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Well boys and girls,

In my first reaction to these models I would say I am stunned. Really Scott did everything I asked for 3 years ago and back. Please build me a scale accurate passenger car that is not $800-$1300 a car. I threw out some great examples of what we have in HO; well researched and accurate scale passenger gear that looks right and runs well. AUTHENTIC- a dirty word in our scale these days unless you are prepared to pay a premium for it; custom built Dan Pantera, FM Train Models, or Sam Model.... UGH.

Thanks Scott-

I had read some 3 Rail posts over there last week where a guy says I should buy detail parts and make them better.. HMMMM There is something to be said for reading previous posts here on the OGR. I don't really want to review. The point I am making is yes these GGD cars are slim on underbody almost sans any detail. There is no reason why I can't add the detail I want to see; the point Scott was making in these models that continue to get better and better on each project is saving money to keep the cost down. If he has the builder spend 10 hours on each under-frame installing details that may or may not make the model especially in the case of skirted cars I am ok letting it go. Even my PRB 51' SC set does not end all in detail. These cars are nicely set up but not accurate either underneath. As my friend Roger says if you get a model that is at least 80% correct you are doing very well. I learned this on the E5's with Key Model Imports. This was a challenge I wanted them perfect I tell you but even with a $4000 price tag we had to leave off detail! So how Scott can produce a car like this for under $300 is a mystery and an achievement. They look spectacular and at the price of $2600 for a 10 car set they are simply marvelous, just marvelous. Now comes the fun part for me; detailing on my own. I may finish some full under-frames, maybe. I know I will add steam-lines and where needed due to skirts I will install AC units and battery boxes. I have a pattern!


The PS Vista series observation in my opinion is spectacular. I was so disappointed when it came broken; I am still a little
upset about it and not totally happy. I think it was due to rough handling and a weak glue joint. The rear extrusion has stress pulling away from the rear door. Its not totally straight and I am still considering sending to Scott and taking him up on his offer to restore the car to correct finish. The car was loose in the box, maybe 1" of slack back and forth.. a good jolt from an eager FedEx man and its a small miracle it came in one piece at all! Loose interior furnishings were also common in my set; but not all the dome has some seats floating around that have marred the fabulous carbonate windows from the inside. What can I say I am fussy. I hope Scott takes the time to maybe visit with his builder about a tighter safer packing method?


Love the sink in the latrine, simply marvelous, these models exceed my PRB samples by miles in this area.

Correct PS fluting, a little shallow but marvelous! I wonder how Scott could add some detail to this in the skirting? The seams and doors etc.

I am IN LOVE with the flush windows. WOW, talk about authentic appearance

The dome is fantastic, to be truthful I was doubtful we were going see an accurate dome. The only error
was the lack of the round corners. I am not complaining and I am happy with it. To date this is the BEST dome
I have seen in terms of appearance. The flush carbonate windows are so cool, effect is SUPERB!

The PRB dome is correct, but the gap for the windows totally looses the implied effect.


The interiors in the GGD cars are an improvement, except for the loose seats flying around in there.
I still feel the window frames on the PRB cars are too oversize and spoil the effect.

Ok- OKAY I know this is unfair to GGD.. The PRB car is miles past the GGD car in underbody we know that but this car was $850 MSRP
in 1995.

I like the 2 rail dedication in the PRB cars. PA-LEEEZE can we stop this stupid horse pile 3 rail slash 2 rail thing? PA-LEEEZE!

PRB SC car

The rear end of both cars. Once again considering the cost factor the GGD cars are pretty nice. The PRB
is very nice, a 30% improvement?

Steam Lines- Train Line, and 2 rail dedication, NICE Come on SCOTT lets do this on the next cars. HO gets it!

GGD

Love that end detail on both, PRB has a brake-wheel!


GGD car is simple, yes but still pretty darn nice! The PRB is what can I say almost perfect in this model.

I have never cared for the too much nickel plate and etched name plates on the PRB. Its a little too much- over the top. PRB should dialed back a little. The fluting is gorgeous separate applied- a PRB innovation. Extruded looks nice and is accurate on these cars but sadly is second behind in the authentic department (OPINION--- prove it to us how it isn't?)

PRB

PRB

GGD

The lighting is great. Wish we had battery with a switch... Like Atlas?

Hope my opinions did not tick off anybody too bad.

I love these cars from GGD, just love them! Excited is an understatement.

THANKS SCOTT!


GOOD SHOW MATE!



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Last edited by Erik C Lindgren
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Eric, these things would not be available at all if it were not for 3- rail purchasers.  That fact drives cost and detailing.  The reason PRB and Wasatch were so expensive is that the market simply is not there.  You can plead, but it will not happen - 2- rail is an extremely sparse market.

 

Sort of opinion.

Bob

 

For some Sunset/GGD models 2 rail sales equal or exceed 3 rail.  O scale is indeed a small market.  A slightly different view is that 3 railers wouldn't have the scale models they are seeing from Sunset and GGD without the orders and technical data coming from the 2 railers.  It takes both communities to make the numbers work for Scott. 

 

We'd likely agree that one of the biggest changes in O gauge is the increasing number of 3 railers who want scale detailed rolling stock.  A frequent comment by 3 rail OGR posters is that they don't have the space for 2 rail due to our broad radius curves.  I wonder if there would be a market for an outfit like MTH to produce a line of near scale 2 rail track with 42" (O-84) curves to go along with their 2/3 rail convertible locomotives running with DC/DCC capable PS3 electronics. 

 

Ed Rappe

Last edited by Keystoned Ed

The last couple of runs of SS/GGD lightweight cars are exceptional buys for the money and from the looks of the Super Chief set, SS/GGD is getting better and better at building these. I have their last two Union Pacific sets and they look great. Maybe now we'll see some UP domes. 

 

Are they as detailed and as correct as the Wasatch train I once owned.....no.....but the SS/GGD's can be played with, run and handled without fear of something breaking that drops the value to half. Something to be said about peace of mind. 

 

A lot of bang for the buck in my opinion.  Thanks for posting Erik!

 

Butch

Last edited by up148

Thanks for the Pics Erik.  I've actually never seen the cars as I have a PRB set.  I really tried to get Scott to do the PS Regals rather than the ACF ones so I could use them with my PRB cars but...

 

The reality is the 2-railers drive up the detail and the 3-railers drive down the price.  That is the compromise Scott has to deal with.  $100 more per car would not bother me all that much for the additional fidelity and detail it would add but the 3-rail folks would just walk away and say the MTH and Weaver cars are fine for their price. For me the MTH and Weaver cars are worth zero, I would prefer nothing to having them.

 

Even now the 3-rail participation is dropping like a rock while the 2-rail participation is flat or only slightly increasing.  This is why the quantities situation is such a big deal.

 

The underframe is not negotiable at this price point. He couldn't even get a different underframe for the dome considered.

 

The dome itself was a big deal and the builders went though several iterations getting it down.  The why is simple, a lower version was used on the Columbian dome and the same full height dome will be used on the Train of Tomorrow cars.

 

The Accucraft built GGD Canadian cars will have different underframes for the domes only because that was negotiated 4 or so years ago to compete with the Atlas cars.

 

On a tangent,

 

Delta Models is working on an accurate interior for PRB ACF Regal cars that should work for these ACF Regals if someone is so inclined.

 

I think the interior for the GGD '38 Broadway diner moved their bar higher.  Bob Heil must have done some great upfront work cause it's awesome. 

Last edited by rdunniii

Richard works with me on a lot of these projects, but things go down differently in the design meeting than in our data gathering sessions. Here is an update to what Richard said.

 

We are not doing the same dome on the UP Train of Tomorrow that we did on the Columbian unless the design drawings show this to be true, although the design height is the same, there seem to be subtle differences. We make these projects 1 by 1 and don't look to reusing designs from one to another unless it is warranted to be accurate. There is no tooling on the domes, they are made from etched brass, so the designs change from project to project with ease.

 

The Canadian underbodies are spectacular and very unique to that train. True we negotiated these 4 years ago, but that is not why it was done. It was done to be accurate to that train. I worked with Jason of Rapido Trains to get the underbody designs for plastic tooling since he had just made the same train. I am not sure these underbodies apply to any other models except these specific Budd Cars.  I may make them available for separate purchase once these cars are delivered. Again, thinking outloud.

 

As for 3 Rail orders dropping like a rock, that depends on what project. Our Aluminum projects are fine. Diesels are great, unless we are making something that has just been made by others. Steam engines are in steady decline of demand in 3 Rail. Everyone importing sees that.

 

Scott - China

Last edited by sdmann

The cars featured in this set are the earliest variation of the 1951 SC. Many of the cars still feature the skirting that was indeed later removed as featured in the PRB set that really typifies 1955-1957 era. I prefer the earlier look with skirts as I will also use them in a War Time SC and possible 1941-1949 Chief consist. Even though the names are not right I still can fudge the "early" look far better with GGD cars than the later PRB cars.

 

RPO as follows

 

GGD

PRB

As you can see both PRB and GGD did an exceptional job with this project. I am amazed how terrific the GGD cars are. It is exactly what we need in the O scale hobby. Authentic, accurate models. Granted not as detailed as a brass car but any competent modeler can add to his or her taste. Lest we not forget the days of Midland Reproduction's kits, albeit wonderful in their time; a degree in engineering helps in the construction process. 

Charlie has - https://ogrforum.com/t...36#29305391641846836

 

Also, if you look at the interior colors of the PRB and GGD dome seating, they are different.  PRB red, GGD (I'm too lazy to go downstairs) is another color.  Which is correct, or is it something else?  I can't find a photo of an in service 500 series dome, it's either a B&W photo or an artists drawing for a brochure.  

 

A couple of things other than color are to add people and improve the lighting.  The two LED's don't do it for me.  I'm going to check how Atlas lighted the CZ domes, which has a more pleasing effect.  Otherwise there are tiny SMD Chip LED's I've used for cab lighting in the past.

 

Evan Designs has these chips.  I've use theirs but also used others.

http://www.modeltrainsoftware.com/smd-chip-leds.html

 

 

superdomead1

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Last edited by marker
Precision scale steam line
Precision scale coupler (dummy) kadees are way oversize. Ha!
Pecos river brass air lines
Precision scale draft box

I am glad you like it. I enjoy your videos.

Underbody I am fitting the correct psc generator spicer system and thinking about the main floor; do I scrap the "cookie cutter" or make a new super detail floor?

Not sure yet.

I am in the process of talking with one of our builders in Korea about etching Venetian window shades or a local fellow.image

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Last edited by Erik C Lindgren

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