Everything that went wrong with Lionel in 1998?

The 1997 763E Hudson that I'm working on had a few issues, primarily that there were some ugly seams in the casting and the grease in the gearbox had turned into some pretty high octane sludge. Took some work and the willingness to strip, grind, and repaint certain parts to smooth out all the issues.

I worked in hobby retail...good God the SP Daylight GS-4 was notorious and had a lot of issues. I had a customer that went through multiple ones getting it fixed. 

I have this engine, bought it mint. What problems did he have?? I have had none so far, although now it takes a while for the sounds to start up in TMCC. Maybe a wire?

Other then the back shop and mohawk with issues, the only piece of crap from that time frame is the Culvert loader!!!! I will stick with my postwar ones instead!!

I must have sent my Mohawk back to Lionel for warranty repairs a million times. Always for a different major issue. Finally, they asked if I wanted my money back. I sent them my receipt and they fully reimbursed me. Also, they had been paying for all the shipping back and forth. Good service but terrible locomotive. I have since purchased the original version of the Mohawk, non TMCC. It is a beautiful well made locomotive and runs superbly.

Well, let's see:

-18064 Mohawk - guess I should be careful before buying one...

-22918 Backshop

-18071 Daylight - already have the new Legacy one, so I don't need this one

-Transformer casings

-18056 Hudson - may or may not get one in the near future

-Culvert loader reissue - considered getting the original anyways.

Anything else to consider?

That was the same year that Lionel lost 3 million while mth gained marketshare and profits.

After that hit, lionel started to listen to their customers. IT also helped that Dick Maddox was put in place at the helm[leasing] of Lionel.

Well, I do know what did come the following year - lower prices, better quality (Texas Special F-3), articulated steam engines (priced right), and improved sounds (introduction of CrewTalk and TowerCom).

I have the 18064 cab # 3005 mohawk. It runs ok. I purchased it after the recall lionel issued for this engine. I have had a little motor work done on the engine, but for the most part it has performed well. However I must admit that as my TMCC roster grew this engine saw less and less runing time. It still spends a good amout of time in the Roundhouse area waiting for an assignment.

Richard

Biggest problem is Bob Grubba was in the office and cost Lionel about 50 million for his antics.

Also the U.P. Veranda was delayed (the first of several times)

Was that the year Lionel did an uncatalogued IC GP-7 with one motor? The GP-7 could barely pull three quad hoppers even when the only engine used with a post war ZW, and I was told that it needed to be run in two or three engine lash-ups to get any pulling power.

Lee Fritz

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Biggest problem is Bob Grubba was in the office and cost Lionel about 50 million for his antics.

The Appeals court reduced the original penalty amount. Bob Grubba was an interesting and sharp train guy but certainly was involved with some unethical scenarios at K-Line and Lionel.

"The Appeals court reduced the original penalty amount."

My understanding is that the Appeals Court vacated the verdict in favor of MTH because, amongst many other irregularities, MTH's expert witness's testimony was considered invalid. Lionel declared bankruptcy as a defensive strategy, and a settlement between MTH and Lionel was reached in bankruptcy court without a retrial.  The terms of that settlement are sealed.

I've read many comments about Bob Grubba, but the man has never to my knowledge been the defendant in any civil or criminal actions, which is  informative, given someone who is  alleged by some to have committed unethical or illegal acts. 

Was 1998 the year of that hideous catalog that was a complete mess to try and read?  Was it the year of the promised "Odyssey" motor? 

Jon

The 50 million number was never anywhere in the picture. In any case, the final settlement between Lionel and MTH for everything (the misappropriation suit and also a separate puffing smoke unit suit) was about 12 million.

Well, that's not much. I suspect not any more problems than practically any year for any of the manufacturers. Probably significantly fewer.

Speaking of GP-7s, is 1998 the year they started putting strobe lights on everything? Messed up some good locomotives (like the ACL GP-7) since even removing left a huge hole in the roof. I was glad when they quit making them.

That was the one!  I never fully understood the idea behind the Oddysey motor.

I'm pretty sure Odyssey came the year after, but it was basically just can-motored engines like the Allegheny and Big Boy. Which, although it did make the trains run smoother, it wasn't true speed control.

I'm pretty sure it was 1996 Lionel started doing that - I.E. the 2380 SP and NYC GP-9's.

One of them was this one, which generated lots of confusion as to why anyone would think it was OK for a pic of an unsupervised kid on railroad tracks.

I don't remember if it was particularly hard reading however.

-Dave

OH!  I have that catalog.  I need to look it over again.

Yes, those 2380 engines came out in fall, 1996. They were revolutionary engines featuring TMCC and RailSounds at a reasonable price with the marketing aim to introduce the train world to those new systems. It was a great success. Still neat engines with great sound.

A lot of people liked the strobes, but purists didn't. At least it was easy to snip the wires if you didn't like them to flash. Fiddling around on one of these Geeps I added an extra lens below the headlight and ran the strobe bulb behind it to create a simulated MARS light.   

There was a true Odyssey motor and a few prototypes were produce, including one that was stolen at York during the show. However during design they found the electronics could be used with can motors with very similar results and it cost less. The real Odyssey motor was scrapped.

As for the picture of the kid on the tracks, I never gave it much concern, but many had their panties in a bunch over it

The Odyssey motor wasn't a speed control per se. It was a motor, one that could be operated very slowly but with good torque, with a feedback system to control speed, but was never marketed. It was described in one of the late 90's catalogs, don't remember which one. While there were some technical problems, those were largely overcome, but ultimately, it was too expensive to produce, and Lionel abandoned it and used the name with a speed control system they developed instead.

Here's a little bit of commentary found by Forum member Chuck from a number of years ago:

The motor would have preserved some of the features of an open frame motor by keeping the field coils. 

The Odyssey is an open-frame motor, so you can watch it work just like the Pullmor motor. And talk about power and torque - we've pulled a long string of cars smoothly as slow as 2 mph in scale speed! And due to the unique operating design of this motor, even if you hit a rough spot when crawling along, the electronic brain automatically compensates and delivers enough additional power to get over the hump- and then adjust back to the original setting. Developed exclusively for use and built in our own factory in Chesterfield this is the motor that will set the standard for generations in 0 gauge model railroading.

The cost of manufacturing the unit was higher than the older "Pullmor" and it probably would take forever to cover the R&D that went into it.  The closed loop back speed control was preserved and the technology adapted to a permanent magnet style can motor.  The Odyssey motors were designed to be stackable when you needed more power than a single unit could handle, for example a diesel could have four electric motors.

Sometimes it doesn't take much.  There was some joking at the time that it was an abandoned line, ready to be converted to a hike and bike trail.

Count me in the "like" group!  I just wish the majority of Alaska RR units I have were fitted with cab-roof strobes (like many of their prototypes).

A 1998 quote from Gary Moreau "this changes everything"  

The only change I recall from that fiasco was to management.

Joe