scale and the exact paint job I wanted (WW2 era black and gold). They even made the right road numbers. I have, however, added tender headlight covers, real coal, crew figures, builder's plates and a few little things before I get to weathering them lightly (they were kept in clean condition then). So yeah, to a degree, they came out of the box with a little detailing but not much.
My other rolling stock? Yeah, they all had to be stripped, re-painted, decaled and weathered. But still, the boxcars and tank cars weren't modified as such.
I do have one ready-built structure, a Woodland Scenics gas station but that was heavily modified to remove all the postwar stuff. I added a lot of pre-war signs and details like that. I have two Grandt Line kits for small depots and the rest is scratchbuilt. I agree that not a lot of people are doing things for themselves as such, as I've had several people see my layout during construction and have them ooh and ah over the stuff that clearly didn't come out of a box that way. But I'm hardly a master modeler, though.
Is it because they're normally pleased with so much less? Probably.
But we all know people in this era of pre-built stuff that use just that.
With jobs demanding more time than they have since the robber baron era, can model railroaders be blamed for buying into the pre-made stuff? I have to shoehorn my projects into the night hours as it's the only time I can devote to much on the layout. I can't imagine anyone with a job like mine that will hardly allow for any time off, then have to handle a bunch of kids at the same time. How could those folks lay down any track at all?
I have this bad habit of getting a new loco or piece of rolling stock and pulling it out of the box and ripping it apart to detail it per prototype photos. Nothing stays "as made". Engines (modern) get blacked out grill screens and the cast in grills get black washed with a thinned out black paint that flows into the details. Trucks also get black washed to bring out the details. Other details get painted too. Rolling stock usually gets lowered to look more prototypical. I always look up pics of the prototype to get ideas. I am working on a Atlas O Amtrak California Dash 8 that has already received the black wash treatment and will get properly painted yellow handrails on the cab hood area as well as removing the motors to have a non powered with lights, sound, and smoke ( I run DCS).
If I new how to post pics, I would. This one is going to look great!
I dont know if this is considered modelling but................. Paul
CHANGE .....the only constant.
Times change....the hobby and the amount of time we can spend on it change......in the 1950's MOST adult men, and kids, had basic model skills picked up by needing to be 'handy' with repairs around the house and cars. My son-in-law is still looking for the left handed screw driver I said I wanted for my birthday. But he knows more about MRI and x-ray systems than anyone I know....same for other 'new' things like an iPhone.
Different times.
From my recent conversation with a hobby shop owner whose parents started the business in the late 1940's most, but not all, of the individuals buying HO train, RC airplane and plastic model kits and supplies are us senior citizens. I remember, occassionaly in the 1950's, receiving a plastic airplane, ship or car kit as a kid and putting it together. Never painted, puttied join seams or sanded the molded parts for fit just glued it together, going forward to 2012 I purchased some 1/48 scale WW2 warrbird kits at the local Hobby Lobby and built them a painted quality models.
Same with the return to a quasi-O scale model hobby in 1992, the vast majority of my freight cars are Weaver with lesser percentages of Red Caboose, Intermountain, AtlasO and some MTH cars. I like the detail and scale size of these cars, the only difference from being true O Scale I use three rail trucks and couplers with Gargraves Phantom track. In 1992 I went to the DuPage County train shop in Wheaton,IL., walked the halls and saw highly detailed unpainted rivited plastic boxcars and gondola cars kits molded in black plastic in white boxes made in Austria, the old Roco kits scale sized. Prices were around $15.00/car, and I used Andy Petersen's(Petersen Supply) adapter plugs to mount Weaver Bettendorf trucks to the carbodies.
Cars needed to be painted and decaled, purchased the air brush, compressor and air regulator, Floquil enamel paints, and Champ decals. Next came the establishment of the period of the layout, late 1940's through 1965, additional car purchases and engine ( steam and diesel) purchases and building the layout still in progress, being in my mid-60's still enjoy building and wiring the layout, building car kits,structures and bridges and air brush painting and decaling cars, today, I use the Floquil enamel and Pollyscale acrylic paints. In summary, the Sunday train show meet at the Dupage County Fairgrounds in 1992 was my reintroduction to a rewarding and at times intectually challenging, never boring,hobby. Also responding back to the topic of this post, over a 24 year period this hobby has changed, Floquil and Pollysale are gone as are Champ and Walthers O scale decals, no more Roco,Intermountain or Red Caboose kits, it is an educated guess that these entities closed from decreasing lack of product demand, scratch building kits are still available, but there is definitely a major shift from "the Modeler" to the out of the box "Purchaser and Operator".
One of my favorite aspects of the hobby is kit building. However, they are harder to find in O than in HO. When I do I snap them up.
Just for grins, how about going to Google, type in ON30 layouts and then click on IMAGES. Just for grins! 
Russ
Another in a long line of doom and gloom posts. Some of you people just won't let go of the "Armageddon is just around the corner" for the toy and model train hobby topic. Somebody has to find another aspect of the hobby that they think is on its way to extinction. OH NO, The hobby is SHRINKING, SHRINKING!!!! Enjoy your trains while your here because when your gone it ain't gonna matter whether it continues to shrink or not. SHEESH!
Anyone else read the editorial in the recent Model Railroader? The editor suggested that the reason why hardly anyone ever got a layout even close to looking finished was because you had to build everything yourself, by hand. I'd never thought of that before recently.
OKHIKER posted:Another in a long line of doom and gloom posts. Some of you people just won't let go of the "Armageddon is just around the corner" for the toy and model train hobby topic. Somebody has to find another aspect of the hobby that they think is on its way to extinction. OH NO, The hobby is SHRINKING, SHRINKING!!!! Enjoy your trains while your here because when your gone it ain't gonna matter whether it continues to shrink or not. SHEESH!
I gotta admit, I am hearing that a lot, along with the whole shtick on how we're each supposed to be pushing the hobby to the public, as if I'm in some sort of odd cult. It's called a hobby because otherwise it's called 'work', and nobody's giving me a paycheck for this. So all that said, I'll enjoy my hobby any [bleep]ing way I want!
I wish I had the time to do actual modelling instead Im just cursed with these devilish good looks. Oh wrong modelling. I built my Korber power plant liek a year and ahalf ago and I really enjoyed it but I have so many projects and jobs to do I jsut dont have the time to do it. I have 22 locos stacked up for repair work right now, building models is the furthest thing from my mind
I don't consider this a "doom and gloom post". Just the Hobby is changing post. I remember going into my local hobby shop as a kid and the shelves were filled with O gauge freight and passenger car kits. Engines (General Models) and more. Parts? Just ask and they would pull out boxes of them. There were two hobby shops and three stores that sold Lionel or American Flyer in our little town. Every boy had a Lionel Train. A few with American Flyer. Now how many kids have trains. On our island the only trains sold are at Ace Hardware at Christmas and they are HO and G scale. Things change. Don
I'm 45 and have been building freight and passenger car kits for a couple years now. Scratch built a caboose, even. I've now amassed enough supplies to scratch build a pair of reefers I've never seen in O-scale. Scribed wood and plastic are readily available, by the way.
It takes me about a month to build a simple wood boxcar. 5 minutes here, an hour there... I don't feel the need to go fast.
Much more gratifying to build than to buy rtr for me.
We have this guy in the club named Paul whose modeling skills are second to none but he disappeared
OKHIKER posted:Another in a long line of doom and gloom posts. Some of you people just won't let go of the "Armageddon is just around the corner" for the toy and model train hobby topic. Somebody has to find another aspect of the hobby that they think is on its way to extinction. OH NO, The hobby is SHRINKING, SHRINKING!!!! Enjoy your trains while your here because when your gone it ain't gonna matter whether it continues to shrink or not. SHEESH!
I never intended this to be a doom and gloom post. Sorry if some perceive it that way. In my opinion the hobby is very much alive and well. It is also good to see that modeling is still alive and well too.
bluelinec4 posted:We have this guy in the club named Paul whose modeling skills are second to none but he disappeared
Hey Ben, remember what the Terminator said................
There are a few modelers on the OGR.
I don't think modellers are disappearing from the hobby.
I know myself I build lots of things and modify plenty of freight cars.
When you are in O scale you sometimes need structures up to six feet long you have to build them yourself no kits or kitbashing.
I am building a Steel Mill at the present time it requires lots of buildings you have to do it all yourself.
No I think there are plenty of modellers around building and modifying.
Roo.
p51 posted:Anyone else read the editorial in the recent Model Railroader? The editor suggested that the reason why hardly anyone ever got a layout even close to looking finished was because you had to build everything yourself, by hand. I'd never thought of that before recently.OKHIKER posted:Another in a long line of doom and gloom posts. Some of you people just won't let go of the "Armageddon is just around the corner" for the toy and model train hobby topic. Somebody has to find another aspect of the hobby that they think is on its way to extinction. OH NO, The hobby is SHRINKING, SHRINKING!!!! Enjoy your trains while your here because when your gone it ain't gonna matter whether it continues to shrink or not. SHEESH!
I gotta admit, I am hearing that a lot, along with the whole shtick on how we're each supposed to be pushing the hobby to the public, as if I'm in some sort of odd cult. It's called a hobby because otherwise it's called 'work', and nobody's giving me a paycheck for this. So all that said, I'll enjoy my hobby any [bleep]ing way I want!
And here we have the answer to this asinine question that seems to be asked every 5 minutes. I'm so tired of hearing it I could puke! You people asking it need to get a life! Go build something!
Simon
The Scenery Forum used to be a great place for modelers. There were some artists there who were constantly sharing techniques and providing inspiration that was way over the top. Unfortunately, some have been chased away and others no longer post. Topics of 'which brand of kitty litter ' seem to appear in their stead.
They are still out there just beyond the grass mat mentality. I guess we all enjoy this hobby on different levels.
Ron H posted:There are a few modelers on the OGR.
I know quite a few but few take the time to post here. Its been implied that 3 railers tend to go for ready to run, and in large part that is true. That was part of the reason I came back, to take a break from rivet counting, but just when I thought I was out, they dragged me back in with scale models that run on 3 rail track. So yeah, modelers are here, they are just quieter.
Pete
