Sunset "More Power to America" PA demonstrators

What years were these engines painted this way?  Thanks.

CAPPilot posted:

What years were these engines painted this way?  Thanks.

1950.

Oh my...it looks like a second mortgage!

Norm

So it is really ten units, or 20 bodies.  That sort of changes the equation, doesn't it?  And if you do not get nine takers, this looks like the world's easiest paint job.

I assume this run will be plastic?

Put me down for a few sets of pilot coupler covers. 

bob2 posted:

So it is really ten units, or 20 bodies.  That sort of changes the equation, doesn't it?  And if you do not get nine takers, this looks like the world's easiest paint job.

I assume this run will be plastic?

Plastic it is.  With all the usual brass details.

RDUNNIII,

Hello,

I just heard about your post for these Alco PA demonstrators. I've wanted this set for many years and have contacted some manufacturers about them offering PA PB set. No luck. Good to see you might get this done.

I do have a few questions...
Will they be done in a gloss coat as seen in the photo of the prototype in your post?
Will it be a powered PA and dummy PB?
Would we still pay through 3rd Rail for these?

Thanks so much and good luck with the orders.

Great idea, RDUNNIII. I'm a 3-railer that would be in for a set. I would also love to see them in high gloss as delivered. Evan though there's been no formal announcement, any idea of a deadline for ordering?

Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines posted:

RDUNNIII,

Hello,

I just heard about your post for these Alco PA demonstrators. I've wanted this set for many years and have contacted some manufacturers about them offering PA PB set. No luck. Good to see you might get this done.

I do have a few questions...
Will they be done in a gloss coat as seen in the photo of the prototype in your post?
Will it be a powered PA and dummy PB?
Would we still pay through 3rd Rail for these?

Thanks so much and good luck with the orders.

The finish and color and finish will be as close as possible to what you see in the photo.  So yes, glossy.

The A will be powered.  Whether or not the B is powered depends on whether or not the 3-rail B units are powered.  So far I think 3-rail B units have not been powered.  Both 2-rail units will be powered.  The units will have the same tech specs as any other PAs Sunset does.

You'll be purchasing them through me.  That is the deal I have with Sunset.  So you need to let me know if you want a set and whether 2 or 3-rail.

Mill City posted:

Great idea, RDUNNIII. I'm a 3-railer that would be in for a set. I would also love to see them in high gloss as delivered. Evan though there's been no formal announcement, any idea of a deadline for ordering?

There will be no deadline as such.  I am reserving 10 AB sets, of which one is mine.  Once the other 9 have been spoken for then no more will be available.  The only potential change to that is if more than 9 people sign up for a set before Sunset closes their reservations in general for PAs.  But I highly doubt that will happen.

I think it is great that you are doing that.  Hope it works really well. I love PAs and anything orange or red.

Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines posted:

RDUNNIII,

Hello,

I just heard about your post for these Alco PA demonstrators. I've wanted this set for many years and have contacted some manufacturers about them offering PA PB set. No luck. Good to see you might get this done.

They are beautiful engines. As these were powering the GE "More Power To America" train, are they actually ALCO PA Demonstrators? Or just leased to GE and then refurbished and sold like the Freedom Train PA?

BobbyD posted:

Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines posted:

RDUNNIII,

Hello,

I just heard about your post for these Alco PA demonstrators. I've wanted this set for many years and have contacted some manufacturers about them offering PA PB set. No luck. Good to see you might get this done.

They are beautiful engines. As these were powering the GE "More Power To America" train, are they actually ALCO PA Demonstrators? Or just leased to GE and then refurbished and sold like the Freedom Train PA?

It looks like they were just leased to GE for the More Power To America train.

The PA's were then sold to the NYC as their 4212 and 4304.  The passenger cars went to the Rock Island.

Rusty

I would like a 3-rail set of these.  Count me in.  

Count me in for a 3 rail set too! I can't pass up on these unique demonstrators!

Wow!  Looks like this is really happening!

Congrats, RDUNNIII! You're a hero!

Depending on what Rio Grande scheme is offered I would be in for a set in 2 rail.

I am in for a set in 3 rail, please.  I would prefer the B unit powered, but either way is OK. 

 I'll be looking forward to updates when available!  I never thought I'd ever have a chance to own these - they're the

Best New Year's present yet.  Thank You in advance

rdunniii posted:

As Scott indirectly preannounced doing Alco PAs yesterday he has asked me to get something out in the open early.

Nice work to rally support for the paint scheme you wanted!

Did Scott mention when he would "directly" announce production of these Alcos and which roads would be offered??????

I'm more of a steam guy but I find myself suddenly on hold for any major new locomotive purchases in anticipation of quality 3rd Rail Alco PAs and a PB.........

He told me he wanted to have the PAs delivered before the end of 2016.  That's when the money has to be spent so that is the time I care about.  Whether or not they are announced next week or in September doesn't cost me a dime.  My guess is April or May after the SD7/9s are delivered.

Santiago, you and me both.  Between D&RGW and SP I could be in for 6 ABA sets in addition to the demos so I'm kinda hoping one or 2 schemes don't make the cut and I can't afford to float them also.  Hmmmm, maybe that was Scott's plan in the first place.

All I gotta say is thank God it won't be die cast.  I have enough bronze PAs to last a lifetime.  One still has to go to the nickel platers.

I hope SS doesn't rush the PA's as they did with the F7's. Wouldn't mind seeing them in 2017.

found out OMI did this set in HO a few years ago... worth a look.

http://brasstrains.com/Classic...-GE-PA-PB-2-Demo-Set

SANTIAGOP23 posted:

I hope SS doesn't rush the PA's as they did with the F7's. Wouldn't mind seeing them in 2017.

How long is pretty much irrelevant anymore.  The F7s took as long as any other recent model.  Nothing was rushed.

THEN there is what the builders will do, and that can be a carp shoot.  Looks like Atlas's builders pulled a faux pas big enough on their F7s to cause the recent delay.   And Key's builder caused really stupid and annoying issues with their FTs.  And the Key FTs were about 2 years late.  So lateness does not necessarily equate to betterness.  It more relates to builders ignorance of what they are building and what matters to the customer.  And having a rep in the know being there to catch things and answer questions before the builder gets a chance to interpret anything, anything, anything is how that is dealt with.  It's a widget to them, nothing more, nothing less.

As for the OMI version, please don't expect that orange cause I would never OK it (and seeing as how I'm buying them all I get a say in the color).  Needs to be more of a burnt orange.

My point exactly! It takes longer because corrections are being made. That builders don't care and make mistakes is apparent. The difference is that atlas and key send them back whilst 3rd rail decided to release them.

I agree on the orange, a bit too bright.

SANTIAGOP23 posted:

My point exactly! It takes longer because corrections are being made. That builders don't care and make mistakes is apparent. The difference is that atlas and key send them back whilst 3rd rail decided to release them.

I agree on the orange, a bit too bright.

Key never sent back the set I have, they are pretty much not runnable on any track except on straight track.  And all because of something they put on the model that is not a part of the prototype anyway.  The point is corrections have to be made in the design stage not in the build stage.  Once tooling is made it's too late, not because of time but because of $$$.  Atlas's margin just took a hit because of any changes they are requiring at this point because builders will not absorb the cost of any changes regardless of what, why or who.

What a minute. Shouldn't I announce the PAs first? 

Sometimes things just run away on their own.

The new factory is working out great. We are reviewing the roller bearings that are to be used on all new diesels, aluminum and brass cars going forward.

The design group is already working on the PA/PB design. I will put them up on our web site in a few weeks.

The current plan is 3R B units, dummy, 3R A units powered. This goes for Richard's order too.

Finish: Well, we got some complaints about the F7s being too glossy, so we will tone it down a little. We call it Satin finish and for a scale model is still reflects light.

Now that we are free of the old factory, we can control things much better. That was a 1 year struggle.

Cheers,

Scott Mann

Hi Scott!

If and when you announce the PAs, will there be other roads to go along with the demos?

Norm

Norm posted:

Hi Scott!

If and when you announce the PAs, will there be other roads to go along with the demos?

Norm

Norm,

Just how many ALCO PA models do you think Scott could sell if he DIDN'T offer any other railroads?

I would guess that the AT&SF, SP, D&RGW, NKP, and PRR alone will be huge sellers. I might even spring for a Southern Pacific set.

Hot Water,

Just sending out a little teaser there!

Norm

With the PA's "announced" can the FA announcement be far behind?

Jan

Oh, as for rushing projects, that won't happen again. It wasn't rushing, it was a factory that went rogue on us. We have ceased working with them, and our new factory is completely under our control.

Sending things back to a factory is a last resort. You run the risk of a factory giving up on you as a customer and never receiving the goods from customs. After 30 days customs may destroy your models if not delivered. 

It means one failed to inspect properly at the factory, which we do for every project. In the case of the F7, we were under duress and needed to get our models outta there as the factory was taken over by hostile management.  We inspected them. We corrected what they were willing to correct. But this factory would only argue with us who's fault it was in the end. I gave them the Donald Trump, 'Your Fired"... they just don't know it yet.

So going forward, all our new projects will be much better controlled, such as SD7.9, E8.9, PAs, L-131, S-12, CB&Q O1, and all the new car projects.

Scott Mann

Just checked back in to this topic.  When announced sign me up for Rio Grande PA's!!

You know it, Bill!

I'm rooting for 3 striped black!

Since they have never been done before in non-brass O scale, I would buy these 2:

SANTIAGOP23 posted:

You know it, Bill!

I'm rooting for 3 striped black!

That scheme is nice, but Lionel already made a pretty accurate scale version in that scheme a few years ago.  That is why I prefer this one because it has not been done before in plastic:

Santiago,

Thanks for the beautiful pictures of beautiful PA's.  Been hoping for a long time now that Scott will do PA's.

Tough choice but if ony one choice I agree with the original paint scheme since I have the recent Sunset Grande Aspen Gold/Silver FT's and F7's.  But, then the PA's are so beautiful maybe we should order them in both Grande paint schemes?  

Scott, c'mon, might as well announce them!   Bet you'll sell a bunch of them.  Make sure to include the Grande!!  2 rail DCC for me.

Bill

rdunniii posted:

SANTIAGOP23 posted:

My point exactly! It takes longer because corrections are being made. That builders don't care and make mistakes is apparent. The difference is that atlas and key send them back whilst 3rd rail decided to release them.

I agree on the orange, a bit too bright.

Key never sent back the set I have, they are pretty much not runnable on any track except on straight track.  And all because of something they put on the model that is not a part of the prototype anyway.  The point is corrections have to be made in the design stage not in the build stage.  Once tooling is made it's too late, not because of time but because of $$$.  Atlas's margin just took a hit because of any changes they are requiring at this point because builders will not absorb the cost of any changes regardless of what, why or who.

Interesting Eric L. has posted a number of videos featuring the Key PAs and FTs runing on friends layouts although he has indicated that the PAs need a very large radius to operate.just saying

Austin Bill posted:

Santiago,

Thanks for the beautiful pictures of beautiful PA's.  Been hoping for a long time now that Scott will do PA's.

Tough choice but if ony one choice I agree with the original paint scheme since I have the recent Sunset Grande Aspen Gold/Silver FT's and F7's.  But, then the PA's are so beautiful maybe we should order them in both Grande paint schemes?  

Scott, c'mon, might as well announce them!   Bet you'll sell a bunch of them.  Make sure to include the Grande!!  2 rail DCC for me.

Bill

JTRAIN, I run 2 rail DCC. I love them both, and would actually order one of each if offered.

Bill, since the detailing on the black and aspen schemes is the same, the only difference would be the painting and decals. Perhaps offering both would be the way to go.