When I was on a tight budget in the 90's, K-Line was my favored choice. Maury Klein came out with so many unique issues with good detail at an appealing price. In particular, the K-Line Collectors club offered tremendous bargains and great deals even when he adopted TMCC. Even to this day, I am sorry I didn't buy more K-Line products to now pop in the ERR modules. When K-Line unfortunately went away (a big loss to the hobby) I greatly increased more MTH purchases. It took me a long time to buy any new Lionel engines. Even with the invention of TMCC by Neil Young, I never found Lionel's offerings as appealing as K-Line or MTH until many years later.
@Landsteiner posted:"Considering the MTH set had all the same high-end electronics as their more expensive products, came with a loop of sturdy RealTrax, and all the stock had die cast trucks whereas the average Lionel set only had the lightweight O-27 track, plastic trucks, and only a whistle/horn for around the same price, it was kind of a no brainer what set an average parent would choose."
With the caveat that the MTH set was probably around $150- $200 more than the average Lionel set, so there's that issue. Pretty much double the cost for a toy that may or may not interest the recipient to set up beyond the typical Christmas tree display. So perhaps not so much a no-brainer for folks who were price sensitive. A typical Thomas set might be available for under $100 at times, compared with the MTH, with better quality and features, but running three times that.
You didnt read Toms whole response I guess
"Considering the MTH set had all the same high-end electronics as their more expensive products, came with a loop of sturdy RealTrax, and all the stock had die cast trucks whereas the average Lionel set only had the lightweight O-27 track, plastic trucks, and only a whistle/horn for around the same price, it was kind of a no brainer what set an average parent would choose."
"You didnt read Toms whole response I guess"
I sure did. I just pointed out that the additional features and quality cost more money.
Answering the original post question.
My family setup Lionel trains at Christmas time back in the 60's. Starting in 1970 with MPC, I began buying engines and rolling stock with my paper route money. It was a very fun time for O gauge. Lionel was printing catalogs, and there was always something to get excited about. If it wasn't for MPC O gauge might have ended.
Side note, I still run and enjoy the engines I bought with paper route money as a kid.
MPC fun lasted through out the 70's and into the 80's. In the 80's there was progress made as engines became dual motors, better selection of road names and Mighty Sound of Steam came out. Mighty Sound of Steam was hokey even for it's day but it was fun none the less.
I'd say starting past the later 80's things became pretty stale. A lot of the same Lionel products and not so much to get excited about anymore. Williams at the time wasn't all that great IMO. I had a dual engined FM Trainmaster that would stop and start on a dime. Often uncoupling the cars behind it no matter how slow you tried make the engine run. Kline to me was just selling track and didn't hit its stride until later.
Then in the early 90's I was getting flyers from this place called Mikes Train House. It looked cool but I wasn't going to spend money based on a flyer. A few years later MTH hit the local hobby store and I never looked back. By that I mean I never bought another Lionel engine and stuck primarily with MTH, and to a lesser degree Kline/Williams. Another boost to the hobby was Atlas O. They don't get enough love in my opinion.
@ChiTown Steve posted:Answering the original post question.
My family setup Lionel trains at Christmas time back in the 60's. Starting in 1970 with MPC, I began buying engines and rolling stock with my paper route money. It was a very fun time for O gauge. Lionel was printing catalogs, and there was always something to get excited about. If it wasn't for MPC O gauge might have ended.
Side note, I still run and enjoy the engines I bought with paper route money as a kid.
MPC fun lasted through out the 70's and into the 80's. In the 80's there was progress made as engines became dual motors, better selection of road names and Mighty Sound of Steam came out. Mighty Sound of Steam was hokey even for it's day but it was fun none the less.
I'd say starting past the later 80's things became pretty stale. A lot of the same Lionel products and not so much to get excited about anymore. Williams at the time wasn't all that great IMO. I had a dual engined FM Trainmaster that would stop and start on a dime. Often uncoupling the cars behind it no matter how slow you tried make the engine run. Kline to me was just selling track and didn't hit its stride until later.
Then in the early 90's I was getting flyers from this place called Mikes Train House. It looked cool but I wasn't going to spend money based on a flyer. A few years later MTH hit the local hobby store and I never looked back. By that I mean I never bought another Lionel engine and stuck primarily with MTH, and to a lesser degree Kline/Williams. Another boost to the hobby was Atlas O. They don't get enough love in my opinion.
That's a great overview Steve. I've learned a lot from this thread. I didn't realize KLine was it's own brand. I thought it was something Lionel did. And I actually have one of the Williams Trainmasters you describe. I bought it on eBay not knowing any better and was really unhappy with the way it ran. It's in the attic now. Finally, I never thought about any track but Atlas and was lucky that it was readily available when I became fully dedicated to the hobby. Back from when I tried HO and it didn't take I did like laying the track on cork road bed. One of the smart things I did early on was buy two big boxes on eBay. It's just really cool stuff. Sounds like it's hard to come by now.
I started my layout and getting into model trains in 1976, for my young childrem . Lionel and Marx had all O guage and later Lionel introduced MPC and the hobby picked up somewhat. In the late 1980s, Classic Toy Trains magazine gave older toy trains a jump even getting O Scale trains magazine to change title to O Gauge Trains. Later, Kline, Williams and MTH started and gave Lionel some real needed competition. None this much affected me as I was in O27 and post war and 1950s trains. All this competition has furthered the hobby and lead to the constant 18 track voltage, walk around train control and emphasis on more detailed and scale sized trains .
I have a few K-line, Williams and MTH trains but overwhelming Lionel. My only MTH is a MTH 30-2520 yellow oprn Hand Car and MTH 840 Jersey Central 0-4-0 T, Tanker or dockside switcher.
Charlie
@Scott J posted:And I actually have one of the Williams Trainmasters you describe. I bought it on eBay not knowing any better and was really unhappy with the way it ran. It's in the attic now.
These are very early in the Williams line. It didn't take them long to add a flywheel and run much smoother. Generally speaking the Williams engines run great and are very dependable.
@ChiTown Steve posted:These are very early in the Williams line. It didn't take them long to add a flywheel and run much smoother. Generally speaking the Williams engines run great and are very dependable.
I have 4 that I wired for series operation and love to watch run. No thinking required 
. Sorry that they stopped apparently.
It is interesting Steve that our perceptions differ so much.
Williams heyday of scale steam locos was from around 1980s to the early 1990s. Starting in 1986 they marketed through the Crown Edition line brass versions of the Pennsy B6, E6, L1 and at least three versions of the K4s, the UP Challenger, the USRA 4-6-2, the SP Daylight, the UP Big Boy, the USRA 2-8-2, the N&W J and a couple of others. They also released Madison cars in traditional, 70' and 80' lengths. Before the Crown Edition line they did a 4-6-2 and a Hudson. To me that period was an exciting leap forward from the postwar remakes I was used to seeing. i am not sure when Weaver began doing brass steam locos. I started receiving Weaver circulars in the early 1990s (probably from Mike's Train House) and they produced long enough that there was talk about Weaver obtaining one of the competing command systems. I am fairly certain Weaver was doing freight cars in kit form before the 1990s.
I wanted to buy scale locomotives and had purchased the Lionel Commodore Vanderbilt and the Yellow C&O Hudson. I thought TMCC was great. Then, in 1994, Mike Wolf announced the Challenger and the O gauge railroad world went totally nuts. I was barely able to get a Challenger with the help of the MTH front office. Prices were skyrocketing and the dealer I ordered from did not want to sell it to me at the prearranged price. MTH intervened and I got the Challenger. It totally revolutionized my approach to the hobby. I think Mike Wolf and MTH sent the O gauge world into hyperspace. I then bought the second articulated MTH made, the N&W Y6b. I was totally blown away by those two locos and bought DCS as soon as it came out. I have been running TMCC/Legacy/DCS ever since.
@Bill N posted:It is interesting Steve that our perceptions differ so much.
I was giving Scott my experience pre-MTH. So yes yours could be very different.
Around the times you mentioned I wasn't as involved in the hobby as Lionel didn't interest me as much. That's where my focus was at the time.
