Anyone know where to obtain the correct tool to remove the screws that hold the CW-80 transformer together? I can't "fix" it if I can't open it. Any other way to open it up? Thanks.
Brian
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
The screwdriver needed to open it is a TA27. Or file an existing screwdriver to fit.
I got a cheap set of security drill bits from Harbor Freight Tools and they worked just fine to undo the CW80 case.
If you buy a set of those security bits. You normally find the bit holder is to large in diameter to fit down the holes in the CW-80 case.
If you take the bit and cut a slot (with a angle grinder(slitting disc)or hacksaw) in the back end of the bit to fit a plain slotted screwdriver. Then drop the bit down the hole in the CW-80 case and use the screwdriver to undo the screws in the normal way.
Hope that makes sense.
Nick
This is the set I bought:
If you take the bit and cut a slot (with a angle grinder(slitting disc)or hacksaw) in the back end of the bit to fit a plain slotted screwdriver. Then drop the bit down the hole in the CW-80 case and use the screwdriver to undo the screws in the normal way.
Clever!
I run into similar issues trying to open other cases from time to time. I'll have to remember this trick.
Thanks Folks! The proper tool is indeed the TA27 triangular screwdriver. Since I didn't own one of these jewels, I did as suggested and made one from one of the inexpensive Harbor Freight Phillips screwdrivers. Worked fine. Boy, are those screws long! Anyway, now I am half way to where I want to be. Hopefully I can identify why the transformer doesn't work properly and fix it. Thanks again.
Brian
Goshawk posted:This is the set I bought:
That is the set that I bought for $ 10.99 from Amazon. It has the TA27 driver in it.
Sean
It is possible that the in-line glass fuse inside the transformer blew. I rewired mine by putting a fuse holder in and mounting it from the outside. If the fuse blows I just remove the screw cap and replace the fuse. I use 10 amp fast blow fuses.
Just in case someone wants to see one cw-80 apart. Here is a few pictures.
Long time ago I took one old junk one apart just to see what it looked like.
Larry
Attachments
Images (7)
Gentlemen,
Many of you know my opinion of CW-80 Transformers already. It does totally amazes me that you guys spend more money on a set of tools to repair an entry level transformer, than the transformer is actually worth. I know how our hobby becomes totally addicting, I do some of this craziness myself, and if it makes you happy and you enjoy fixing things, go for it!
PCRR/Dave
Invest in a good quality Transformer, old or new when you can afford too.
Attachments
Images (1)
I completely agree with Dave - LOSE the loser CW-80 and get a reliable Lionel postwar or an MTH Z-1000 transformer instead!
If anybody has a CW-80 they're not using and can spare the microprocessor, I'd be happy to pay shipping and handling.
That's the part gone on mine. I believe it's programmed at the factory and I don't believe Lionel sells either the board or microprocessor.
The first run of CW-80's had their problems. Later ones are far better than the bad mouthing that they get from a few here.
I had three in a department store that were ON FOR 5 YEARS. And were still working when we took the display out. (Trains ran for 2 minutes when the button was pushed, but the transformers were ON for 5 years. ) Transformers would short when trains derailed, and then be reset with no issues.
Yup - I've also popped the internal fuse and made a doorstop out of them - and it is made to not be opened by the consumer - but the cost of these transformers from breakups, or from those who have upgraded, make them well worth it.
Richie C,
The CW-80 was Engineered as a small entry level throw away type transformer and not meant to be repaired by the customer/purchaser. Lionel in the past supplied these entry level Transformers with the RTR Lionel Train sets, so a child could operate his train set, especially at Christmas time. I recommend you up grade to a better more powerful Transformer as soon as you can afford too. IMO they should never be repaired by the purchaser unless the purchaser is a certified electrician.
Use the CW-80 as a power supply for your Street Car line/ bumper car set up, or cut the electric cord and save it for another job, and throw the CW-80 in the circle 7 file.
Upgrade to a quality power supply as soon as possible.
PCRR/Dave
After seeing those pics I might finally open mine up and replace that noisy fan. And a ball bearing one, not a sleeve bearing!
This is the tool I typically use for work on CW80s 
Sorry, I couldn't resist ....
Attachments
Images (1)
Isnt there a CW40 also? Yep I just saw it on amazon. 85.00..
Jim
Thanks for the info Dave - I'm aware of the CW-80's limitations and have a Z-4K that I'm using to power my layout, but I'd like to save the CW-80, if possible, to run other things, like accessories. I'm not a big fan of throwing stuff away if it can be repaired - in fact, that's one of the problems with the world we live in today - a disposable society where we just throw stuff away if it doesn't work rather than try and repair it.
Although I'm not a certified electrician, I've had more than my share of electronic experience and with a close relative with an EE degree who designs power supplies for a major manufacturer to keep me on my toes, I'm pretty confident I can handle a small circuit board, TAD's and a MP.
carsntrains posted:Isnt there a CW40 also? Yep I just saw it on amazon. 85.00..
Jim
The "CW" family:
1.8 amp 30 Watt PowerMax - no acc output
2.5 amp 40 Watt PowerMax Plus - no acc output
5 amp 80 Watt BW-80 14 volt fixed acc output
5 amp 80 Watt CW-80 - programmable 0-18 volt acc output
10 amp 180 Watt GW-180 - programmable 0-18 volt acc output
Richie C,
If you reread my post one of the uses I recommend for the CW-80 is for Street Car and Bumper Car lines, it actually does a good job used for the correct purpose. However because I had one actually burn up, I will never totally trust them. If you own one unplug it when you leave the room.
GG-4877,
Hay put my CW fine adjustment tool back in the Box, no fair giving secrets away. Don't hit the good cord when adjusting the CW-80 however, save it you may actually need it some day.
Rob,
Listing a junk line of Transformers for the members to see was a good idea, however the the GW-180 is not a bad Transformer, and should be exempt from the list. However the old KW is a better power supply.
PCRR/Dave
Pine Creek Railroad posted:the GW-180 is not a bad Transformer, and should be exempt from the list.
It's the same architecture, the controller is virtually the same with the same logic board and the higher current handling triacs.
It's too bad you had an anecdotally poor experience with the CW. I've had 24-25 of them, sold 22, had one bad one from the early batch. They can't be beat for the going street price of $40- $50.
For my money, the Z-1000's are very reliable units.
ADCX Rob posted:Pine Creek Railroad posted:the GW-180 is not a bad Transformer, and should be exempt from the list.
It's the same architecture, the controller is virtually the same with the same logic board and the higher current handling triacs.
It's too bad you had an anecdotally poor experience with the CW. I've had 24-25 of them, sold 22, had one bad one from the early batch. They can't be beat for the going street price of $40- $50.
I'm having excellent experiences with my three CW-80s. The oldest one is comin' up on ten years, the youngest five years. All three are still going strong. I did have to replace the fuse in one unit due to operator error when testing a home-made bridge rec dc convertor designed to quiet an operating crossing gate solenoid.
Accept it for what it is, a great entry-level transformer. The programmable accessory output is a fabulous feature!
Pete
Rob,
You had 24-25 of them I rest my case, just on those numbers alone.
Purchase a quality Transformer and be done with it.
The Z1000 is the smallest I would ever recommend, the old KW is still a better Transformer, even for Street Car and Bumper Car running. I can usually pick up a good rebuilt KW for almost the same price as a CW-80. The KW is an old life time hand me down type Transformer, the CW-80 is an introductory type throw away.
PCRR/Dave
I have two CW80s that are just a year old. One was bought new because its the only transformer my local hobby shop had other than a ZW (a bit overkill for entry level). The other I got in a pre-owned but new set I bought off a local sales site. Seem to work well.
Jim
Pine Creek Railroad posted:You had 24-25 of them I rest my case, just on those numbers alone.
You left out the part that out of 24-25 only one was bad.
Pete
In all seriousness, I have two good CW80s. I bought one of eBay many years ago and it was dead in the box so the seller exchanged it. The replacement and the one that came with the polar express train set have been good to me. Granted I don't use them often as I really like using the postwar LW for carpet central O27 setups. It is good to know they can be disassembled and fixed.
CarsNTrains,
Purchase a good old rebuilt ZW from Jim here on the OGR his prices are fair and he does quality work that will last you many life times, if you want something smaller pick up an old rebuilt KW. I like the Z4K and the ZW-L as modern Transformers go, course they do cost some money. I am a big believer in quality power supplies for my O Gauge Trains.
PCRR/Dave
Attachments
Images (1)
Texas Pete posted:Pine Creek Railroad posted:You had 24-25 of them I rest my case, just on those numbers alone.
You left out the part that out of 24-25 only one was bad.
Pete
And I still have 3, and the ones I sold were from set breakups and they never came back(this was over 10 years ago). I was kind of glad one failed because that gave me the excuse to open it up for exploration.
Pine Creek Railroad posted:CarsNTrains,
Purchase a good old rebuilt ZW from Jim here on the OGR his prices are fair and he does quality work that will last you many life times, if you want something smaller pick up an old rebuilt KW. I like the Z4K and the ZW-L as modern Transformers go, course they do cost some money. I am a big believer in quality power supplies for my O Gauge Trains.
PCRR/Dave
I am considering a Z4000 but not due to any fault of the CW80. Im trying to figure out my best options. My local Lionel repair guy and Lionel say to run my LC and LC+ engines on DC only to save the pain that AC gives the electronics in them. Im running on 2 wall warts now. Considering 2 72 watt 5 amp DC units. Then I read the MTH transformer is better for electronics than all the others due to a clean sine wave. And I know the units converting AC to DC are prone to failure.
Jim
Jim,
The Z4k is a great transformer, very reliable and with running DCS with the Z4K side receiver, many different options open up using the TR function. The MTH people did this newer type transformer right. Good power and reliability both. Now if I could find a used ZW-L for reasonable money, I would add that new Transformer to my Power station also.
PCRR/Dave
I invested in one Z4K when they 1st came out, and picked up 2 used ones in great shape, making a couple serious good deals, when the ZW-L 1st hit the market and they guys needed money to purchase them. I have had absolutely no problem with any of them what so ever.
Attachments
Images (1)
Say Larry, I just purchased one of the CW80 watt......it has a humming noise for about 10 seconds and then goes away.....everything works on it......what’s the scoop on it.....or anyone else’s advice would be appreciated.....is there a way to get rid of the noise......thanks....EZ Money.....
Transformer hum is kinda normal. By pressing around firmly with a stick or something, you may be able to locate exactly what is humming so we can tell you if that is normal. It's often the plates in the windings and volume varies with the temperature of the unit. A wedge of paper, etc. may be all you need.
They all hum at 60hz (60pulses per second) because that is the rate your home ac waves change direction. (50hz euro)
A stripe of glue on plate edges works sometimes too. (heat tolerant)
The humming for a few seconds at startup with the CW-80 is almost always the fan, it's a cheap sleeve bearing fan and goes bad fairly quickly. For those working on the CW-80, here's a useful reference.
Click on graphic to expand.
Attachments
Thanks John, any chance a few drops of synthetic oil may help....or is it better to change it out.....The page you sent me is appreciated....only issue is most of it is all Hebrew to me.....I’m just a lowly happy retired tool and die maker....with an education but not in electronics....I struggle at times but with help from the right people eventually get things figured out.....
If you go to the trouble of opening the case, replace the fan.
Okay John, I’ll take your advice....
Bah, humbug! I'm equally disappointed in both the CW-80 and the MTH Z-1000. I have two of each, and one of each has up and quit on me. Neither one saw much use before expiring either. 
