How to pack an engine for shipping?

You say that your shipping box fit over the Atlas factory box “like a glove”?  Your outer shipping box should big enough to have 4” - 6” of absorbing material to cushion the original factory carton.

I’d say your packaging was insufficient and the cause of the damage, not UPS. 

I prefer FedEx, USPS and UPS in that order.  It seems that UPS hires more part-time shotputers for the Christmas season, and each one is trying to break last years record.

Most of the time, I use the factory shipper if available.  I got an Atlas engine for upgrade a while back, when I opened it up, it was literally destroyed!  The shell was in pieces, and the packaging seems to hold it pretty tight.  I don't know what it is about Atlas packaging, but it apparently doesn't absorb shocks well.

What I do with any locomotive is to add some padding so that the locomotive can not move at all in the packaging, if I shake the package and I feel anything moving, I'm not done packing.

Bob Kazian posted:

You say that your shipping box fit over the Atlas factory box “like a glove”?  Your outer shipping box should big enough to have 4” - 6” of absorbing material to cushion the original factory carton.

If what you've said is true, then why do so many Lionel dealers often just ship Lionel items in the outer carton Lionel puts them in?

I’d say your packaging was insufficient and the cause of the damage, not UPS.

When I have shipped locomotives (4) back to Lionel for repair, I followed the same steps that you did but added one additional step.  I bought a box from UPS ($5) that was larger than the original factory shipper and then put the factory shipper in the larger UPS box along with a bunch of bubble packing to protect the factory shipper.  Then, double taped all the seams of the UPS box.  In turn, when the repair was done, Lionel sent it back to me packed the same way - never had any damage from UPS or FedEx.  This method has always protected my shipments from the 500 pound gorillas.

Shipments of expensive O Scale trains MUST be packed in such a way that there is an insulating cushion of space to protect from punctures, dents, etc that happen in cargo shipment.  People think that their package gets gingerly handled by caring employees.   In reality your locomotive box is tossed, stacked, thrown, and moved with haste every step of the way by time pressed handlers overwhelmed by bags and piles of boxes that need loaded post haste!  Sometimes dropping off of conveyors and drop chutes in hub processing locations.  Trust me, I have been in the industry, and seen cargo, mail, in motion.  Its more bruttle that you have any idea.  

I recently bought a Lionel F40PH from Trainz.  They shipped it only in the very cheap quality Lionel sleeve shipper.  My brand new $580 locomotive arrived in a box corner smashed by Fedex.  While the locomotive is ok this time, the box is permanently damaged.  Trainz offered some price adjustment, I declined, instead asked that they change the way they skimped on packing like they did with my F40PH. Trainz has in recent times prior to this F40PH packed items exceptionally well and I commended them and bragged to friends about their quality care in packing.  Then, my F40PH arrived very unacceptably shipped and corner smashed from a  hurried throw into some truck or aircraft pit.  Trainz saved themselves a some time, but they may lose my business if they continue lousy packing ( NO packing actually).  

Skimpy packaging is not tolerable for items priced from $500 and into the thousands!

Bob Kazian posted:

You say that your shipping box fit over the Atlas factory box “like a glove”?  Your outer shipping box should big enough to have 4” - 6” of absorbing material to cushion the original factory carton.

I’d say your packaging was insufficient and the cause of the damage, not UPS. 

Absolutely true!  There must be a layer of cushion to absorb the bruttle reality of mass package movements.  These things get tossed like frisbees, stacked however they fall, and sometimes bagged in groups which are thrown like bags of laundry because the beltloader or conveyor keeps sending more, there is NO time to be gentle.

Double box all heavy shipments like engines, sets etc.

Dave

I have success by following these steps:

1. Pack in original box with all original packing material, including ALL foam inserts.

2. Place in original carton and tape securely with heavy duty packing tape, CLEAR and NOT strapped.

3. Take it to the UPS Store for double-boxing with additional INSULATION added.

4. Insure for the full value of the transaction and since they did the final packing, they will pay for the damages.

5. I always explain that the original box and shipping carton IS the factory packing.

Results: NO damage to date with any of my sold items. Yes, it costs a bit more to do it right, but it is well worth it!

Thanks for all the replys and packing tips. I got the engine sent to me with no damage with it in the atlas box and with the outer box that fit like a glove. It seemed as good as a lionel outer carton. I thought since I got it that way with no damage I would just sent it to my buyer that way. Guess you are all right in a larger outer box and lots of bubble wrap. Leson learned. At least my engine got back to me in better shape than yours john. Glad that what happened to your client did not happen to me. This is a beautiful engine I hated to sell it but now that I have it back in one piece it will get the full ERR treatment by me so as to avoid anymore traveling and any further damage. I gladly refunded the buyers money. I would not want an engine in that condition either. Guess it was ment for me to keep it after all. 

That is a crazy story. I would never expect that. I will say that the best packing is several layers of protection. First layer is packing paper used for China dishes, then bubble wrap secured with packing tape, then a cardboard shell, then packing peanuts or air packs to secure the item in the shipping carton. It's almost like the " Anil retentive chef" from the old Saturday Night Live shows.

George

I have taken delivery of 5ea. ES44AC engines, and each one shifted in the box, which cracked the foam,allowing the engine to shift and break off the air hoses was lionel does not have as replacements. They were all shipped in Lionel shipping box from east coast dealers.

TheSD70ACe engines have been coming out of the carton with the snow plows broken. The dealer I bought mine at opened several, and all were damaged. 

These appear to be a packing problem to have so many damaged the same.

Double boxing is the key - and the only way to get these things to travel safely.  A sub-enclosure goes a long way to protecting an item - force and shock to the outer container get spread out to the box - not the item.

When sizing up a ship job - take a look at the factory packing - Make sure the train is snug, especially the trucks - broken trucks are the most common problem I see. Sometimes I use cardboard - or packing peanuts to snug stuff up.

Most modern boxes are pretty good. Older trains are more likely to have loose spots. For antique/PW trains with original box - I always pack the train and the box in separate enclosures. Never the train in the box.

Recently I've started packing certain items using a stretch wrap material. Its about a 6 inch strip on a spool stick. I've been wrapping it around the train on each end to keep the trucks from flopping around. Not for everything for sure - I wouldn't be wrapping trains with fragile details in this stuff.

I always try to bag my item when possible - and wrap in cardboard (even if its already in a box). The wrap adds an extra layer of puncture protection, keeps the train in its packing and protects the display window.

Problem becomes finding the right sized boxes - I've become good at making my own boxes or modifying existing boxes to fit. 

Tip - when making/modifying boxes, for hinges and bends - I use a mat knife - just retract your blade, flip it over, and use the blunt tip to crease your cardboard where you want it to bend. Works both with and against the ribbed "grain" in cardboard.

Just use newspaper as padding between your inner and outer enclosures - 2 inches should be good between your inner and outer containers.

Last thing - GLUE! Glue goes a long way to making your outer container much more rigid and strong.

If the item can move around in the factory packaging, no amount of outer padding is going to save it.  A primary key to protecting the item being shipped is not rattling around inside the box.

jim911 posted:

I have taken delivery of 5ea. ES44AC engines, and each one shifted in the box, which cracked the foam,allowing the engine to shift and break off the air hoses was lionel does not have as replacements. They were all shipped in Lionel shipping box from east coast dealers.

TheSD70ACe engines have been coming out of the carton with the snow plows broken. The dealer I bought mine at opened several, and all were damaged. 

These appear to be a packing problem to have so many damaged the same.

 

 

Opened new UP SD-70ACe for Christmas with broken snow plow.   I have also received a couple ES44ACs with the broken air hose and the fix is a new front pilot.  When I ship, I put some extra styrofoam pieces within the Lionel styrofoam box to prevent the locomotives from sliding back and forth.   

Another technique is what I dubbed the "muffle wrap". Buy a roll of thick mattress foam (cut to fit) and literal ROLL the engine in it. Then pack it in a triple-wall corrugated box with additional cut-to-fit foam on ALL sides. Essentially, as the expression goes, "bulletproof"! I once shipped a $3000+ live steam model - engine and tender in separate boxes - without ANY damage! NOTE: I did NOT have the original shipping carton for this particular engine or its 2 channel RC control which was shipped in a foam lined premium pistol case inside its own heavy walled corrugated carton!

AmeenTrainGuy posted:

Do not use DHL. Use FedEx or USPS, UPS is also good. Usually it is not the carriers fault, but rather it just depends on who was handling your package.

Since it is the carrier's employees that are handling the package, once you present it to them for shipment, then why wouldn't the carrier be at fault for ANY loss or shipping damage?

This is all very good information.

It still seems the more care you take and the more times you write FRAGILE on the box.....the  more the handlers will play football with your box.

Larry, it's still fun

Every time I open a delivered Train box IT'S Always a.....

I've had a few expensive engines delivered. As others have said, you have to double box the original boxes. Clearly marked FRAGILE in large red marker. These boxes will be tossed around like nobody could care less. Insurance is a good idea too. Good luck.