I just stumbled across this article on how they are experimenting with trains as a storage device for renewable energy. Thoughts?
The Article:
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But what happens when all the cars have gone down the hill?
Takes energy to get the cars up the hill, a good portion of the solar energy generated, would be used to obtain the potential energy/storage position.
The Prius, (a hybrid), is storing energy in the battery when you go down hill. The concept does a pretty good job of taking a 25 mile per gallon car and turning the gasoline motor off, 1/2 the time, i.e. 50 miles per gallon.
Some Hyro power systems pump water from lower elevation reservoirs to higher elevation reservoirs during low demand periods as a method of storing power. Then during peak demand, they let the water run back and generate electricity.
This sounds like a similar idea.
Iore, among the world's most powerful locomotives, hauls ore in Sweden/Norway. Hauling these ore trains are Bombardier’s I-ORE (Iron Ore) two unit locomotives which at 10,800 kW (14,500 hp) are the world’s most powerful. At 2 x 180 tonnes they are also among the world’s heaviest locomotives with steel body panels 4 cm thick. They have a maximum speed of 80 km/h (so much for hp = speed) but are limited to 60 km/h hauling loaded trains. Iore has regenerative breaking which is fed back into catenary system. The trains produce 25% electricity that they consume thereby saving money as well as reducing emissions.
C W Burfle posted:Some Hyro power systems pump water from lower elevation reservoirs to higher elevation reservoirs during low demand periods as a method of storing power. Then during peak demand, they let the water run back and generate electricity.
This sounds like a similar idea.
Yes, and I'd far rather live next to the rail system than the hydro system! All that water, poised on the top of a high hill...in Missouri, we had one of those reservoirs give way several years ago. Thank God it was not in a populated area, and the flood only swept away boulders and trees!
Mike CT posted:Takes energy to get the cars up the hill, a good portion of the solar energy generated, would be used to obtain the potential energy/storage position.
That is also the case with the hydro system CW was talking about. The point is not that this is efficient. It is that it lets you store at least some of your excess power and then release it at peak times. Inefficient storage is still much better than no storage.
WBC, you want to translate that into English? 
I don't do metrics and have no idea what your numbers mean.
The Milwaukee Road used to dispatch its freight trains in Washington, whenever possible, so that one was on another long ascending grade while another was descending using regenerative braking.
2.54 cm = 1 inch
kph/1.6 = mph
1 tonne = 1.102 tons
Thus, IORE has a top speed of 50 mph and service speed in the 35-40 mph range. The panels are over 1.5 inches thick and the locomotive weight is just shy of 800,000 pounds.
A few technical details of IORE here: http://www.4rail.net/reference...en_locos_el_iore.php
I find IORE an awesome chooch and the fact that they use the locomotives to power each other is a bonus; however, must admit that the links above have some head scratchers when it comes to the "worlds most _____". While IORE is a C-C+C-C pair of units that are permanently coupled together, it is considered a single locomotive. Because the pair of units are considered a single unit the 14,500 hp is the most powerful for a locomotive in the world; however, each unit is 7,250 hp which is not the most powerful. The most powerful single unit locomotive is the Chinese HXD3B which is nearly 13,000 hp (nearly the same for the double unit IORE or 3 times an ES44AC) for a C-C wheel arrangement and top speed of 75 mph. IORE is considered the heaviest, but each individual unit weighs 400,000 pounds which is less than a SD70ACe or ES44AC. The 314,730 lbf of tractive effort is also considered the worlds most but each unit produces 160,000 which is less than either a SD70ACe or ES44AC. As Obi-wan Kenobi would say, depends upon point of view.
The storage of energy goes a step further with the Tesla electric car. Key is the battery and a battery manufacturing facility, Reno, Nevada. These Lithium polymer batteries have a very good power (storage) to weight ratio, designed for the Tesla car, some of the solar energy companies said with these storage batteries they could do a solar powered home without back-up power from the electric grid.
Important part of WBC's post was the "trains produce 25% of the energy they use"
The concept of "free" energy is flawed. When you consider losses and maintenance involved. The advocates usually skip over those details.
