Homemade legacy wifi?

The CAB1 communicates at 27mhz, the WiFi communicates at 2.4ghz.  In addition, the conversation from the CAB1 or even the CAB2 is quite different than the conversation from the Legacy command base. 

While it's possible to do something, you'd be undertaking a fairly significant electronic and software design and reinventing the WiFi adapter.  Probably not something that makes sense to do.

So if I connected a wifi router directly to the legacy base using a cat5/serial adapter, wouldn't the 2.4ghz communication be occurring between my phone and the router?   I know its probably more complicated than this, i'm just trying to understand.  I was probably unclear in my first post, I understand that i wouldn't be able to communicate between the router and the cab 1 or cab 2.  I was just thinking about hooking the router up to the base so i could communicate to the base with my phone or ipad.  I guess the I-cab and the bluetrain app software is probably set up to only communicate with the proprietary lionel wifi router. In actuality, isn't the LCS wifi module really just an overpriced wifi router?

The LCS WiFi box is an interface between Wifi and the LCS serial bus.  Hooking a router directly to it will not let iCab commands pass.

I would also add to John's comments;

Serial data (the 9-pin connector) on the Legacy base is different than TCP/IP data (the cat5 connections on the Wifi router).  I don't know if it's even possible to make any of the RJ45 ports on a router talk using the serial protocol

You mentioned a serial to cat5 adapter.  I believe what you are referring to is a 9-pin to RJ45 adapter.  That adapter is intended to simply allow 2 devices to connect their respective serial ports using a cat5 cable.  The adapter doesn't translate any of the serial data to another protocol.

There are devices that will convert serial to TCP/IP.  They will cost some money thought.  (the last time I bought one, it was $175).  

My thoughts...It might actually be cheaper (and a whole lot easier) to buy the LCS Wifi module.

That makes sense, I can see that the router wouldn't have the capability to translate properly to communicate with the base. So how does the bluetrain app communicate to the base through a simple aftermarket bluetooth transmitter connected to the base?  I guess its all built into the software app?

Bluetrain talks TMCC commands via the serial port to the command base.  The TMCC serial data is documented in Lionel 71-2911-250, The Complete Guide to Command Control.

The Legacy protocol has also been documented, but only if you connect through the LCS SER2 or WiFi modules.  Connecting directly to the Legacy command base will not get you the ability to use Legacy commands.

I wonder if Lionel will eventually come out with an updated legacy base that has wifi built right into it with a USB port.  To me it would make sense to abandon the old serial communications as they are nearly obsolete now.  It seems if this happened, it would really open up the market to even more apps, track building software, etc.  I know that is the way things are moving now, it just might speed things up a little!  In a way I think its too bad that all this new LCS technology is being rolled out with an outdated base/cable system to go with it.  Seems like you might eliminate some of these modules or special cables if you updated the base. Why not use cables that are currently in use by the computer industry rather than make proprietary cables?  Again, I am not very well educated in this technology, so please excuse my likely stupid thoughts!

Now you're launching into the Wild Blue Yonder, I doubt anyone here really knows if that's even on Lionel's radar.

Well...I have the stuff and it works well. The cables are small enough to somewhat hide on an O Gauge layout and they are reliable. There has to be some incentive for all the thousands of hours put into developing these applications. The financial returns on the hardware is part of it. And as I somewhat pointed out, the hardware suits the function and the layout.

Anyone can develop their own system though. You might want to look into JMRI and the jmriusers group on yahoo.

As long as we are dreaming...

It would be awesome if Lionel developed an LCS module that would replace the Legacy base (or incorporate the Legacy and TMCC protocols and the track connections into the Wifi module).  And develop a version of the CAB 2 that communicates via Wifi.  Or a CAB 3 that runs on Wifi.  

That would allow people who are trying to budget their purchases more access to the newest technology at lower price point increments.

When you look at the insides of the base...and the CAB2 for that matter, I can envision an update to that hardware.

Could you build something that does the job, sure, if you wanted to with a computer or microcontroler and some other various hardware.  Should you?  Probably not worth the time, effort, and money unless you know enough to know how to do it already, and want to provide some sort of function that the offered app does not already provide.  

As for replacing the track signal with wifi, it's called Lionchief(+)  The radio system in lionchief is the same sort that wifi and bluetooth use, and the system could just as easily provide the full range of legacy features.  

I'm also curious why you need the ser2/wifi modules to communicate with legacy protocol.  I know that you do, but don't understand the reason why.  I'd be curious if this is something one could decode to talk directly through the serial with a computer, or if there is something I'm missing. 

These folks make Wi-Fi and Bluetooth to RS-232 adapters. I looked at these when Bluetrain first arrived as a beta.

Perhaps one of these connected to the data port on the base with iCab or LCS app would work.

Not much of a cost savings though.

This was before the LCS Wi-Fi was out.

WiSnap

WiSnap on YouTube

Because that's the way that Lionel made it work.

Obviously, if you were to dig in and reverse engineer the communication between the LCS modules and the command base, it's possible to do without either of the LCS pieces.  Of course, if you attempted to sell such an interface product, I'm also pretty sure that Lionel would have their lawyers hot on your trail.  You can connect directly to the base to do the TMCC commands, Lionel has locked the 9 bit commands in some fashion to force you to use the LCS components.