Early 50's Lionel trains that have not been set up since 1976.

For postwar Lionel parts, check The Train Tender:

http://www.ttender.com/

Jeff at The Train Tender is the best.

Another great source is Henning's, a sponsor here.  I recently bought reproduction milk car door kits, various other easily damaged or lost parts, just to have the replacements on hand.  What a joy it is to have exactly what you need when reviving dormant equipment.

Try checking that both sets of rollers are actually transmitting electricity on the FM.  Your basic description of the issue hints to me that only one pickup is doing it's job.  A momentary loss of power that consistantly cycles the E unit shouldn't happen if both pickups conduct power.   There are certain combos of engine/switch that inherently have that "not so sweet spot " where they stall, but the PW FM is not normally one of them.  A simple test light in series with the 2 rollers will determine electrical continuity. 

Bruce

When you ask for replacement doors for that old milk car you should know there were two different shades of white plus you need the springs. There were of course bare metal doors on the first cars.

If you cannot find the right white doors I may have what you need.

Rob

Thank you ! There was a broken wire to front set of rollers. I repaired it for now but engine should have wires replaced because the insulation is brittle. Now my Santa Fe 2343 is doing the same thing over uncoupling sections of track. It has no problem going over switches like the Lackawanna.

If the FM was made in 1954 the power wires from the two collectors should be replaced with a heavier ga.  The original wire is too small a ga.  I went with 18ga.  One of the rollers on the santa fe is bouncing up against the collector body when it passes over the center piece of uncoupling track.  Thus creating a short.  Trips it into neutral.  Go with Jeff 4 sure.

If you are buying replacement parts it's helpful to have the part numbers on hand when you speak to the vendor.  Here's a useful source for those numbers:

Olsen's.  After you click on "Olsen's" you'll next click on "Enter the Library" and you can take it from there.

As others have said, Jeff at the Train Tender is terrific, and I KNOW that he prefers that customers call with a part number(s) when ordering or asking questions about what's needed.

Thanks for sharing,was 1976 REALLY!! 40 yrs ago,Really! 

Yea since they were last set up. My dad told me the work horse Santa fe was run hard and I can tell by the rollers that connect to the center rail. The Lackwanna I keep on insidetrack because it goes so fast I don't want it going off the table.  And they were bought in the early 50s until he was about 15 and and girls were more on his mind.

You should replace the rollers on your 2343 with roller assy from 2023  engines. The roller assy on the TM is very hard to find. Not many dealers carry that part. As Oldtimer said, replace the red power wires inside with 18 guage wires.

Rob

I didn't open up Santa Fe. I was afraid to because it runs and didn't want to do more damage. I do want to keep these trains operating . I live in Lancaster PA . I don't want to send them anywhere to be repaired if I don't have to. I do want someone who knows what they are doing and I keep hearing Jeff from ...Brain block.  These mean alot me

Train tender. Maybe not too far too drive if I have to. I'm looking for someone who has done this many times. 

Train tender. Maybe not too far too drive if I have to. I'm looking for someone who has done this many times. 

Depending on where in Lancaster you live, Hennings is about an hour or so from you live. It sounds like these trains mean a lot to you so I think a couple hour trip would be worth it for you. Hennings definitely knows what he is doing.

There should be many guys in the Lancaster area who can help. Just make it known you want help.

Rob

Hennings without question.

Yup, your FM was made in '54 (maroon) top.   Change the wires.  I would go with a whole new collector assembly for the santa fe.  #2343-40  &  #2333-34 insulator.  EZ er than messing with rollers plus  you get new arms and springs.  I had the same problem when I went with the new uncoupling track with the 2343.  What I did was take the white plastic tie that they put on a loaf of bread. Cut it in half in small equal strips and put it on either side of the collector.  Gives you about .040" more clearance.  Sounds bogus but it worked for me.  Been running 2343's and 2321's for 60 yrs.  Picked up a few tricks over the years.   JMHO

bob

You can not "damage or hurt" the 2343 Santa Fe or the 2321 FM if you them it apart. They probably have the original old brown HARD lionel grease.  Trucks should be taken apart, clean out all the nasty brown grease.  Regrease with a 'little" Red N tacky.  Drop or 2 of oil in the oil wicks, and axles.  These old PW loco's are "bullet proof".  They mean alot to you.  Your grandkids will enjoy them.   JMHO

bob

Wave, I'm not that far away from you in New Holland. My email is in my profile if you need any help. 

Wow - great stuff. I expect that some future archeologist will dig up a set like this in a thousand years, then clean and run it. For your Santa Fe's, if the engines are 'really' tired, try replacing the bushings in the power trucks, they do wear, parts are available, and after you get all that nasty Lionel grease out of there and replace with nice new red n tacky, it will run for another 65 years. Don't forget oil on the motor and wheel bearings, grease on the gears.

Jim Waterman

You can not "damage or hurt" the 2343 Santa Fe or the 2321 FM if you them it apart

Just be careful not to cross-thread or over tighten the body mounting screws.
Your 2343 Santa Fe has a small screw in the front, and two larger screws in the back.
Don't loose them, they are an odd thread that is not readily available.
Your 2321 has one screw in each end.

Check the side to side movement of the drive wheels on the Santa Fe.  Make sure the wheels don't rub against the body of the truck. If its hard to see use a feeler gauge.  Bushings might be worn some, but theres a way to adjust them without  pulling the wheels.  You will notice a little hole half way down the motor body.  Fill that with oil. Don't be afraid of tinkering with these loco's. Put a THIN FILM of Red N tacky on the drive gears.  Like Jim said "run for another 65 years".    

JMHO      bob

In my experience, if you fill that hole in the motor casing with oil, it will just seep out past the bearings and make a mess.
I just took a look at the Lionel instructions for the 2343.
Lionel used the terms "oil and lubricant" to mean oil and grease.
Their instructions say the hole is for the "lubricant reservoir".

I do not recommend filling the hole with grease either.

I like to lubricate the Oilite armature bearings with a little light oil applied directly.

Never had that problem with the oil.  I guess it makes a difference what the viscosity of the oil is.  I use Hoppee's gun oil.  Don't know what the viscosity is.  Bottle says high.  Maybe 30/40 wt?  Maybe GRJ knows.   

JMHO   bob

Brasseur Electric Trains has complete collectors #2321-132 for the 2321 FM for $6.90

Never had that problem with the oil.  I guess it makes a difference what the viscosity of the oil is.  I use Hoppee's gun oil.  Don't know what the viscosity is.  Bottle says high.  Maybe 30/40 wt?  Maybe GRJ knows.  

I agree, the oil's viscosity would make a big difference. I tend to use light oils. I couldn't tell you what brand I was using at any given time

If you are ham-fisted and rough, you can damage anything.

If you are careful, gentle, have some sense, and note how things come apart so you can put them back together the same way, you will be fine.

rlplionel posted:

For postwar Lionel parts, check The Train Tender:

http://www.ttender.com/

Thanks for the tip. I am always looking for a parts source and their prices are pretty good also.

I agree with the others, a big thing for the engines and the rolling stock is to clean and lubricate them, if not sure how there are tons of references on the internet on how to lube these engines. After this period of time you might run into problems with the sockets for lights, they usually for the positive contact had this bit of plastic or compressed paper on a spring, that tends to fall apart over time. Wiring is also suspect, the old cloth wrapped insulation they used dries out and falls apart. 

On the motor, the brushes may need cleaning or replacing, and the brush springs may need replacing. You also should clean the commutator on the motor (it is the disc the brushes press against, looks like a disk segmented into sectors), you can clean the surface of the commutator with light sandpaper, and you can clean the spaces between the segments with a small wood stick. 

If the engine is having trouble through the O22 switch it could be the rollers are warped and not making proper contact or the wiring to one of them may be broken. On the switch itself, it is possible that the engine is binding going through the switch which is causing it to twist up off the rails. You could take the engine with the problem and slowly push it through the switch (this is especially true if the problem only happens if the switch is set to the diverging path but works straight ahead). It could be something with the frog being out of alignment or the guide rails have become blunted. If other engines have trouble going through the switch, it could also be that a wire that delivers power to the rails in the switch has broken or a solder joint failed, you would need to take theback cover off the switch to inspect the wiring. 

I also would recommend using tuner cleaner to clean the e-unit and the drum, they tend to get all balky if they haven't been used in a long time, the tuner cleaner both cleans and lubricates it. 

Take a real good look at the shells around the screws in the ends of the FM Trainmaster. If the shell is cracked, the damage is already done. If it is not, back the screws off slightly. You need to remove these 2 screws to pull the shell on the FM. Just be careful when you reinstall it, and not turn the screws too tight. Just snug will do fine.

Chris

LVHR

I have heard the FM's left the factory with the screw hole cracked. Yes 1 end is slightly cracked even though the screws were never removed. Did anyone ever hear of the Strasburg train shop. ( Choo Choo barn ) they send them out to local guy who does their work. It's close to home for me. these engines have never been gone over since they were new. I would do the work if it was my second time. It's the first time mistakes I don't to regret. I found out by flipping Santa Fe over and giving it juice the front motor wants to drag the back until the rear warms up. 

These loco's are  not designed to run upside down.  Bad idea. Most likely its the nasty brown grease the lionel used.  Its gotten hard. Could be a wheel rubbing against the body of the truck.  Its always the rear one that gives the most trouble. Might need new worm shaft bearings.  Needs to torn down and re-greased and oil.  Its really no big deal to go thru it. Just needs to be cleaned up. New brushes. Probably alotta end to end play in the worm shaft.  There's enough experts around here to walk you thru it and save you some greenbacks. Olsens toy trains has a good library of schematics with part numbers you can reference.   JMHO

bob

I have heard the FM's left the factory with the screw hole cracked.

That is thought to be true by the postwar community.

Guess I got lucky.  My "maroon top" FM doesnt have cracked screwholes!  I read they made the first FM shells in '54, a tad bit longer than the mounts.  All Fm's after fit alot more snug. Course you can't tighten them down like your torqueing the  lug nuts on your Z71 silverado 3500 dualee.  lol

Wave,

I'm very close by and I'm comfortable with the basic maintenance your equipment needs. If you still need help, I'd be willing to provide it. Look for an email.

Happy New Year!