Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. Enjoy the hobby, buy what you like, run your layout the way you like, if it's too expensive don't buy it and remember, ALL MANUFACTURERS HAVE PROBLEMS FROM TIME TO TIME. The most important thing is have fun and build your world any way you like.
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I believe that most of us have had some negative feedback from friends and family about our hobby sometime during our lives. Maybe that's in the back of our collective minds and we just cannot get past it.
"I live in my own little world, but it's okay, they know me there".
I agree with you Jim.
With all the information available with the internet and this forum, it can potentially help the hobby. It's wonderful to be able to post a train question and have it answered within hours. Or to share some aspect of the hobby.
On the other hand, with the immediacy of the information age also comes the age old tendency of people to complain. Now factor in how diverse the 3-rail market is along with the fact our segment of the hobby is dwarfed by both HO and N scales. There's no financially feasible way the manufacturers can offer the variety of HO and N scales in 3-rail, yet that doesn't stop folks from grumbling about it.
That can be a downside of coming to a train forum and reading nothing but complaining. Yes, there are legitimate issues with quality that are informative. But sometimes that line between a reasonable complaint and just plain ol' grumbling gets blurred.
It amazes me the amount and variety of product that IS available in 3-rail already given the small market share. What further amazes me even more is the HO and N scale guys still do far more scratch-building, kit-bashing and custom repainting that is done in O. Which is why the detail parts an decals are still more easily available in those scales.
Lucky for me as an 027 guy, I can cob decals from different scales and still do a vast amount of repainting and kit-bashing. I just finished some Procor 027 tank cars. What also astounds me when I have done shows, is that it is the HO guys who give me the most compliments. I'll ask why, and they say "we just don't see many Lionel guys doing what you're doing."
But to each their own. Rather than grumble that Lionel hasn't made this, I'll just make it myself... which is my fun part of the hobby.
And when I get a digital camera, I'm going to post some photos just to encourage other non-scale traditional 0/027 modelers.
brianel_k-lineguy posted:I agree with you Jim.
With all the information available with the internet and this forum, it can potentially help the hobby. It's wonderful to be able to post a train question and have it answered within hours. Or to share some aspect of the hobby.
On the other hand, with the immediacy of the information age also comes the age old tendency of people to complain. Now factor in how diverse the 3-rail market is along with the fact our segment of the hobby is dwarfed by both HO and N scales. There's no financially feasible way the manufacturers can offer the variety of HO and N scales in 3-rail, yet that doesn't stop folks from grumbling about it.
That can be a downside of coming to a train forum and reading nothing but complaining. Yes, there are legitimate issues with quality that are informative. But sometimes that line between a reasonable complaint and just plain ol' grumbling gets blurred.
It amazes me the amount and variety of product that IS available in 3-rail already given the small market share. What further amazes me even more is the HO and N scale guys still do far more scratch-building, kit-bashing and custom repainting that is done in O. Which is why the detail parts an decals are still more easily available in those scales.
Lucky for me as an 027 guy, I can cob decals from different scales and still do a vast amount of repainting and kit-bashing. I just finished some Procor 027 tank cars. What also astounds me when I have done shows, is that it is the HO guys who give me the most compliments. I'll ask why, and they say "we just don't see many Lionel guys doing what you're doing."
But to each their own. Rather than grumble that Lionel hasn't made this, I'll just make it myself... which is my fun part of the hobby.
And when I get a digital camera, I'm going to post some photos just to encourage other non-scale traditional 0/027 modelers.
I agree with you. Heck, I have a 610 NW2 with a cab light added, my 258 steamer has a Marx tender and a firebox light, a Marx 4 wheel gondola I recently converted to run in my Lionel consists, a box cab diesel of tinplate origins (Marx tender and Lionel caboose frame) is currently in the shops, and to top it all off, I am using some of my more common rolling stock to make my own molds, to start making some trains myself.
Totally agree! Have fun! That's the point. It really bothers me on a few of the forum members here that practically belittle someone because they want to do something that is not cost feasible to someone else. Or get all over someone because they don't update their "for sale" ad immediately. Some people have other commitments like a job!! what really gets me is one particular member from the 2 rail side of the forum that will tell someone "that's not correct, it doesn't have enough rivets" or "they didn't run that with those". Really??? My trains,my world.
The whole point of this hobby is to have fun with it and play trains! I get enough of the "gotta be correct" crowd from my job as a muscle car restoration technician. I play trains because it is relaxation from every day life. And........I will run whatever I want in whatever paint scheme with whatever I want. Even if it doesn't have the correct amount of rivets.
As a side note, In a few of the local clubs in this area (not many it's California) I have noticed quite a few younger people getting into the hobby which gives me a good feeling.
Just my opinion! Paul
I read the thread title and I thought it was going to be an all doom and gloom topic.
I have to say I have been in this hobby since I was a kid and I have never seen so many in 3 rail.
Our round robin club has grown so large its getting hard to host everyone in the basement!
Was at my first York this year and there was a line of new members waiting to join before the Friday morning bell.
brianel_k-lineguy posted:It amazes me the amount and variety of product that IS available in 3-rail already given the small market share. What further amazes me even more is the HO and N scale guys still do far more scratch-building, kit-bashing and custom repainting that is done in O. Which is why the detail parts an decals are still more easily available in those scales.
I agree, and that's not at all limited to the 3-rail folks. I see a lot of people in On30 who run everything out of the box with no modifications, weathering, etc. Heck, I recently showed someone photos of my own On30 rolling stock and his jaw hit the floor. He stammered out, "Its... it's weathered and not in the paint and lettering jobs they came with!" Well, I reminded him, the locos are in a couple of cases as Bachmann made exactly what I was looking for. But he immediately pointed out I'd re-numbered one, added coal and headlight cover, number plates, etc.
He was equally surprised I only had two kits built on the layout, one Woodland Scenics out of the box one (even that one was heavily modified) and the rest was scratchbuilt. He said, and I quote, "I had no idea that O scalers ever did stuff like this." He said he hardly ever saw anyone in a scale larger than HO doing anything of the type. He went on to say he saw far more scratchbuilding done in scales smaller than ours. I countered that by pointing out some of the large local layouts with plenty of plastic kits for everything...
Back in the day, all narrow gauge folks had to do a crazy amount of scratchbuilding. Not so much anymore in this era of RTR narrow gauge stuff, though.
I'm not worried at all about how many are into O gauge or the age of the avg hobbyist. I am worried about the age of most of our vendors, importers, hobby stores, etc, etc. While Lionel is privately owned more likely be around for another 100 years, what about MTH? How long is Mike going to want to do this before he buys his retirement home in Miami and gets those Dolphin season tickets? 3rdrail, Scott been doing this a long time, If I were him, I'd be getting sick of the trips to Asia every three weeks. Weaver, already gone due to a retirement. Hobby stores? I don't know a hobby stored owned by a individual under 50. Good example CharlesRO, how old is he? Last, but not to wish any ill will to our friends at OGR but they aren't getting any younger.
So who's going to step up and replace what we'll no doubt lose to retirement or worse?
superwarp1 posted:Hobby stores? I don't know a hobby stored owned by a individual under 50.
Good point. I only know of ONE, anywhere. Tacoma trains is owned by a guy in his 40s, I think. But yeah, young people simply aren't buying into hobby shops.
As for the vendors, once these companies go under, there will be someone realizing that there is money to be had. But I can't tell what that future's going to look like.
Amen!!! I'm having fun every day with this hobby.
Before I get out of the business, I am going to write a 'Tell All' book. It should prove to be interesting! LOL
We went to the Lionel store today in Concord NC. We got there a few minutes before it opened. We had an enjoyable conversation with two twenty-somethings that both were there to buy track to expand their layouts....we talked trains and both were very knowledgeable and enthusiastic. Between these guys and my grandkids (who LOVE trains) I see good things.....and I'm happy....so all good.
The train hobby is alive and well but undeniably changing. There are still enough model railroaders to keep the hobby interesting, fun and prosperous. If you have no concerns about the future of the hobby than everything is wonderful but lets be realistic ; on its existing path there will come a point when the audience will severely shrink . This may be inevitable but I am one of the hobbyists that really wants to show the next generation how nice model railroading can be. If we do a good job at promoting the hobby there are bound to be some new people that will step into the hobby. Will our children show interest in this hobby one day? I say yes, but my prediction is that it won't happen until they themselves are in our age group.
I agree with Dennis that it may be when the younger generation gets a bit older before they show heavy interest . A lot of it has to do with nostalgia and memories of your childhood and parents for a lot of people . And of course you've got to be a bit older to get to that point in life . I know this isn't the case for everyone as to why they have interest in model railroading , but it is for a lot , including me.
If we do a good job at promoting the hobby there are bound to be some new people that will step into the hobby.
The age old question is: "How does one promote the hobby?"
What do ANY of the manufacturers in ANY gauge do to promote the hobby?
I think the best way to promote the hobby is to make it known that you enjoy Model Railroading / Train Collecting, and offer help to anyone who is interested whenever possible.
superwarp1 posted:I'm not worried at all about how many are into O gauge or the age of the avg hobbyist. I am worried about the age of most of our vendors, importers, hobby stores, etc, etc. While Lionel is privately owned more likely be around for another 100 years, what about MTH? How long is Mike going to want to do this before he buys his retirement home in Miami and gets those Dolphin season tickets? 3rdrail, Scott been doing this a long time, If I were him, I'd be getting sick of the trips to Asia every three weeks. Weaver, already gone due to a retirement. Hobby stores? I don't know a hobby stored owned by a individual under 50. Good example CharlesRO, how old is he? Last, but not to wish any ill will to our friends at OGR but they aren't getting any younger.
So who's going to step up and replace what we'll no doubt lose to retirement or worse?
And while not a hobby store but in the same category as Weaver, RMT is likewise defunct with the retirement of owner Walter Matuch.
And people like Andre are just starting up. Or adding things like Ogre. Or constantly improving and adding like Ross, Miller, etc. Have you checked out the new Korber line? Menards is adding new products so fast I can't keep up with it.
Sure things change but there are a lot of positive things happening. Lots of people have been moaning about York. It is changing and those in charge will either get it straight or someone else will step up with something else. My bet is that we will be looking at a different and revived York in the next 12-18 months.
i took my four year grandson to York. He loved it and has a new Lionchief engine... He picked it out. His brother doesn't know it yet but has something coming in tomorrow thanks to Charlie (Nassau). Kids like these are the future and we have to make it happen. Hopefully their parents will help but if not, we will do our best to instill trains.
As someone else said, "Have fun." This is what it is all about.
"buy what you like"
This is probably the only REAL complaint I have, not enough accurate pieces available in the roadname I like. So far 3rd Rail/GGD has given me hope, the others not so much.
I've been fortunate in that I have had very little go wrong with my stuff (that I haven't caused myself). I give ALL the makers credit for the great products they offer.
As long as I have access to paint and decals I can make do, but these are like the tide, they come and go.
The good thing is I'm basically done with buying and enjoy the load of stuff I have.
To put it all in perspective, just think of the people out there that can't afford any hobby, let alone one that costs more than some people can afford to spend on food every month.
We have it good.
Run em if ya got em and enjoy. I do. One day it will be nostalgic?
C W Burfle posted:If we do a good job at promoting the hobby there are bound to be some new people that will step into the hobby.
The age old question is: "How does one promote the hobby?"
What do ANY of the manufacturers in ANY gauge do to promote the hobby?
I think the best way to promote the hobby is to make it known that you enjoy Model Railroading / Train Collecting, and offer help to anyone who is interested whenever possible.
If you've ever been to a Worlds Greatest Hobby on Tour show; they are loaded with young people and families. There are train rides, balloons, popcorn, cotton candy and hands on exhibits for children. Most of the people there I have never seen before. I also open my home to all in my family, friends and anyone that wants to see four trains run simultaneously on a scratch built 15' x 28'layout.
If you take a look at York, you see the same tired aging audience year after year. It succeeds at being the " senior citizens rest home" of the train world. If there is a future for this hobby York is certainly not where its at.
I agree with the topic starter and I will add: stop worrying about how anyone else but you enjoys the train hobby.
It should not matter (but apparently does to too many judging by this board):
You get my point.
I often don't understand why people just can't have fun their way in the hobby, without expressing disdain for others who enjoy it differently.
Dennis LaGrua posted:C W Burfle posted:If we do a good job at promoting the hobby there are bound to be some new people that will step into the hobby.
The age old question is: "How does one promote the hobby?"
What do ANY of the manufacturers in ANY gauge do to promote the hobby?
I think the best way to promote the hobby is to make it known that you enjoy Model Railroading / Train Collecting, and offer help to anyone who is interested whenever possible.
If you've ever been to a Worlds Greatest Hobby on Tour show; they are loaded with young people and families. There are train rides, balloons, popcorn, cotton candy and hands on exhibits for children. Most of the people there I have never seen before.
And then they go home. It's an afternoon's entertainment for most.
If everyone that attended a WGHoT show became a model railroader, we'd need a hobby shop on every street corner.
Rusty
If you've ever been to a Worlds Greatest Hobby on Tour show; they are loaded with young people and families.
Same goes for the locally promoted train shows around here. The few that get into trains beyond the Christmas tree go with HO or perhaps N gauge.
As Rusty wrote: And then they go home. It's an afternoon's entertainment for most.
If you take a look at York, you see the same tired aging audience year after year. It succeeds at being the " senior citizens rest home" of the train world. If there is a future for this hobby York is certainly not where its at
Here we go again.
York was never intended to be a platform to recruit new people. It is a gathering for people who are already into the hobbies of collecting or operating. The curious are certainly welcome to attend once as a "guest".
brianel_k-lineguy posted:I agree with you Jim.
With all the information available with the internet and this forum, it can potentially help the hobby. It's wonderful to be able to post a train question and have it answered within hours. Or to share some aspect of the hobby.
On the other hand, with the immediacy of the information age also comes the age old tendency of people to complain. Now factor in how diverse the 3-rail market is along with the fact our segment of the hobby is dwarfed by both HO and N scales. There's no financially feasible way the manufacturers can offer the variety of HO and N scales in 3-rail, yet that doesn't stop folks from grumbling about it.
That can be a downside of coming to a train forum and reading nothing but complaining. Yes, there are legitimate issues with quality that are informative. But sometimes that line between a reasonable complaint and just plain ol' grumbling gets blurred.
It amazes me the amount and variety of product that IS available in 3-rail already given the small market share. What further amazes me even more is the HO and N scale guys still do far more scratch-building, kit-bashing and custom repainting that is done in O. Which is why the detail parts an decals are still more easily available in those scales.
Lucky for me as an 027 guy, I can cob decals from different scales and still do a vast amount of repainting and kit-bashing. I just finished some Procor 027 tank cars. What also astounds me when I have done shows, is that it is the HO guys who give me the most compliments. I'll ask why, and they say "we just don't see many Lionel guys doing what you're doing."
But to each their own. Rather than grumble that Lionel hasn't made this, I'll just make it myself... which is my fun part of the hobby.
And when I get a digital camera, I'm going to post some photos just to encourage other non-scale traditional 0/027 modelers.
I for one look forward to seeing some of your photos. Having a smaller layout now I am focused more on postwar/027 cars.
"If you take a look at York, you see the same tired aging audience year after year. It succeeds at being the " senior citizens rest home" of the train world. If there is a future for this hobby York is certainly not where its at."
Yes, and we all will die some day. Being tired and and aging ain't a crime, at least not yet 
. And most of us plan on living and playing with trains while we're still here. This is a hobby, like most others, and thus particularly suited to later life and engaged in later in life.
If one looks at York and manages to see something negative, it reflects more on who one is and one's values than on the people at York.
MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do realize, you are lamenting lamenting, right?
Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do realize, you are lamenting lamenting, right?
Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. Enjoy the hobby, buy what you like, run your layout the way you like, if it's too expensive don't buy it and remember, ALL MANUFACTURERS HAVE PROBLEMS FROM TIME TO TIME. The most important thing is have fun and build your world any way you like.
You seem to be the only one that thinks so.
MONON_JIM posted:Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do realize, you are lamenting lamenting, right?
Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. Enjoy the hobby, buy what you like, run your layout the way you like, if it's too expensive don't buy it and remember, ALL MANUFACTURERS HAVE PROBLEMS FROM TIME TO TIME. The most important thing is have fun and build your world any way you like.
You seem to be the only one that thinks so.
It's a gift.
"Lament: to express regret or disappointment about." Concise Oxford English Dictionary.
And yes, I am having fun, a great time of it all. Are you?
FrankM.
I think after a while the ahnds on hobbies will make some sort of come. This present generations "boob tube", the smart phone, will get old, and he/he will want something "raal 3D" hobby.
Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do realize, you are lamenting lamenting, right?
Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. Enjoy the hobby, buy what you like, run your layout the way you like, if it's too expensive don't buy it and remember, ALL MANUFACTURERS HAVE PROBLEMS FROM TIME TO TIME. The most important thing is have fun and build your world any way you like.
You seem to be the only one that thinks so.It's a gift.
"Lament: to express regret or disappointment about." Concise Oxford English Dictionary.
And yes, I am having fun, a great time of it all. Are you?
FrankM.
As a matter of fact I am, are you. I am glad you know how to use a dictionary,
MONON_JIM posted:Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do
You seem to be the only one that thinks so.It's a gift.
"Lament: to express regret or disappointment about." Concise Oxford English Dictionary.
And yes, I am having fun, a great time of it all. Are you?
FrankM.
As a matter of fact I am, are you. I am glad you know how to use a dictionary,
Yes, well, I do what I can, joie de vivre and all that, and I enjoy giving special attention to such concepts as irony as they present themselves in life. 
lol 
MONON_JIM posted:Moonson posted:MONON_JIM posted:Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. ....
You do realize, you are lamenting lamenting, right?
Why, instead of enjoying the hobby and doing our part to get new people interested of all ages, do we constantly lament the state of thing. Enjoy the hobby, buy what you like, run your layout the way you like, if it's too expensive don't buy it and remember, ALL MANUFACTURERS HAVE PROBLEMS FROM TIME TO TIME. The most important thing is have fun and build your world any way you like.
You seem to be the only one that thinks so.
Not lamenting the state of the hobby though.
You're blessed with a good sense of humor and play, MONON JIM.
P.S. If I may ask, is the "MONON" short for and reminiscent of good times along the Monongahela River, like along the stretch between McKeesport and Duquesne, PA? If so, here's a wave 
from a hometown boy.
Thanks. This place should be fun, Monsoon !.......The Monon is actually the Chicago, Indianapolis and Louisville Railroad. This is from the Monon Historical Site .The Chicago, Indianapolis & Louisville Railroad, known affectionately as the Monon, is Indiana's own. Monon derives from Potawatomi Indian words that sounded to the first settlers like metamonong or monong and seemingly meant "tote", or "swift running". In 1882, the railroad started printing "The Monon Route" on company maps, later naming itself "Monon - The Hoosier Line" on timetables, letterheads, and rolling stock. The railroad operated almost exclusively in the state of Indiana and ran through the city of Monon.
Thanks Monon Jim for your thoughts ... positive thoughts!
I totally enjoy my layout! Its fun to dream and create vignettes, landscapes, and track plans. Its wonderful to use the imagination in such a healthy way as we model railroaders can do. Although I pocess a keen awareness of model railroad history, I have no anxiety about what happened in the hobby yesterday or what may happen next year or ten years from now. I have no control over those things, so why waste the energy worrying about something I have no control of. I have always been enthusiastic about model trains/ real trains and I believe my enthusiasm to be infectious, hence the parents of the kids next door are turning an attic room into a train room because their kids caught the train bug from me
I totally enjoy all aspects of this hobby as it is NOW because NOW is all that truly exists. When I'm in my train room I'm in the NOW playing and having fun.
The only permanents is impermanents. The only constant is change. My intention is to totally enjoy my layout to the max while I still have it and totally enjoy myself while I'm still on the sunny side of the dirt
Monon Jim, nobody could have said it better. Enjoy your trains and have fun. Enjoy them for what they are and not what they might be worth some day. People who put value ahead of fun are missing out.
Patrick W, you are a man who knows how to enjoy.
I have recently got back into the train layout world after almost 20 years and I see so much more available than back then. I am building a new layout, bigger and better than the last one. So this is the new Golden age!
I was really pleased to see a young couple purchase the LHS, Oak Mountain Hobbies, here in Pelham, AL. They have a lot of train stuff, HO, O, N along with planes, cars, etc. They are very enthusiastic and are getting involved in the various train organizations in the area. I use my trains as an outlet for my time and the desire to learn new things and conquer engineering challenges as well as an avenue to expose others to the hobby. It is such a delight to see the expressions on kids of all ages as they watch and operate the trains. Yes, it malfunctions at times, but as I explain, it is a toy to be played with. Nobody expects perfection in operation. If you have to manually operate something, so be it. Not everyone my age, 71, was into trains when I was a kid, and they aren't now, but they like to see them run. Let's not stick our head in the ground and forecast doom. Let's play and have a good time operating our RailRoad. This forum has been a great source of info and help and it is interesting to listen to everyone's ideas. We all have different needs and desires about how this hobby fits into our lives. Well enough, it is back to the train room and my world of enjoying trains and accessories.
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