I've sent two engines back for warranty repair, and it didn't cost me anything, nor did I have to get insurance.
I believe if the product is having issues regardless of it Legacy or Vision Line, they do(or should) cover the cost. When the VL Challengers came different from the original ones(with the drift chuff I believe), Lionel sent out call tags fixes for those that wanted it to have it be like the original offering. This should definitely be a warranty repair I would imagine as that is not performing they way it should and would most likely have issues if it were to keep running.
As most have said, sending stuff back to Lionel(or any manufacturer) is worrisome because you have to hope nothing breaks in transit. I believe that someone had posted some time ago how they sent their engine in, Lionel did the fix and also informed the person that something else was loose so they fixed that as well. I'm glad when I sent mine back for that drift chuff fix, that I packed the living $&#+ out of it. They could have had Hulk Hogan drop the leg on that box and his leg wouldn't have fared so well.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:I packed the living $&#+ out of it. They could have had Hulk Hogan drop the leg on that box and his leg wouldn't have fared so well.
This engine that came to the local shop a forklift fork or something else like a pallet jack clearly crushed it to the frame, it crushed the diecast trucks, it flattened the can motors inside. The frame got skinny- along with everything else. Not one single part was not crushed- the boards, the shell, like I said, even the trucks (the diecast drive block section and wheels crushed inward). It was almost deceptive, the shell was crushed but sort of sprung back to original size, so the internal crushed parts were not obvious. Engine was a total write off. Not one single part, none were unscathed.
Just saying, while hopefully rare, bad stuff can happen in shipping.
Attachments
Images (6)
@Vernon Barry but that is not what I'm talking about. I was talking about my pack job sending my Challenger to Lionel, not getting one delivered in the regular packing. As Pat(Harmon Yards) will tell you, when I ship something to him, I try and make sure that neither of us are going to have to say to the other, "There's another problem". I make sure to double box if possible as well as fill in any spots where the engine will shift, or be battered around. Pat has told me a few times that I've done a great packing job, which is exactly the way I want it. I had to send one with minimal packing and that worried me a bit. That made it through no problems, and had to go a few places before coming home.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:@Vernon Barry but that is not what I'm talking about. I was talking about my pack job sending my Challenger to Lionel, not getting one delivered in the regular packing. As Pat(Harmon Yards) will tell you, when I ship something to him, I try and make sure that neither of us are going to have to say to the other, "There's another problem". I make sure to double box if possible as well as fill in any spots where the engine will shift, or be battered around. Pat has told me a few times that I've done a great packing job, which is exactly the way I want it. I had to send one with minimal packing and that worried me a bit. That made it through no problems, and had to go a few places before coming home.
They should hire Dave as a packing consultant, I swear!!…..nobody, I mean nobody has ever sent me a model to repair packed as well as Dave has, …..overkill is cheap insurance !….
Pat
@harmonyards posted:They should hire Dave as a packing consultant, I swear!!…..nobody, I mean nobody has ever sent me a model to repair packed as well as Dave has, …..overkill is cheap insurance !….
Pat
My last job I worked in shipping. I was taught by my good buddy Ray who showed me how to pack properly. We had one of the supervisors work with us, I told him he was doing it wrong, he wouldn't listen. Ray took him to school. Needless to say, that supervisor didn't work with us in shipping ever again.
Thats great that most take the time to double box and triple box even build custom boxes. That doesn't mean you will get the train back the way you sent it. I have overboxed and built custom boxes and included notes to make sure I receive my item back in the same box. However, someone either is absent minded or doesn't care. I hate when I get the item back in a factory shipping carton when I spent time to go above and beyond. This has happened more than a few times. My guess is someone else got my nice custom built box. Back to the thread................I hope 42trainman gets satisfaction in the end. If not, He can always choose not to buy any more high end locos.
just got and opened mine from charles ro yesterday. it was boxed in a lionel box with foam on every side. then put in a bigger box by charle with packing peanuts all over. thanks charle. he even included a note about the extra packing done. see photo attached.
it came flawless with no damage and as of the first test track run worked flawless. lets hope after running for a few hours it still has no issues.
gota say this thing is beautiful and very heavy. this is the bigboy to have IMO. lionel knocked this one out of the park. I love it.
I hope the opening poster gets his repaired and its a simple fix by lionel. once he gets over being understandably mad. he will be glad he did and then he will appreciate it even more. then he can enjoy it for years to come.
Attachments
Images (1)
Roger, well I just happened to be logged on and see your post. I think you are right, it is a beautiful loco, if the issue is fixed (relatively) quickly without extra cost to me, I guess that is a win. It is beautiful. Legacy station did the same with the extra box and packaging. No note, but Brian has been a nice fella to deal with. My issue clearly wasn't packing, since all 3 boxes are pristine. It's an internal manufacturing thing. If you saw my little video clip you can hear the sound. Kinda like two nylon gears not meshing? or rubbing? Be sure you don't have or get this issue, so we know if mine is an isolated problem or systematic. It's a little tough to hear with the sound system on. Anyway, I sent Lionel the video and the warranty stuff so I should hear something back Monday or Tuesday. FYI: I ran mine twice around 5 minutes each time before I started hearing the dreaded squeal. Godspeed yours is A-OK.
Classy job by Ro! I would have been in for a Big Boy this time around (sold the JLC one a few years ago) but I have two PRR Decs coming soon.
I was in for the new triplex until yesterday. Now I'm convinced there is no way that item arrives unscathed and actually working correctly. New wheel slip feature, an additional set of drivers/rods and motor, and that whole thing as a single piece as opposed to two pieces. Guaranteed to be a nightmare with their track record... Total Bummer. But I've been wrong before and hopefully will be.
@42trainman posted:I was in for the new triplex until yesterday. Now I'm convinced there is no way that item arrives unscathed and actually working correctly. New wheel slip feature, an additional set of drivers/rods and motor, and that whole thing as a single piece as opposed to two pieces. Guaranteed to be a nightmare with their track record... Total Bummer. But I've been wrong before and hopefully will be.
Get your dealer to test it before shipping, ….even if they charge you a few bucks to do it. For someone in your shoes, this would be the most ideal pre-trip inspection that can save you a lot of grief,….no need to cancel out your wish list, …..
Pat
@42trainman posted:I was in for the new triplex until yesterday. Now I'm convinced there is no way that item arrives unscathed and actually working correctly. New wheel slip feature, an additional set of drivers/rods and motor, and that whole thing as a single piece as opposed to two pieces. Guaranteed to be a nightmare with their track record... Total Bummer. But I've been wrong before and hopefully will be.
I wanted one of these until I saw the lame paint jobs! I have no issues with fantasy pieces, but all the white flash on the ERIE gunmetal model leaves me looking for a used MTH Premier model. 
What possessed them to paint everything white on that model escapes me!
Anyone have a good shot of the information under the cab on the new oil burning 4014? I’m curious to see if they got the stoker information correct this go around. Not a huge deal just curious
Attachments
Images (1)
@rscott posted:I finally had time to unbox my Big Boy from Charles Ro, was nicely shipped double boxed. Tested and everything looks and works good!
Had all the makings of a great video but…
Scott, listen to my video and check it out. It didn't start doing that until about 10 min of running. Also, it's hard to hear, so turn the sound off to be sure.
So, to continue the story since everyone should know the outcome. On Saturday, I had emailed Lionel with the warranty form and my original receipt, and the below short 13 second video clip showing the issue. Didn't expect to hear until Monday (only fair). Yesterday late afternoon I rec'd an email from customer service stating they could take it in and turn it around in 2-3 weeks and it sounds like a flywheel. Well, ok. Good start. Then a few minutes later before I respond, I get a second email from the same lady saying 2-3 weeks ONLY applies if it is a repeat RMA for this locomotive, NOT if it's the engine's first time back. Holy Cow! My time would be 6-8 weeks. Absolutely incredible at their cavalier approach to service. She also asked me for the receipt and the warranty form. DUH, that is all in the original email, attached, AND in the body of the email since some folks always lose attachments. So, I responded firm but fair, and am now waiting for a Tuesday response and hoping I get one with a better approach. Will post the update when available. Serenity Now....
Oh, just FYI: one other share... other than the few folks on here who have BB issues right now... On Sunday afternoon I went to a local club meet at a gentlemen's house. There were 11 of us present. The big boy and triplex were a topic at one point -of course. One other guy besides me bought the big boy. He received it BROKEN also. his was not mechanical, but rather a handful of the small parts broken off during shipping. Too much for him to fix, his is going back too.
Attachments
Videos (1)
WOW, that is crazy, considering how much we paid for these engines, they should be at the front of the line. After I heard your video, I turned the sound off on mine, and ran it for twenty min. so far it is ok, but I have the Super Set on order, now have to worry about that.
"they should be at the front of the line."
Seriously? Would that apply for heart transplants too? 
.
For those unfamiliar with the patterns in the industry, November through February tend to be the busiest for both sales and repairs, or so I've been told.
@42trainman, it is good to hear that you got a response. I know that when they had the Polar Express colors issues, there was a big response both in emails as well as in person. Ryan really had his hands full with that.
I wouldn't be grudge them on the timeframe. We don't know what is going on there, how many people are working on these, etc., etc. That is something we just have to bear. Hopefully when all is said and done, your engine comes back with no issues. If it does, well, that's another email that hopefully you won't have to send. Good luck.
@Landsteiner posted:"they should be at the front of the line."
Seriously? Would that apply for heart transplants too?
For those unfamiliar with the patterns in the industry, November through February tend to be the busiest for both sales and repairs, or so I've been told.
100% correct. My local train store always has customers who are getting ready to set up their Christmas layouts, and they're snagged with a problem. Tony usually says if you are wanting to have a train running under the tree, take it out in August or September. See if it needs to come in for service, repairs, or what not. Come November it is very hard to try and turn things around if you already have a full load on your hands.
@42trainman posted:So, to continue the story since everyone should know the outcome. On Saturday, I had emailed Lionel with the warranty form and my original receipt, and the below short 13 second video clip showing the issue. Didn't expect to hear until Monday (only fair). Yesterday late afternoon I rec'd an email from customer service stating they could take it in and turn it around in 2-3 weeks and it sounds like a flywheel. Well, ok. Good start. Then a few minutes later before I respond, I get a second email from the same lady saying 2-3 weeks ONLY applies if it is a repeat RMA for this locomotive, NOT if it's the engine's first time back. Holy Cow! My time would be 6-8 weeks. Absolutely incredible at their cavalier approach to service. She also asked me for the receipt and the warranty form. DUH, that is all in the original email, attached, AND in the body of the email since some folks always lose attachments. So, I responded firm but fair, and am now waiting for a Tuesday response and hoping I get one with a better approach. Will post the update when available. Serenity Now....
Oh, just FYI: one other share... other than the few folks on here who have BB issues right now... On Sunday afternoon I went to a local club meet at a gentlemen's house. There were 11 of us present. The big boy and triplex were a topic at one point -of course. One other guy besides me bought the big boy. He received it BROKEN also. his was not mechanical, but rather a handful of the small parts broken off during shipping. Too much for him to fix, his is going back too.
So is Lionel paying the shipping? Also sounds like they may be used to getting locos back more than once since locos returned more than once get faster turn around times. Sounds kinda disturbing
@42trainman posted:… Yesterday late afternoon I rec'd an email from customer service stating they could take it in and turn it around in 2-3 weeks and it sounds like a flywheel. Well, ok. Good start. Then a few minutes later before I respond, I get a second email from the same lady saying 2-3 weeks ONLY applies if it is a repeat RMA for this locomotive, NOT if it's the engine's first time back. Holy Cow! My time would be 6-8 weeks. Absolutely incredible at their cavalier approach to service. …
I wouldn’t be too worried on the time frame unless a bunch of big boys go back I had to send an early challenger back. It was right at 4-5 weeks not too bad. Unless you count the fact it’s going back for the same issue but they do seem to be getting to things
It's very frustrating. I did the official count, it's 7 engines bought in the last 2 years, with 4 of them arriving broken. 2 vision, 4 legacy and one Lionchief. One of them, (the vision 2-10-10-2) went back twice. That's pretty bad odds, like 57% failure rate. Bad enough this big boy issue stopped me from buying the triplex that I was originally very excited about. Yes, they did give me a UPS ground prepaid label today and a RMA number. I ship it out tomorrow morning. I'll report back in a few weeks.
UPDATE:
10/30/23 Notified the new Big Boy was shipped to me.
11/3/23 Arrives with nothing broken, but after 10 minutes of run time, starts making a terrible squealing sound. See video posted at beginning of this thread to hear.
11/7/23 Shipped back to Lionel. Took 1 day to get responses, RMA and paid return shipping to them. (Very reasonable)
11/22/23. Just notified this afternoon (yes, Wednesday before thanksgiving someone in service is working!) that the Big Boy is repaired and being prepped to ship back to me. (Very quick and reasonable turnaround!)
The response from Lionel (paraphrased) was flywheel and encoder were fine. But on the other end of the motor the axle was grinding into the hose for the blowdown smoke. They put a new hose and adjusted the routing of it so issue doesn't repeat itself. No more crazy noise. The said all is good and they are prepping it for return to me.
So, despite my anger and frustration of having another expensive engine dead on arrival, at least they fixed it and paid for it. Turnaround was only about 2 weeks, so that was great! When my 2-10-10-2 went back TWICE last year it took 6 weeks each time! SO, overall, as reasonable as can be expected this time. NOW, I'm just praying it arrives here undamaged with all the small parts (handrails, etc) in tact. Fingers crossed, and that's "the rest of the story..." For Now. Thank you Lionel.
I'm happy to hear it's been smooth so far @42trainman. Hopefully it arrived intact!
Happy Thanksgiving!
I was notified its being prepped for shipping. I probably won't have it until later this coming week. I'll post again after it gets here and I run it a little... Fingers crossed.
So, for the "hopefully" final update. The BB arrived home from the Lionel warranty shop a few days ago, and I opened her up over the weekend and ran her. The Bell was in the bottom of the box, but luckily screwed back on. Yes, it has tiny threads that hold it on. So, no problem there. Everything else is ok, not bent or broken. HOORAY!!! Ran it around with my Orange hand held universal remote via bluetooth since I do not have legacy or DCS. No issues, No squealing, No problems I can find. Surprisingly quick turnaround, as I had it back in about 3 weeks total. Thank you Lionel. Thanks to you Gents for listening and offering discussion.
Attachments
Images (1)
@42trainman posted:So, for the "hopefully" final update. The BB arrived home from the Lionel warranty shop a few days ago, and I opened her up over the weekend and ran her. The Bell was in the bottom of the box, but luckily screwed back on. Yes, it has tiny threads that hold it on. So, no problem there. Everything else is ok, not bent or broken. HOORAY!!! Ran it around with my Orange hand held universal remote via bluetooth since I do not have legacy or DCS. No issues, No squealing, No problems I can find. Surprisingly quick turnaround, as I had it back in about 3 weeks total. Thank you Lionel. Thanks to you Gents for listening and offering discussion.
A win for the good guys!
@42trainman glad to hear you're back and running!! I guess three weeks isn't too shabby if it's fixed on their dime. I just hope this is the end of your trouble!
That is great news, glad it is back in proper working order.
A three week turnaround during peak holiday season far exceeded my expectations. Glad you got it resolved. I am really enjoying my oil burning #4014 excursion!
Thanks for sharing the happy outcome. Cheers!
Awesome Good news
Thanks, I'm feeling good about it. Hope it lasts. Cheers!
@42trainman I finally completed a loop of track on my layout and now have a tremendous squeak coming from somewhere on the Big Boy. I greased it. But I haven't oiled all those rods. Truthfully, I think it's coming from the wheels on the tender.
More importantly, this thing is marvelous when it thunders down the rails at a good speed.
Oh no, hope it doesn't have to go back. Turn the volume all the way off and run it while you listen to the noise, that made all the difference in helping to identify my issue. Fingers crossed for you.
@42trainman I would likely tackle any mechanical issue myself. There's just so many places it could come from haha
@Snkbittin posted:Got my BB#4000 yesterday and it was busted..I had watched an unboxing video and there was supossed to be a block of foam against the Boiler front that swings open..Nope and door broke off..was able to fix that ..hinges need touch up but on a Toy this expensive thats not good and its missing the bell...Last Vision line i got SP 4449 same thing with boiler front...Thats the end of Big ticket Lionel for me..Ill use what i got and spend the $$ on Winchesters and Car parts
Sorry to read your big boy story of lionel problems. We are in the 14th day of our first lionel vision line purchase, a special run, big boy. So far, it derails on our atlas 0 072 curves. Its the only engine to ever have derails on our curves and we have many big engines. Not sure we can solve our problem, the fourth front driver wheel derails, the wheel pushed off the rail by the boiler swinging back, or so it seems. Uncertain, because its hard to tell if springs or fastening points might be assembled incorrectly. It is a hard engine to analyze and we don't know anyone in NJ that has a big boy or where we might take the engine to run on another layout. I might set up a circle of some old 072 lionel tubular and see if the engine still has problems We will see how our very aggravating story ends.
