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duquesnepanoramic1938-3b_edited-2This panoramic photo, taken by H.V.Campell in 1938, shows part of  a steel mill located in my hometown, Duquesne, PA. That river is the Monongahela. I lived my childhood in a house up on that hill (not built yet at the taking of this photo, well before my birth). We could hear those trains shuffling up and down those tracks all day and night, especially during the time when steam locomotives still dominated.

My strongest impression of steel mills in the greater Pittsburgh area was one of SIZE = huge proportions. Even the hand-tools were big!

For example, take special note of the length and breadth of those curves of track(s), and the radii involved. And the long, long lines of coal hoppers. Can you discern how many cars are in those consists? Could we ever have that number and length of RR tracks of cars like that on a layout ? !

And take special note of the part of  the steel mill in this photo and in my cropping of it, included. Those structures are only a segment of the steel production at this plant. The furnaces are not even within this photo. They are just beyond the frame, off to the left of the shot.

Having grown up exploring and playing and finally working in this environment, when I hear talk of "scale curves" on a layout, I don't even know what that means. Of course, we have to have our model trains turn around on any given platform. But "scale" curves? Not possible, IMHO. Not practical. Not do-able.

And crafting a steel mill suggests to me - no matter what the scale, O, HO, N, or even Z - a considerable  accommodation and "foreshortening," a compacting, of all modeling elements for the space available. Anyone who insists on true-to-scale "rivet-counting," esp. if you have a layout, or are planning one, needs to lighten-up. And get real (or as close as we can get to "real" scale modeling.)

What is your perspective on this? How do our model railroads actually  satisfy any prospective scale approach to real railroading?

I think that is why I found myself giving so much attention, energy, experimentation, and learning (crafting) to augment my trains with realistic (?) looking scenery. At least the scenery can tell the truth, or at least, an attempt at it.

What do you say about it being impossible to make a layout truly to-scale of any railroad panorama?duquesnepanoramic1938-3bbcduquesnepanoramic1938-3b_edited-1

FrankM.

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Well, you could have a "scale" 10-degree curve in O scale (radius of around 12 feet), but it would eat up an awful lot of space. I agree that it is probably impossible to create a truly to-scale panoramic scene in any space that's likely to be available. Now, if we could build a model railroad inside an entire abandoned steel mill, there might be a chance .....

In the larger scales such as O (at least in a typical room-sized home layout), the focus has to be on the trains themselves.  You would have a better chance modeling sweeping panoramas like this in HO, or especially N-scale, where the trains are only a small part of the "scene."

That being said, it seems that if you were to bring the track away from the wall in a gentle curve, and represent a partial view of the mill as a backdrop, you could have something that recreates the key elements of the photo in your imagination (and in the minds of others who are familiar with the locale.)

My $.02.

Every miniature train and layout--whether you call it toy or scale--is a series of compromises, cheats, and compressions.  Some of us are willing to accept more of those compromises, cheats, and compression than others are, but none of us can avoid them.

 

It is therefore quite futile to sneer at the fellow who accepts more than you do or direct sour grapes at the fellow who accepts fewer. 

As I muse further on this, each of you, B Smith, Ted Sowirka, & Palallin, has contributed interesting pertinent points. Here's another cropping of the original photo, concentrating on a couple of the long consists. They amaze me and boggle my little pea-pickin' mind.duquesnepanoramic1938-3bbcc

As kids, we used to slide down that dirt hill you can see in the upper left corner, right next to that pedestrian/vehicular bridge, and watch the trains bump and bang.

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Last edited by Moonson
B Smith posted:

I understand compromises and compressions, but what do you mean by "cheats"?  I don't think my compromised and compressed layout purports to be anything other than what it is -- a model or a toy -- therefore there are no cheats. 

One common cheat is forced perspective, a way of cheating the eye into seeing distance where little or none exists.

Another, different kind of cheat is use of electric motors in steam engines; another is the use of light bulbs to represent fire.

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