Hafner?

David from Dearborn posted:

I added the STOP FEATURE to my Hafner/Wyandotte layout as well as a WOLVERINE COAL LOADER that will unload marbles into the V shaped trough of a Hafner gondola.  Here are the videos.

 

David,

I love the action of that Wolverine coal loader with the Hafner gondola.  Wonderful!  

Did the black balls (coal) originally come with the Wolverine coal loader or did you substitute something else?  If the latter, what specific brand, type and size of black balls did you use?

Why is the insert needed?  Won't the black balls work without the insert installed?

Bob Nelson

navy.seal posted:

David from Dearborn posted:

I added the STOP FEATURE to my Hafner/Wyandotte layout as well as a WOLVERINE COAL LOADER that will unload marbles into the V shaped trough of a Hafner gondola.  Here are the videos.

 

David,

I love the action of that Wolverine coal loader with the Hafner gondola.  Wonderful!  

Did the black balls (coal) originally come with the Wolverine coal loader or did you substitute something else?  If the latter, what specific brand, type and size of black balls did you use?

Why is the insert needed?  Won't the black balls work without the insert installed?

Bob Nelson

Bob,

After purchasing a Wolverine Coal Loader I have learned a whole lot about marbles and how easy they jam.  At first I thought that the concept was simple, get a bunch of marbles and dump them into the loader.  I found that they either continuously  jammed or let more than one marble out at one time.  After studying the problem I found that 17mm marbles worked the best, however only 4 marbles lined up in a row in the trough of the loader would work.  The insert I made would allow 9 marbles to line up in an even row (9 marbles will fill up the Hafner gondola).  The side view of the diagram shows 8 marbles, but I found that one more could be added as long as it is added on top of the last row near the end. 

Here is a photo and diagram of the insert.

David,

Thanks for the info.  It was just what I wanted to know.

On ebay I noticed that Wolverine also made a "sand loader" of a similar swinging-arm design.  Do you know anything about this tin toy?

Bob Nelson

navy.seal posted:

David,

Thanks for the info.  It was just what I wanted to know.

On ebay I noticed that Wolverine also made a "sand loader" of a similar swinging-arm design.  Do you know anything about this tin toy?

Bob Nelson

Hi Bob,

Yes, I tried the Wolverine Sand Loader.  When using dry sand, the loader worked fine although it throws the sand around somewhat.  I didn't want to have sand around the layout so I enlarged the opening at the bottom and tried to use small round dried peas instead.  However, just like the marbles in the coal loader, the peas would jam in the opening at the bottom.  I tried enlarging the opening in varying degrees but never could get it to work right. 

Here is an updated plan for the Wolverine Coal Loader insert showing all 9 marbles and 17mm diameter.  One of the common sizes for marbles is 17mm and there are many dealers that specialize in marbles of all sorts of sizes and colors.  I purchased black ones to simulate coal but other colors or fancy swirled coloring might even look like more fun.  Kids love to load the marbles and I am still fascinated by the physics involved in its automatic operation.

Another solution instead of the insert might be to use a 3/4" tube of some sort that would line up the marbles in a row.

My favorite Hafner train is the "Century of Progress" passenger train that was marketed for the Chicago World's Fair in 1933.  It has both a headlight and taillight and ringing bell.

Theme of the 1933 World's Fair in Chicago as well.

Jim O'C posted:

Theme of the 1933 World's Fair in Chicago as well

.

nice boxed set... don't see that very often.
sharp turns, too, something like O19, right?
cheers...gary

When I saw the set box of the Hafner Century of Progress train, I realized that I have some Hafner  banked track and it does have curves that are 19" from outside rail to outside rail.  So I put the track together to see how it would run.  I only have 2 Hafner straights, but here is a video I made to show how it would run on original track.  I wound up the spring fully to show how long it would run.  I you watch to the end, you will see a slow motion derailment.

There is a real nice TCA link to the history of Hafner here:

http://www.tcawestern.org/hafner.htm

David from Dearborn posted:

When I saw the set box of the Hafner Century of Progress train, I realized that I have some Hafner  banked track and it does have curves that are 19" from outside rail to outside rail.  So I put the track together to see how it would run.  I only have 2 Hafner straights, but here is a video I made to show how it would run on original track.  I wound up the spring fully to show how long it would run.  I you watch to the end, you will see a slow motion derailment.

There is a real nice TCA link to the history of Hafner here:

http://www.tcawestern.org/hafner.htm

 

 

Cool video Dave. Sorry about the derailment, but the slow motion replay was interesting to watch. Especially when the giant hand came down to rescue the loco!  

Here are 3 my Hafner and Wyandotte engines.  They are late production from the late 1940's to 1956 when Wyandotte went out of business.  They are the  streamlined engines, a Hafner 2000, a Hafner/Wyandotte and a Wyandotte.  The Wyandotte tender states that it was "built 4-6-55".

to wrap up the Hafner cast iron...

by the mid 20's Flyer clockwork models were in their third redesign with rivet and piping detail not found in the early castings...

even the economy Hummer line showed some details.

Hafner responded with two new models, the economy #109 (late) replacing the #100 locomotive and more than likely the early #109 which was the larger casting but without the brake and siderods...

and to replace the higher end #110 (early), the #110 (late).

fairly similar to the #109 with a little extra length, side rods and a brake.  the extra dome on the #110 (late) is the most identifiable difference between the two, though with the lack of complete cylinder castings, the #109 (late) cannot support siderods.

in my experience the smaller #109 (late) is the harder of the two models to find.  both late models were replaced when Hafner phased out cast iron completely in the early 1930's with the newer #1110 sheet metal Types.

cheers...gary

(yes, the #109 motor side frame is olive drab... it's actually gray on the other side.  definitely factory original. ... one of those tinplate mysteries)

David from Dearborn posted:

Here are 3 my Hafner and Wyandotte engines.  They are late production from the late 1940's to 1956 when Wyandotte went out of business.  They are the  streamlined engines, a Hafner 2000, a Hafner/Wyandotte and a Wyandotte. ...

many of these streamline models through the Wyandotte production were also available with a battery operated headlight...

a "C" cell mounted in the nose provided the power with a pilot mounted on/off switch.  with a deep, unthreaded socket, i've never been able to definitely identify the original bulb type, but with the extended hood (WW II "blackout" influence?) it could not have had a large globe.  operational tip... even if you don't have a bulb in place, the locomotive tracks a bit better with the battery weight.  i don't have any of mine out to check, but i believe some of the non-headlight models had a weight attached up front.

cheers...gary

The headlight used the little screw base, 1.5 volt bulb with the pre-focussed lens that was used in a lot of single cell flashlights and toys of the time.

This TL-3 shape globe

https://www.amazon.com/GE-1-2v...mp;keywords=tl3+bulb

the E10 base is certainly the right size.  it's just that i've yet to see a period bulb in any model i've seen.  in fact of the three lighted models i have, none came with a bulb.

David from Dearborn posted:

Here are 3 my Hafner and Wyandotte engines.  ...

by the way... nice tender!
the bell version is not very common.

cheers...gary

David from Dearborn posted:

I added the STOP FEATURE to my Hafner/Wyandotte layout as well as a WOLVERINE COAL LOADER that will unload marbles into the V shaped trough of a Hafner gondola.  Here are the videos.

 

Dave

ive watched this video about 1000 times and the track, layout, trains and that coal loader(marbles) has got to be the coolest thing I have ever seen.

Jim O'C posted:

Theme of the 1933 World's Fair in Chicago ...

with the same head end power, Hafner also offered a Century of Progress freight set...

hard for me to say as a freight car fan, but i can see why the passenger set was far more popular.  while the passenger set had some embossed detail around the windows and doorways, the freight cars were punched flat without much lithograph detail...

the boxcar (no doors) was essentially the passenger set express - baggage - mail car without the end doors and a less detailed roof.

add a cupola with side windows rather than a doorway and the rear end light from an observation car to make a caboose,

and the sand car already existed as an all red version of the early NYC Sand & Gravel car.
cost saving ideas like this, however, likely helped Hafner survive the depression years.

the last oddball from this era...

not considered an error, the plain-Jane version of the baggage car.
simple, but IMO really says it all ...

cheers...gary

I also like Papa's all red and black 900 series OFs.

sticking with the Type VI transitional frame, i must admit i'm usually a stickler for condition, but once in a while something comes along were you have to lower all standards* ...

the all copper boiler was the last #1010 model made and is shown here with the equally rare Type VI frame copper tender.

the uniquely identifiable feature of this engine is an extra long drawbar to be able to reach down to the low tender coupler,

plus it is the only drawbar in the 1110 series that swivels.

Greenberg (Doyle) lists/ pictures a few freight cars with the Type VI frame and also mentions that the copper #1110 & tender may have only appeared in a single ca. 1938 freight set, but for some reason he doesn't go as far as identifying the actual freight cars.

the small SunShine Special cars work for me for now, but i'd certainly appreciate any input on the 1937 Grainger's Catalog ad which may at least graphically show that freight set.

cheers...gary

* a note to the reliability/ durability of the Hafner clockwork motor... i would have accepted this one with a frozen mechanism or worse, yet despite its visible cosmetic condition, the motor winds and operates as smoothly as it probably did on day one.

Compared to the Marx clockwork stuff I have, I prize my Hafner 1010 set more.  Would love to get my grubby paws on a passenger set in just as good a shape. Just love the lithographs and how the streamlining was done.

overlandflyer posted:

Jim O'C posted:

Theme of the 1933 World's Fair in Chicago as well

.

nice boxed set... don't see that very often.
sharp turns, too, something like O19, right?
cheers...gary

There's one of these on ebay right now for like $700

Back in the late 1970’s I was working for the Missouri Pacific and was talking to the Chief Clerk to the Superintendent in North Little Rock. He was quite the railroad historian and had written many articles and two books. He’d mentioned his parents had given him a Sunshine Special train for a birthday.  Obviously this was preInternet searches and I had no idea who’d made them. I finally bought a set of yellow and red cars with a locomotive and tender and have them displayed with my Mopac collection.  The locomotive is missing the side rods so am trying to find a replacement set.

@Charlie Duckworth posted:

Back in the late 1970’s I was working for the Missouri Pacific and was talking to the Chief Clerk to the Superintendent in North Little Rock. He was quite the railroad historian and had written many articles and two books. He’d mentioned his parents had given him a Sunshine Special train for a birthday.  Obviously this was preInternet searches and I had no idea who’d made them. I finally bought a set of yellow and red cars with a locomotive and tender and have them displayed with my Mopac collection.  The locomotive is missing the side rods so am trying to find a replacement set.

Many came without side rods.

Steve

@Steve "Papa" Eastman posted:

When I started collecting Hafner, the early stuff resembling Flyer were pretty pricey so my collection was mostly the later streamliner types as seen in the old photo's below. Prices on the earlier started dropping so my collection has gone more to the earlier types and much of the streamliner ones have been sold.

Steve

hey Steve, what number is that copper and green streamlined wind-up Hafner? I'm trying to do an evaluation of value on one I have. Mine's not as nice as yours though but it is complete. Thanks

@MattR posted:

hey Steve, what number is that copper and green streamlined wind-up Hafner? I'm trying to do an evaluation of value on one I have. Mine's not as nice as yours though but it is complete. Thanks

The book does not show model numbers for these. The just get the generic M10000 description.

Steve

Okay. Thank you. I tried doing quite a bit of research and couldn't come up with a number either.

Hello all

Does anyone have dates when Hafner first moved to

3128 Carroll Ave , Chicago ? I have ads showing that address in 1922

And the move to

1010 Kolmar Ave Chicago?

1010 address same as found on the streamlined steamer introduced in 1938?

Thank you

Cheers Carey

I found at l set some close dates

Hafner was at Carroll Ave up to 1928/9

Hafner was at Kolmar Ave  by 1930

Cheers Carey

This is the Hafner Train Set I inherited from my Father.  I believe he got it in 1923. It came with a figure 8 track and it still runs after 100 years.