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First - I should note that Steve at Ross and Dennis Z have been incredibly responsive and helpful with my upstream inquiries.  That said, there remains an issue with the scheme, as illustrated below, that has baffled me for several months (and by extension, has kept the trains off the tracks nearly all of 2024)  I'm seeking the collective brilliance and ingenuity of this board for any insights and recommendations   (and I do, humbly, as there could be an obvious issue that I've missed along the way)

  • Attached is an overall track plan, a diagram from Dennis Z, and a photograph of the particular spot in question.   Elsewhere on the layout, I have a single crossover that work properly for the nonderailing operation.


  • The good news:  When operating the switches in question, they do switch in tandem!  But...bad news: the are switching 180 degrees out of phase / the wrong way (ensuring derailment) when triggered by the approaching locomotive.


  • Dennis Z's diagram is close to the current conditions, with the caveat the segment of parallel track in the middle is much shorter, and the upper two switches butt directly.


  • The one difference, aside from slightly shorter segments, is that I have 'ganged' all of the related wires in a pair with a wire nut (e.g. all of the green wire drops for the top and middle switch pair are connected into a single wire nut)  This is the lease elegant approach but the result of several rewirings I moved away from the terminal blocks. 


  • Given that the switches are flipping to the opposite - is there something I'm missing in terms of connecting the yellow and green wires on the respective switches to flip the signal etc?  I've rewired this segment several times this year and am at a real head scratcher moment. 


Thank you all for any insights and/or recommendations,

Scott

@gunrunnerjohn @Joe Fauty @CAPPilot

12-31-22-Wiring Diagrams-jpeg_Page_1Double Crossover w-DZ-1000IMG_8227

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From what I see it looks like your  problem stems from where the Switch machines are shown on the diagram and where the Switch machines are actually mounted on your track. The wires, green and yellow move the switch machine right and left respectfully, but that does not always correspond to through or out. For example, using my numbering scheme, Switch number one on the diagram when it is right, it is through but on your track when it is right, it is out.

It was not clear from the picture if you use one push button to switch all four turnouts or two controllers, but I would recommend two controllers. Otherwise you can only run one train through the crossover at any time.

Without going into too much more of the engineering behind this here is the answer:

Switch one and two are going to work as a pair, when one is out two is through and vice versa. Because of the Switch motor orientation, you can wire the greens together and the yellows together. Wire the non-derails as follows:

A yellow
B green
C yellow

Switch three and four are going to work as a pair when three is out four is through and vice versa because of the Switch motor orientation you will cross wire Switch four. Wire the yellow of three to the green of four and the green of three to the yellow of four. Using the color scheme of Switch three wire the non-derails as follows:

D yellow
E green
F yellow

If you need clarification or more information, just let me know. Good luck.

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Thank you @Edward G! I had  a sense that the issue might be resolved with a common sense analysis like yours. The need to update or cross the yellow / green wires on the basis of the motors location makes complete sense.

To your question above, the switches 1&2 and 3&4 are paired, respectively, with each pair sharing a common remote/control button.

One quick followup question:  when you suggest linking the yellow of switch 3 to the green of switch 4 -  does that include the  yellow wires from the number 3 switch machine AND  the yellow wire that connects to the isolated track  to be connected to the corresponding green wires of switch 4?  Or is the recommendation to link the yellow wire  from the switch 3 machine to the  green wire on the isolated leg of switch four, and vice versa?

Again, this may be obvious but at this stage I’d not leaving anything to chance,  

many many thanks again

scott



One quick followup question:  when you suggest linking the yellow of switch 3 to the green of switch 4 -  does that include the  yellow wires from the number 3 switch machine AND  the yellow wire that connects to the isolated track  to be connected to the corresponding green wires of switch 4?  Or is the recommendation to link the yellow wire  from the switch 3 machine to the  green wire on the isolated leg of switch four, and vice versa?



let’s not leave anything to chance, but not sure I completely understand your question, but let me try to clarify…

The yellow wire from switch three will connect to the green wire of Switch four and the wire to isolated track section D, and to the wire for isolated section F, and the yellow wire for the push button.

the green wire from switch three will connect to the yellow wire of switch four and the wire to isolated track section E, and green wire for the push button.

let me clarify one more thing - in area B and area E you really have two isolated segments you can use, but you only need to use one. It does not matter which one you use, or if you want, you can use both, just connect them together.

if the light on the push button is not the way you want it you can reverse the wires to change green and red.

if this is not completely answer your questions feel free to ask more happy to help

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