Closing the Gap on Lionel F Units

How tight of  curves will they negotiate?

They will negotiate 042 S curves created by back to back switches in the yard. I don't have anything tighter to try them on.

 

Pete

Man thats great. You should offer them For Sale in pairs I know I would be in for 3 pairs of the adapters

Great work Norton. I am always impressed with your work.

Rob

Thanks Rob. The respect is mutual. As for mass producing these, my Bridgeport is beat up and worn out. Not worth installing readouts on it let alone stepper motors and computer control so its too labor intensive to produce them.

You could mimic the idea using some 1/8" or 3/16" styrene to make the "L" shape and drill through holes so alignment is not so critical. Use nuts and bolts instead of threaded holes

Here is a pic of the units in the middle of an 042 S curve. While most of the rest of the layout has 072 minimum, this is a good test to demonstrate an advantage of truck mounted couplers. I don't think body mounted couplers would allow this much offset.

 

 

Pete

Amazing, nice work!

Fantastic work. The big bonus is it's totally reversible.

Unbelievable! Excellent engineering job. I don't think that could be done on MTH F units. p My buddy "SOO NUT" modified my MTH SP A-B-B-A F3 units and stuck the tethers thru the back doors, in order to hide them, but they sure won't go thru curves like THAT! 

Norton, you got me thinking about the problem with your fine work and for that I humbly say thanks.

 

Ive been working with my F's on and off for a while.  There is a difference between the Lionel trucks or perhaps truck blocks from the early 2000's and the late 2000's when Lionel started messing with the drive.  Pete has the early version.  I have a couple of the early versions and was about to sell them because of the trouble involved in modifying them the way I wanted.  I still have some of the late versions which have many modifications.  I have become tired of working on them, but then Norton came along, I became inspired.

 

Not having any way to accomplish Norton's very fine method, I took apart one of my early units to see if one of the new Kadees could simplify the conversion.  I had originally intended to body mount the Kadees but Norton gave me something else to look at.

 

The solution I came up with was to cut the back part of the gearbox to fit in the little platform with the hole.  I then drilled and tapped two holes and mounted Kadee 742's which turn out to be the needed height to match the Kadee coupler gauge.  The 742 is a medium overset shank metal coupler with a plastic gearbox.  The overset shank is not as nice looking as the standard shank, but this method is fast, easy, and matches my skill set. 

 

Here is a bad picture taken with my cell phone.

 

 

 

Nice job Pete and thanks for this post. I would like to do something about our F3 set and you guys are an inspiration!

Thanks guys. I appreciate the comments. Marker it appears the trucks you mounted the coupler on has the semi circle that extends from the coupler pocket. The B unit that I used to design the adapter also had the extra material. That's why the adapter has that area cut away on either side of the coupler mounting holes. After making a dozen adapters I took the second B unit apart and found the coupler pocket squared off as shown in the picture above. Your method would be a little harder to implement on the trucks with the squared off pockets as there might not be material to drill into for the screw closer to the coupler head.

Have you done a second engine yet? You might have the same problem I had with the buffer preventing coupling but its easily fixed.

 

Pete

Marker it appears the trucks you mounted the coupler on has the semi circle that extends from the coupler pocket.

Correct.  It is #16 from the first set of F3's Lionel produced.  I don't have #18 anymore so I don't know what those trucks look like.  I have #19 in a locker back in Saint Louis (go Cards!), and all the rest are from the later versions after Lionel changed the drive.

 

I only had one set of 742's (4 to a pack) so I did an A-B-A.  I had no problems with the buffers, which easily pull out, although they are still installed.  The buffer on the A unit is more of a problem than the one on the B unit.  I carefully pulled out the one from the A unit but after installation, I reinstalled it.  The Atlas engine behind the Lionel A-B-A does not have a buffer, so removing the Lionel buffers shouldn't be that big of a deal.  I think Lionel is the only one that has the buffers.  The diaphragms touch and it runs well on an O-99 curve, but I'll see if I can place it on something tighter to see what the limits might be.

 

Pete, I'd rather do it your way but don't have the Bridgeport or the skills necessary.  I can't wait to see how you handle the pilot, or do you intend to change that?

 

Here is a quick picture.  You have to click on it.

 

 

 

 

Looks great! Marker, any way that works. I realize most folks don't have these big machines. I was holding off taking the A units apart until I get the 742s. If I don't find them at York I'll have to mail order them.

 

Pete

Norton, I made a mistake in my post.  I thought I replaced the buffer under the diaphragm on the A unit.  I didn't.  If I want to use it I would have to trim it back a bit.  For now I will leave it off.  I didn't convert the other B unit, but I think the buffer on the B units might be fine.  I have to order more 742's and then I will finish the last B for that set.

 

I will post when I get the other B unit finished.

I thought you might have a problem as you located the box in the same location in the truck pocket as I did. My solution was to trim a piece of .032" aluminum plate about .040" wide. I think .030-.045" would work. Its glued on with Walthers Goo but CA would work too. This should push the coupler out far enough to allow coupling when all are modified this way. It also takes up about 2/3rds of the spring travel so the diaphrams don't spread apart very far under load and destroy the effect. Locating the shim at this location also maintains the centering mechanism.

 

 

 

Pete

Clever solution.  I'll have to try it.

Would you guys just stop it???????? You're making me want to try this with a set of postwar F-3's and i don't have your skills.

 

Super jobs guys and how about more pics and the idea of a kit we can all use appeals to me too.

 

This is why I like this forum, so many good ideas, and so many good people on here.

 

This would be a perfect article for the magazine for all to read..

 

Thanks, again!!

 

Rod