Big boy boiler overhang

Mine are O-72 But my TMCC and Legacy big boy's will run on my O-60 curves.

096 Gargraves track ( 8' curve) bought a complete circle, 12 pcs., at a train show for $50.00. I'm sure that there still be some overhang.

0-138, 0-150 in 3 rail speak.

Just for reference, here's one on 0-138: 

Wow o-150 it will look admazing on that .. Unfortunately I have o-80

Hello 86TA355SR...........

My scale S.F. 2-10-4 would look good on 0-138 but I have 0-99 and there is some mild overhang.  Even at 0-138 still quite bit overhang on the scale Big Boy .

the woman who loves the S.F.5011,2678,2003,200 and Amtrak 8303

Tiffany

Here's one backing into the turn first, then going forward on O72 Fastrack.  The forward swing looks to be a tiny bit more.

And its all Normal.All Articulated engines have a overhang. So what is the big deal.

I have the JLC Big Boy and and while it will run on my layout (72, 84 and 96 inch curves) it looks ridiculous - drastic boiler stick out, so i mostly leave it on the shelf where it EM-1 yellowstone, H7s, etc., are just about as bad.  They all look terrible even on 96 inch curves.

I have only two articulated locos I run a lot, mostly because they don't have nearly so much boiler stick out, they are the Vision 0-8-8-0 CC2, and the Legacy Mallet 2-6-6-2.   

Nothing a 300" diameter wouldn't cure.

Bruce

Besides the almost $2000 asking price, my lack of a decent radius to run such a large articulated engine caused me to pass on this amazing loco! 

I think we have to take the overhang as unavoidable for our models. There is no way think they could change a scale model to get around it and not have it look terrible.

The other thing we have to accept is that an O-72 turn is no where near realistic. Maybe Rich can chime in but I do seem to remember that the tightest turn in the real world would translate to O-170 or so and most curves would be in the 2-300's

Cause my layout is wall to wall there's only one turn you see mine comming out of so its not real bad .. Looks like about what it is on a challenger .. 

Re the title...could've been a commentary on my Uncle Bruno, da butcher.  He was, indeed, a BIG boy with a 'boiler' overhang!!  But I digress...

My layout was built to O72 minimum.  At the time of its RR-Track design stage, I had no plans to run articulateds.  Then, I succumbed to a JLC DRGW Challenger several years back.  Why?  Dunno.  Maybe cuz the wife's favorite flag is DRGW? 

So I made some careful measurements of that engine's overhang on O72 in order to ensure clearance to this-and-that around the layout.  Tunnel portals on curves and curves on approach to bridges were my biggest nemeses. 

But, I have to agree with Lee...it looks ridiculous.  It only made a test run before I 'dropped the fire' and set it on the shelf.

Hey, Lee!!...Maybe boiler overhang would look better if one were slightly hung over?

B'sides...I think Veranda Turbine's 'overhang' is much classier.....IMHO, of course.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...

Because this is about the maximum amount of overhang for a Big Boy:

Rusty

And that's the real thing and not the toys we are playing with. Most don't have the radius so they just have to live with the overhang.

Even with a curve diameter of 240 inch, as I have on my garden layout, the overhang of the MTH bigboy is clearly shown:

Regards

Fred

Nice video overhang didn't look bad to me.

Thats awesome but at 240 you think it have 0 overhang.

That's why the 2-point articulation method where both engine sets pivot as pioneered by Rivarrossi in the 1960's (and used by Lionel on American Flyer, LionMaster and MTH on Railking) is preferable.  It redistributes and deemphasizes the overhang.

Rusty

I never seen one of them but thats what I was thinking today .. Why not have them both rotate and it would fix that .

I sacrificed some straight sections in favor of the broader curves.  It'll pay off in the long run.  I'm going to run 21" passenger cars also, so I wanted to limit the amount of overhang on both models.

I was surprised at the overhang on 0-138 also.  Thought there'd be close to none.  For me, I can't accept any more overhang than this.  I just don't like the way these look on small radius curves.  Opinions vary, that is mine.

The Challenger looks better on the same radius track because it is shorter, not as much leading pilot.  My Challengers look great on 0-138!

I have a UP 4-12-2 rigid frame and it looks worse than the BB on anything tighter than 0-138.  The UP had the same problem; 4-12-2s were great in the open country, but in the mountains, the rigid frames were restricted.  There's irony for you!  

If there's enough interest, I can post a Challenger and UP Type picture on 0-138.

No matter what radius you run, enjoy your new VL BB!  Mine hasn't shipped yet and I'm dying to get it.  

Also, do a 'search' on this subject, there has been some great threads posted in the past.

Even if this engine was only a 100 bucks I'd still have to pass on it due to the overhang.  With double main line and 0-72 curves, the big boy would be hitting trains on the other line

Then you should have spaced the double track a bit further apart. I used 5" to 5 1/4" center to center spacing and can operate any full size "scale" articulated and/or 21"  "scale" length passenger cars, with no problems.

True, but you're also running a larger locomotive, so the translation to O-gauge has to be considered.

I can tell you that 4.5" track spacing doesn't get it for these engines!  Don't ask me how I know that.

There's 3 easy ways to make the boiler overhang less apparent with less than visually ideal curves:

1) Watch your layout operations at eye level.  After all how often do you watch real trains from the vantage point of a helicopter like the overhead shots above anyway?

2) Watch your Big Boy only on straightaways.  Look away at something else while it's in curves.

3) Conceal your curves with scenery, like tunnels, trees, or buildings.

For $2000 I'd send it back to Lionel and request that they fix the overhang, its unacceptable.

I'll get right on that Rick.

The "2-point articulation" mentioned above is one that I like - mostly. It essentially is a diesel locomotive with a rigid frame, 2 vertical can motors (in O, anyway) and 2 swiveling trucks - but it's wearing a steamer's party clothes.

I have a couple of RK (former) 2-8-8-2's that have been project locos. I like them very much, and not only is there less front overhang (not just because these are smaller than the BB, etc), the locos ride more realistically. What do i mean? Look at the boiler front of a large articulated (the model, that is) as it goes down anything but perfect track (most track), or dives into a curve. Lurches back and forth, up and down. Normal movement for an articulated - but wildly exaggerated in the model.

One downside of 2-point: you trade the front boiler overhang for rear cylinders that completely inaccurately swing back and forth under the boiler - so wrong. Depends on your demons, and how apparent it is on your curves.

====

I recently received a slightly damaged (and therefore cheap) Right-of-Way scale, brass UP

2-8-8-0 Bull Moose. I was surprised to find that this scale, brass steamer had the RK-style

"2-point" design. (Nice model, BTW; good, basic detailing.) 

My smaller diameter is 072 but even the larger diameters are not large enough for these articulateds to look prototypical.  It is a "compromise" that you must make if you want one...or you will have to have a stadium sized layout..LOL!!

Alan

I think I recall this one; I was bidding on it also.  Sorry if it was you.  You still got a great deal on it, if it was the same one.

Decided it wasn't for me when we got to a certain price.  Wasn't what I had in mind for a future project.

I'd like to see the pictures as you progress with it.  You always do such nice things with your projects.

I sure wish someone would make a nice 3R UP 2-8-8-0 Bull Moose.  I bidded on a 2 rail PSC one at an auction-it went for what a new VL BB sells for.  I let it go because I was going to have even more money in it converting it to 3R.  The PSC Bull Moose was beautiful, one of the nicest steam engine models I've ever saw from any manufacturer...

Gunrunner, On your 072 pictured above how far is the swing from the center rail?

Uh Oh....Someone is thinking about a BB on his nice, new, wonderful layout he's building!

Actually no I'm not.  Just want to make sure my friends can safely run theirs

It appears that anything closer than 4 " to the outside rail on a 072 curve will be hit by the BB.  As John mentions, dual tracks would need larger center lines so it'd probably be wise to double that distance in case another BB or 21" passenger cars are on the adjacent track.

For what it is worth the front boiler over hanger with my MTH Premier Big Boy is(are) on GarGrave track center rail to edge:

O72-3 1/16"

O80-2 15/16"

O89-2 13/16" 

O96-2 5/8"

O106-2 9/16".

Ron

What I'm more interested in is the needed clearance from center of track to a wall on an 072 curve?  Any help is appreciated.

Why all this angst over the overhang on the big boy?

No matter what size curve you have from O72 to infinity, just run it and have fun, that is the only thing I'm concerned about. 

Geez too many of you guys are just looking for problems, run them you will feel better.