Golden Gate Depot 1938 20th Century Limited

@Norman R posted:

How many people are willing to pay more for what would be expected to be higher authenticity passenger cars?

When you compare prices, GGD cars are roughly $33 more per car than Lionel's new offerings. That's not a heck of a lot...

@Magicland posted:

When you compare prices, GGD cars are roughly $33 more per car than Lionel's new offerings. That's not a heck of a lot...

You will spend at least that amount to add figures to Lionel cars not to mention the work required to paint the interiors.

Pete

Golden Gate Depot aluminum cars are roughly $325-$350 per car actual street price. I know because I have them and I'm getting them. Lionel catalogue list price for the eight car set is approximately $2,000 and the street price will be about 10% less than that. I would buy the GGD cars every time. They are aluminum, prototypically correct, have gorgeous interior detail (painted) with people, and come with the best service in the hobby IMO.

I'd consider it, even though I'm already in for the full GGD 1948 version of the same train that's about to arrive in the states.  For true scale cars, GGD passenger cars are the best and everything else is a distant second.

If we're talking GGD re-issues though, I'd rather see Round 2 of the SAL Silver Meteor first.  My list of cool 3rd Rail / GGD stuff I missed the first time around has quite a few entries on it!

Have the original GGD dozen and no need for more.

I am surprised GGD has not reissued the 1938/1940 20th Century Limited yet.  It was one of the first sets they made and it had a weight problem.  The cars are very heavy!  The locomotive cannot pull them all.  An updated, lighter, version would be great to see produced.

@Jtrain posted:

I am surprised GGD has not reissued the 1938/1940 20th Century Limited yet.  It was one of the first sets they made and it had a weight problem.  The cars are very heavy!  The locomotive cannot pull them all.  An updated, lighter, version would be great to see produced.

Better trucks would help. They are not particularly free rolling. This is one place where Lionel’s are much better.

Pete

@Norton posted:

Better trucks would help. They are not particularly free rolling. This is one place where Lionel’s are much better.

Pete

Pete,

Does the Lionel set in the new catalog look accurate to the prototype, based on the drawings?

@Norton posted:

Better trucks would help. They are not particularly free rolling. This is one place where Lionel’s are much better.

Pete

The new GGD trucks are great.  I have a single 15 year old powered Atlas FM Erie Built pulling its unpowered dummy B unit companion and 11 cars from the recent GGD Olympian Hiawatha rerun perfectly with no complaints.

@Jtrain posted:

Pete,

Does the Lionel set in the new catalog look accurate to the prototype, based on the drawings?

I would have to compare them with the GGD set I have. I don’t think I have individual photos of the prototype cars. Others may though. Calling Mario @CentralFan1976

Pete

I would be interested in a reissue of the 1938 set by GGD.  I'm looking forward to the 1948 12-car set that is about to arrive.  They will look great behind the recent 3rd Rail E7's.

@Jerryrails posted:

Golden Gate Depot aluminum cars are roughly $325-$350 per car actual street price. I know because I have them and I'm getting them. Lionel catalogue list price for the eight car set is approximately $2,000 and the street price will be about 10% less than that. I would buy the GGD cars every time. They are aluminum, prototypically correct, have gorgeous interior detail (painted) with people, and come with the best service in the hobby IMO.

I agree 3rd rail is better but I just did a quick search and the 8 Lionel cars will be around 1550 preorder. The southern crescent 8 car set is 2639 on GGD site right now. The difference will be ~$135 per car. That is significant.

@SuperChief posted:

I agree 3rd rail is better but I just did a quick search and the 8 Lionel cars will be around 1550 preorder. The southern crescent 8 car set is 2639 on GGD site right now. The difference will be ~$135 per car. That is significant.

Where are you seeing the Lionel set for 25% off list price?

@Jtrain posted:

I am surprised GGD has not reissued the 1938/1940 20th Century Limited yet.  It was one of the first sets they made and it had a weight problem.  The cars are very heavy!  The locomotive cannot pull them all.  An updated, lighter, version would be great to see produced.

What are you talking anout? GGD has a second run being delivered soon. Reservations closed in Oct 22 and this run has the smooth ball bearing trucks!

@SuperChief posted:

I agree 3rd rail is better but I just did a quick search and the 8 Lionel cars will be around 1550 preorder. The southern crescent 8 car set is 2639 on GGD site right now. The difference will be ~$135 per car. That is significant.

I have both GGD and Lionel 21" for the "extra $135/car that you claim, you are getting the following from GGD:

Aluminum body

Ball bearing equipped trucks for a smooth ride and less resistance

Accurate car window/door/vestibule configuations

Accurate interiors

Ten figures/car

Details such as correct diaphrams and simulated window frames.

You get what you pay for!

@Norton posted:

Better trucks would help. They are not particularly free rolling. This is one place where Lionel’s are much better.

Pete

Not since GGD installed ball bearing trucks.

I would absolutely buy a new set of GGD 1938 20th century limited cars to go with the Legacy Dreyfuss I will be buying, just as I purchased Daylight cars to go with my vision GS-3.  I find the Lionel 21” passenger cars disappointing for a variety of reasons.   Come on Scott, make my day!

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

What are you talking anout? GGD has a second run being delivered soon. Reservations closed in Oct 22 and this run has the smooth ball bearing trucks!

That is the 1948 set.

@Magicland posted:

Where are you seeing the Lionel set for 25% off list price?

https://nassauhobby.com/produc...-ss-diner-pre-order/

https://nassauhobby.com/produc...21-2-pack-pre-order/

https://nassauhobby.com/produc...21-4-pack-pre-order/

Updated

Legacy Station is even cheaper on cars by $100 for set.

https://www.legacystation.com/...l2023v1pricelist.pdf

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

I have both GGD and Lionel 21" for the "extra $135/car that you claim, you are getting the following from GGD:

Aluminum body

Ball bearing equipped trucks for a smooth ride and less resistance

Accurate car window/door/vestibule configuations

Accurate interiors

Ten figures/car

Details such as correct diaphrams and simulated window frames.

You get what you pay for!

I agree with you. I have the 1938 Super Chief from 3rd rail and love it. I was just pointing out that the difference isn't $33 a car, it's a lot more. Basically $1000.

edit - $1000 total for 8 car set.

I would LOVE a reissue of the 1938 set - and. Dreyfuss to go with it.  However, they'd need to give me a couple years to replenish my finances after both the 1948 car set plus the Lionel ones I'll be preordering.  [I need a "broke" emoji. 🤣] 

@Magicland posted:

It's certainly NOT $1000 per car. And how many other dealers are willing to take the same bath that Nassau Hobbies is (If their pricing isn't an error)? Forum sponsor Mr. Muffin has the 8 car set for $1763. And how prototypical are those 8 cars compared to what you'd get from GGD?

Sorry I meant $1000 total. I found 3 other dealers who were in the same price range as Nassau in 10 minutes yesterday, all of them forum sponsors.

like I said I agree about GGD in accuracy and detail! I’m just stating what is true. There is a big price difference between Lionel and GGD. It’s 135 a car or $1000 for an 8 car set.

@Jtrain posted:

Pete,

Does the Lionel set in the new catalog look accurate to the prototype, based on the drawings?

I remembered a there are few pics of 1938 20th Century cars in Staufer’s Thorougbreds [sic].

The cars include an RPO, a couple of Pullmans and an Observation. Lionel’s are pretty close if not spot on. The catalog does say all new tooling.

FWIW, I am not a fan of Lionel’s 21 inchers but a number of them at least have correct exteriors including their UP and Empire State Express cars, maybe more but those I haven’t paid any attention to.

Pete

@Norton posted:

I remembered a there are few pics of 1938 20th Century cars in Staufer’s Thorougbreds [sic].

The cars include an RPO, a couple of Pullmans and an Observation. Lionel’s are pretty close if not spot on. The catalog does say all new tooling.

FWIW, I am not a fan of Lionel’s 21 inchers but a number of them at least have correct exteriors including their UP and Empire State Express cars, maybe more but those I haven’t paid any attention to.

Pete

Yes.  I noticed that Lionel seems to have gotten the twin diners right in the drawings, including the trucks.  That is encouraging.  With new tooling, there is no excuse to not get the exteriors correct.

I'd go with the GGD since the 20th Century is my favorite train and it would be worth the extra to get aluminum cars and better interiors and passengers.  So , hopefully Scott will respond to this thread!

This week I asked Scott how far off in the future another offering of the 1938 20th Century Limited passenger car set might be. He said two or more years. Depending how you count it, so far there are about 6 people in this thread including myself who are interested in buying a 1938 20th Century Limited set from Golden Gate Depot. With the jolt of interest from the Legacy Dreyfuss Hudsons becoming available, I am hoping more people will pile on to this thread, express their sincere interest, and make it a viable project for Scott sooner rather than later.

If anyone has the GGD passenger cars please post photos of them especially closeups of the lighted interiors Thanks

@Alec_6460 posted:

I find the Lionel 21” passenger cars disappointing for a variety of reasons ...

Why?  (Enquiring minds would like to know.)

Mike

@Erik C Lindgren posted:

Wasatch Model’s new California Zephyr cars (formally Key) are 2250.00 per car plus now, some 30k for set of 11,

😳

I had no idea fine scale 2 rail cars went for that kind of money. That is an insane amount of money and makes my Lionel/GGD 12 car Daylight set sound dirt cheap

@Norman R posted:

This week I asked Scott how far off in the future another offering of the 1938 20th Century Limited passenger car set might be. He said two or more years. Depending how you count it, so far there are about 6 people in this thread including myself who are interested in buying a 1938 20th Century Limited set from Golden Gate Depot. With the jolt of interest from the Legacy Dreyfuss Hudsons becoming available, I am hoping more people will pile on to this thread, express their sincere interest, and make it a viable project for Scott sooner rather than later.

Two or more years is a good estimate with other passenger train projects in the que right now.  I had a sample car loaned to me by a forum member when I was doing the early scheme on the NYC E7s and I will say that those cars are really heavy!  A second run with a lighter extrusion, ball bearing trucks, LED lighting, and painted interiors would go a long way towards improving the original set.

I have some Lionel 21" NYC cars, the vision line ones that I picked up about a year ago on blow out.  These cars run on 0-54.  I think the GGD's are 0-72 and sadly that's a show stopper for me.

John

@FJI posted:

If anyone has the GGD passenger cars please post photos of them especially closeups of the lighted interiors Thanks

I have a few from the last run. Hopeful to see the new run in the next 2-3 weeks and can post photos when they come in.

The best way to improve the free rolling of passenger cars is to eliminate the wipers. The journals are not THE problem.

Oops!

My immediate prior post should have been posted on the 2 rail forum.

I apologize for the error.

@Ryan Selvius posted:

😳

I had no idea fine scale 2 rail cars went for that kind of money. That is an insane amount of money and makes my Lionel/GGD 12 car Daylight set sound dirt cheap

Very limited run, long time in the production stage, super high end detailing by Wasatch Models for the serious collectors JMO.

+1 for GGD 1938 20th Century Passenger Set.

I have the NYC ESE set I picked up used that I converted to LED lighting.  Great cars.

@Norton posted:

Better trucks would help. They are not particularly free rolling. This is one place where Lionel’s are much better.

Some of the later cars from GGD have ball bearing wheels, that should help.

The 1938 set includes a 17 or 18 roomette but I'd like to get that car in the 48 paint scheme. I know the most recent 1948 set from GG reservation states the set contains a 17 roomette but I'm told it will be delivered as a 22 roomette instead.

The 17 or 18 roomettes went into pool service eventually and received the later paint scheme. Would anyone be interested in campaigning for this as a potential extra car for sale in the later paint scheme IF the 1938 cars are remade?

I'd be interested in a set! I have the GGD '48 set and that is gorgeous.

Raif