Official York Attendance in Oct. now up.

More than 1 and less than 100,000. 

I was wondering the same thing. I wanted to post the question yesterday, but couldn't remember what it was when the time! Usually, this information is released a few weeks after the meet. I wonder if it's listed on the website?

Don

My only comment is that it was a great York Meet regardless of how many attended.

Certifiably more than two. I saw you there

Gilly

It felt a bit more than April, less than the previous October

Is that more or less than last October?

I've been going since late 80's and wondering where a record of attendance might be found?  

Why are you happy about that when 10 years ago the attendance was much higher?

So since 10 years ago has the attendance diminished due to a lack of interest or online buying?

quote:

So since 10 years ago has the attendance diminished due to a lack of interest or online buying?

Any answer would be conjecture.

I say its the bad economy.

I visited our local aquarium store yesterday. The owner pointed out some spots that used to hold tanks full of fish. Instead he had just a few decorations in each spot. He said his business has been off for years, and he hasn't seen any of the "recovery".

"So since 10 years ago has the attendance diminished due to a lack of interest or online buying?"

I would think that since it is a TCA event, it is a direct reflection of the TCA membership totals that have been dropping for several years. Despite the lower attendance, this meet provides the best opportunity to renew friendships and find product at one place that is not always available on the on-line auction sites or for that matter, anywhere else.

Because I was in attendance at the most recent York Meet, I found very rare K-Line passenger sets that have not been available through any other source. 

So long as there are sufficient sellers and buyers attending this meet to warrant it's continuance, just because there were 1,000, 1,500, etc. less members in attendance, I really will not lose any sleep over the exact number.  

It's just my opinion, but I think it's neither.  Attendance had diminished due to the aging of the collector demographic:

• Someone in his 70's goes to train shows and enjoys it
  
• Someone in his 80's goes to train shows when he feels up to it
• Someone in his 90's doesn't go to train shows.

Anyone who's been in the hobby more than 20 years has seen the above progression.  We're just not putting kids in the pipeline as fast at the other end, so the trend will continue to be down.

My $0.02 .... worth precisely that.

SJS

I am 62 years old. I am changing what I run and Buy. I am now back in a buy mode.

After being in the Hobby for 20 years, I have more than enough stuff. I buy only selected items, Not deals because I have enough stuff. Most of the people I know that have been in the hobby 20 years are selective in purchases. They are also selling off excess stuff. I am too. Factor some of this into York attendance and purchases.

And the world turns. 

It doesn't help that the TCA raised the membership dues 43% last year. I know several people including myself that found this an exorbitant price increase to pay for York attendance and dropped out of the Train Collectors Antique Society.

The highpoint of attendance at York was IIRC about 15,000. IMO, it will be on a steady decline until the meet can be opened up to everyone and despite what the ED says it can be. Just ask Greenberg Shows how they do it and follow that formula to a T. Attendance will go back up and revenue will increase. Nothing is impossible!

I wouldn't drive two hours to a Greenberg show, let alone six.

Let's not make York into a Greenberg show.

This is why York should be only once a year. The TCA membership is declining and putting on two shows a year is very expensive not only for the TCA but for the vendors and mfgs. as well. 

Once a year show in October, now that is something to look forward to IMO. 

Not this again...

Factoring in gas, food, and lodging, and not counting my train purchases, I spend about $1000 each year attending York.  I drive farther than most, but don't stay all week, so I'm guessing that my cost is fairly typical.  The $15 dues increase equates to about 1.5% of what it costs to attend York, which makes it inconsequential.  

Let's be positive about York.  If a few negative folks choose not to go, I think it improves the show.  Considering the demographics of our hobby, the numbers don't disappoint me.  

I think it would be beneficial if it could be open to the public on Saturday, but we all know why it can't be a public meet thanks to the state revenue folks.

If the only reason to join TCA is to go to York twice a year for Thursday and Friday of each meet, the $15 TCA dues increase is $3.75 per day.  That's less than a bottle of smoke fluid or about one gallon of gas.

You call that "exorbitant"?  You are entitled to do whatever you want but for me York is the greatest train show / meet and I will continue to go until I can no longer physically attend.

For reasons explained previously by the EDTCA the York Meet will NEVER be opened to the public due to agreements with the PA Dept of Revenue and sales tax for members.

I had a great story to tell BURFLE, but our webmaster delited the thread RUMOR that I had written it on. Too bad there is no way to reach CW .

I deleted that tread precisely because it was a RUMOR. You were using it to troll for argumentative responses.

Look at Burfle's profile. His email may be there.

"I wouldn't drive two hours to a Greenberg show, let alone six.

Let's not make York into a Greenberg show."

Boy do I agree with CW here. All of the Greenberg shows I have been to have been a complete bust (in my opinion).

I consider my TCA dues as a super bargain. York is an added bonus. If they went up 100%, I would still say they were a bargain for what I GET OUT OF IT.

This thread reminds me of all those "the future of the hobby" posts. Considering the lousy state of the overall economy, the aging demographics, the cost of food lodging and gas as well as buying something there, personally, those are respectable numbers..all things considered. What has not gone up in price? Is the glass half empty or half full? Frankly who cares?

If you enjoy York, then by all means enjoy it and not have some abstract free floating anxiety over what you cannot control anyway. There are more serious irons in the fire about uncertainty but this one makes a mountain out of a molehill by comparison. Sometimes it seems we "over think" the hobby as if there were not other things to participate in or enjoy. 

I have to agree about the worth of the TCA dues.  While no one likes increases in costs......it is a fact of life.  Never in my life have I attended a meet that comes close to York.  I have attended a lot of meets but none of them had the impact that York does.  In my mind...it is the "holy grail" of train meets and all I can say is if you have not attended one, you need to certainly put it on your bucket list. 

Alan

No problem with the dues increase. And let's hope it remains an April and October meet.

If the dues increase is/was needed (obviously) then so be it.  I have been going to York and a TCA member .......that is TRAIN COLLECTORS ASSOCIATION not ANTIQUES for seven years and it just keeps getting better.

    The on line registration had a few speed bumps; my TCA registration was "lost"; but I have to say...what a great bunch o' folks......thank you Eastern Division

   Maybe we all should gently..........."convincingly" prod friends to go to York and get em' signed up.  Again, the dues increase was a blip............c'mon!

The one poster that is complaining the loudest makes sure every TCA post turns into a dues increase whine fest.  If you don't want to pay fine but you've made your point countless times.

You're gonna need more then a buck Alan! Oh, you meant "bucket list" York was the reason I joined TCA.

Don

Very well stated Electroliner.

Don

I didn't see anything there for a buck this trip!

Howzabout showing that 12,355 with the highest recorded attendance....as a fraction,

decimal, or percentage?  Have we declined down from the 18,451, 722, or what?

If you only want one show, come in April OR October.....you get to pick...

At the last April York, I purchased several Lionel empty #40 orange cable reels for a buck each

quote:

Look at Burfle's profile. His email may be there.

I believe so.

Good evening everyone, hope everyone had a nice Thanksgiving.

Maybe I am missing the point to all of this attendance Hoop La.

I attend the last show this past October and I would agree there are a lot of older folks roaming up and down the aisles at the show.

But there are you mid aged gentlemen like myself and a few younger families.

Up until three years ago attending either the York spring show or the fall show was just out of reach due to my work schedule,financial and family obligations.

Which all come first before the trains.

With a position change within the company I work for and the fact that both of my boys are on their own my wife and I now have time to do other things and attending the York Show is one of those things. 

I can easily understand why you don't see younger folks attending the York shows compared to local shows at fire halls and the Greenberg shows that are usually held over the weekend and the York show is during the normal working days of the week.

As most of you know we are living in some interesting times and for younger families the average dollar is stretched to the max.

Myself before attending the York shows I would go to my local hobby shop and look for new items if I had a few extra bucks.

It was always a great time taking my boys to the hobby shop and the local train shows over a weekend.

At the time I did not know what I was missing, and I was happy with that !

As far as the hobby I think it will always be around.

The railroads are not going away or being replaced with some other mode of transportation like in the 50's and 60's. If anything there are more trains on the rails right now than in the last 25 or 30 years.

Just notice how many television commercials you see for the Class 1 Railroads.

Younger families and younger viewers see these commercial also.

Maybe the comment from a young viewer after seeing one of these commercials is, "Dad can a get a train like that"

A few Class 1 railroads are revisiting their steam programs that have been put on hold for years.

I think everyone will agree, bring out a steam engine and you have a crowd young and old alike.

I don't think the fascinations and romance of railroading, steam or diesel or as a hobby will ever go away whether the attendance at a York show is good or bad.

Maybe some ups and downs but never gone for good.

First, I love York and don't mind the dues or the increase even though it eats into my Social Security which probably won't increase by the same percentage.  It remains a place to see friends and products, products which can't be touched and seen in person since the brick and mortar stores are declining in number.  I am fortunate that I have Hennings Trains for my purchases, but they can't handle every manufacturer.  I need York twice a year, as I am building an ever changing RR.

Second, I couldn't make October York due to a health issue.  All things equal, numbers will increase by 2 in Spring as my wife and I have already booked our room.  Numbers in my opinion are just numbers.  They are only important if they show a trend over many shows, but also don't mean that if a negative trend is indicated, it can't be reversed.

Third, I plan on enjoying this hobby for a long time, God willing.  I have 2 grandsons who are showing signs of getting into the hobby as they actually totally cleaned their basement, packed their wooden Thomas trains away to sell on consignment, and will be hooking up their fathers American Flyer and HO trains.

In my opinion the cup is half full and I intend to keep it that way for a long time.  Besides, I'll just buy 1 less piece of rolling stock and pay my dues, enjoy York, and spend my energy on building my train empire rather than worrying about numbers.

Tempot in a teapest.

Waste of server space.

That should be "Tempest in a Teapot": Making a big thing out of nothing.