LIONEL - 6-18149 - VERANDA GAS TURBINE - Terrific locomotive!

It could be done with a fairly simple circuit, but I never figured the short delay was all that annoying, and I have tons of other pressing projects. A relay driven from the turbine smoke unit could switch from the internal smoke controller (on the motherboard) to a fixed supply that would just pre-warm the heater, much like whistle steam smoke units are handled in Legacy.  It would not be enough heat to produce smoke, but when the rear smoke unit smoke controller was switched back into the circuit, it would have a head-start to produce smoke immediately.

I had the MTH version as well, but IMO, they didn't do as good a job on it.  The smoke units ran continuously, I like the way that the Lionel model switches them prototypically with sounds to match.  I sold the MTH version and kept the Lionel one.

Believe it or not, I bought the Lionel Veranda when it was released, and it has never seen the light of day. I finally got my yard finished so I can have more than just a couple engines on the layout. Maybe I know what box I can open this Christmas morning!!!

BTW - here is the Veranda manual pdf  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/71-8149-250.pdf

Veranda smoke unit tips

https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/71-8149-251.pdf

Veranda wiring diagram

https://www.lionelsupport.com/media/servicedocuments6905_UseverandaWiringDiagramcomplete.pdf

Always hoped that Lionel would do one in Legacy but I guess they lost the tooling for that too.

I gave up waiting for Legacy.

I have one as well...a magnificent beast.  All diecast and super heavy.  Very interesting how they did the smoke arrangement.

Someone on the Buy Sell here has one for sale.

I had both Verandas and sold the MTH one to someone here who was looking for it. The Lionel version is what I say is the ultimate Diesel engine even though it is a diesel/ turbine engine.

My smoke units have a small peculiarity in their operation. Rear comes on with diesel sound, shuts off when turbine sound kicks on with front smoke unit going on pouring loads of smoke. A lot more running with no decrease in speed and it shuts down and the rear unit comes back on which it should not do. I think the front fan unit shuts off as the resistor stays on as some smoke still comes out.
Regardless, it is one cool engine and a HEAVY BEAST!!

Smoke control is done by a custom motherboard with logic and triac smoke drivers.  That's why you need the special secret handshake to turn on and off the individual smoke units and not the standard smoke controls.  You can see the logic in the middle and the triacs on the upper left corner.  That's the one part I see on these that would be very difficult to replace with any substitutes as they're no longer available.  I managed to snag a spare for my engine before they were gone.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

It could be done with a fairly simple circuit, but I never figured the short delay was all that annoying, and I have tons of other pressing projects. A relay driven from the turbine smoke unit could switch from the internal smoke controller (on the motherboard) to a fixed supply that would just pre-warm the heater, much like whistle steam smoke units are handled in Legacy.  It would not be enough heat to produce smoke, but when the rear smoke unit smoke controller was switched back into the circuit, it would have a head-start to produce smoke immediately.

I had the MTH version as well, but IMO, they didn't do as good a job on it.  The smoke units ran continuously, I like the way that the Lionel model switches them prototypically with sounds to match.  I sold the MTH version and kept the Lionel one.

the more I think about it, the more I’m thinking it might be wise to just disconnect and drive both units heaters off a single buck converter, together in parallel, separate from the boards, since I won’t want to mess with turning those off via tmcc anyway and would rather give my irreplaceable driver board a greater chance at longevity without heaters being driven off of it and just leave it to do its job with the fans and the proper sequencing.

perhaps I could run a relay off the output that currently drives the middle heater (since it is independently controllable via tmcc) and then run the newly proposed buck converter driven powered heater circuits, controlled by the relay circuit, so they only draw from the easily replaceable buck converter but do not put a load on the original board, thus I can turn off both heaters via remote, or each fan via remote using all original commands and when I do run the heaters - both are warm and ready to go and produce good smoke with no delay. To me, this makes more sense than the original design anyway - seeing as how you have to leave the turbine unit heater on at all times anyway before it kicks in. Why not have both heaters warm and ready to go??

now to find the right drop-in relay that will fit...

*Re-reading your response here gunrunnerjohn - I think this is exactly what you’ve proposed, no?

Have fun.

@DdotCdot you might consider a Solid State Relay in a 6 pin DIP package. I have included the spec sheet for the one I have use to connect Gabe the Lamplighter to an Arduino computer card. This particular device can handle 2 amps DC, 1 amp AC.

Time for a legacy version

@turbine posted:

Time for a legacy version

If Lionel does it again they need to retool the shell and bring the fine detail up a notch and fix! the Cab and Nose..... is not right....its "smooshed" same goes with the MTH model(s).

I don’t care if it has a smooched NOSE, do it in Legacy or better yet in Vision Line!! I love that Engine!  So sorry 😢 I sold mine!!  Regrets,  Regrets

@DdotCdot posted:

the more I think about it, the more I’m thinking it might be wise to just disconnect and drive both units heaters off a single buck converter, together in parallel, separate from the boards, since I won’t want to mess with turning those off via tmcc anyway and would rather give my irreplaceable driver board a greater chance at longevity without heaters being driven off of it and just leave it to do its job with the fans and the proper sequencing.

I'd just run it until it fails, chances are pretty good you'll get years of service and be able to enjoy all the cool features.  If I wanted a neutered one with lame smoke control, I could have kept the MTH model.  I plan on using the cool features until they don't work.  At that point, I'll take a stab at repairing the board, which I suspect is quite possible for many failures.  When all else fails, then it's time to get out the bandaids.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I'd just run it until it fails, chances are pretty good you'll get years of service and be able to enjoy all the cool features.  If I wanted a neutered one with lame smoke control, I could have kept the MTH model.  I plan on using the cool features until they don't work.  At that point, I'll take a stab at repairing the board, which I suspect is quite possible for many failures.  When all else fails, then it's time to get out the bandaids.

You make a good point. At least I’ll know in advance what to do when the day of failure comes, if it comes.

Just ran it again and realize it doesn’t bother me enough to crack it open for this little thing. It’s a great piece for its time and still holds up. I really enjoy it.

A Vision Line UP Gas Turbine Electric Locomotive (GTEL) would be awesome. I want the 3-unit, 8500HP version. That would be just amazing. The sound, especially with Lionel speakers (I've heard that they have great sound and I agree), would blow out your eardrums and blow your mind, too. The set could include the A and B units for the turbine, as well as the tender. With the Legacy system and Vision features, the turbines could be some of the greatest Vision Line locomotives ever made. If I had the money and the right size of curves (probably O-72s), I would totally buy a Vision GTEL and some matching freight cars.

My smallest curve on my new layout will be O72, and most are larger up to around O99.  However, at only 12 x 23, it's not a large enough layout for the really big stuff.  I'd love to grab one of the C&O coal turbines, but it would overpower my layout I suspect.  I'll have my hands full with stuff like my A-A Centipedes.

Just found a Lionel NIB Veranda. Judging from this thread, I was lucky to snag it.

Should ship tomorrow. I'll report how it survived shipping and handling. Plus any other impressions.

Walter,

You joined the Lionel Veranda club who really like this version in TMCC. Now that Lionel is making it in Legacy, I do not see the need to buy that as the TMCC version is a beast of an engine!
Enjoy your new toy!

@Fredstrains posted:

I don’t care if it has a smooched NOSE, do it in Legacy or better yet in Vision Line!! I love that Engine!  So sorry 😢 I sold mine!!  Regrets,  Regrets

And guess what ??  Here we are a few years later & they are in the New Catalog !!!

Needless to say I ordered one!!!’

Thanks LIONEL😊

I have the TMCC Veranda, still new in the shipping carton, when I bought it when it first came out. As my fading memory tells me, had to wait  two years or so from order to delivery. Was  my first "big" engine purchase.  Also as I recall, was going to be the first engine with Odyssey speed control, and the motors were a new "stackable" design to work with Odyssey - stackable in the sense that if the engine design needed more pulling power, Lionel would "stack" more field/commutator pieces. So a simple engine might have a two stack motor, whereas a behemoth like the Veranda might have quad stack motors. Lionel found they could design Odyssey to work with can motors, and thus the "expensive" stackable motor design wasn't necessary.

Again, if my memory is correct, the ACL F3 was the first engine released with Odyssey.

@MED posted:

Again, if my memory is correct, the ACL F3 was the first engine released with Odyssey.

The ACL F3s had Pullmor motors. They have the distinction of the first F3s with TMCC. I have the set. It’s a beautiful piece.

Don't know about old history of what was to be, but my TMCC Veranda has Pittman motors.