Is it important to you to have the Lionel logo on your tinplate?

I like the Lionel Name and Logo on the engines.. I have change the plates on my engines from MTH to Lionel.Not trying to pass them off as Lionel . Just something I do. I have Tinplate cars with MTH on them and that's OK.  I buy what I like. 

I prefer the Lionel Corp. I never bought a MTH tinplate until they got the license. MTH's Tinplate Traditions are very nice but there is something about that Lionel logo that finishes off a tinplate product for me.  

Regardless of the agreement, I don't like the fact that MTH is using the Lionel name on tinplate reproductions.  Bottom line, they are reproductions and should be marked as such. I think the trains are well-done, but I have little to no interest in owning them; when it comes to tinplate, I want original prewar Lionel. 

John

Who ever made it, that's who's name should be on it.

I love them,logo's in all,,i run the train,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,not the name !!!

BlueComet400 posted:

Regardless of the agreement, I don't like the fact that MTH is using the Lionel name on tinplate reproductions.  Bottom line, they are reproductions and should be marked as such. I think the trains are well-done, but I have little to no interest in owning them; when it comes to tinplate, I want original prewar Lionel. 

John

MTH has never hid the fact they are reproductions weather it has the MTH stamp on the bottom or Lionel Corp. Most of the reproductions like “Lionel classics “ were made by MTH anyway.  In answer to the original question is no; I like the Lionel badging but it’s not a deal breaker for me either way.  MTH has taken tinplate way over the top in sound,smoke and finish and have allowed many in our hobby to obtain beautiful high quality tinplate of today. 

Chris Lonero posted:

I like the Lionel badging but it’s not a deal breaker for me either way.

That sums it up for me.

I put Lionel badges on my 400e, I like the Lionel name to be on them.

MTH has never hid the fact they are reproductions weather it has the MTH stamp on the bottom or Lionel Corp. Most of the reproductions like “Lionel classics “ were made by MTH anyway. 

If the items aren't clearly marked as reproductions then they are hiding the fact that they are reproductions. Doesn't matter who is doing the manufacturing and marketing.

Reproductions are a problem across the world of collecting, it ain't just trains.

I RUN my tinplate trains.  I'm pleased that new ones are being produced so that I can run a good-looking train without cleaning up a bunch of rust or worrying about 90 year old wiring.  Nobody is going to mistake new production for the originals, and Lionel is well within its rights to have MTH manufacture trains from the old designs.  

I prefer Lionel markings, but I'm happy to buy the trains marked "MTH", as the lack of a Lionel badge has made them less expensive.

I actually would prefer the MTH Logo on my modern tinplate.  While I still buy some lionel, most of my new acquistion power is either prewar or modern mth, that goes for everything not just tinplate.  I know companies need to adapt to survive but I still find it incredulous that the LCT agreement even exists given the lawsuit history between MTH and Lionel. ( Yes I know lionel has re-incorporated since then)

Frankly as some one who only recently succumbed to the shiny side, It was rather confusing as to why only repro's are made in the first place.  I would rather see tinplate style trains in new configurations such as 6 wheel driver sets, Camel back loco's etc. Heck for that matter just deliver the 263E I have on order from the 2016 tinplate catalog before you issue 2019 vol 1!

Just my $0.02.  

I would not have purchased the one and only tinplate O-gauge "Blue Comet" set if it did not.  It represents the the nostalgia of childhood back in the late-40's early-50's for me.

Ron

Lionel is well within its rights to have MTH manufacture trains from the old designs.  

I guess so. Nobody has filed any lawsuits yet.
They could mark the trains to make it easy for a novice to tell them apart, as they did for the PWC series, but they don't have a legal obligation to do so.
 

Does anyone know how long the license agreement is for?  I really hope when it's up they renew it.  MTH does a pretty nice job at the tinplate.

MartyE posted:

Does anyone know how long the license agreement is for?

Al at Sidetrack told me 2020.

jhz563 posted:

  I know companies need to adapt to survive but I still find it incredulous that the LCT agreement even exists given the lawsuit history between MTH and Lionel. ( Yes I know lionel has re-incorporated since then)

It's very simple.  Lionel would not get their return on investment to start production of tinplate for such a small market.  As I recall, they tried to re-introduce their own tinplate about a decade or so ago, then decided it was better to license to MTH.

Rusty

I love tinplate--always have and always will! Sold nearly all of my "larger" O gauge tinplate locomotives--all of which were contemporary items from MTH--prior to my move last year, but I still have most of the "smaller" O gauge engines and rolling stock from both MTH and Lionel. I'm one of those strange birds who likes his tin in pristine condition and not cosmetically "well-played-with." I could not care less whose logo is on these items. The stuff MTH has been offering with either their own logo or the LCT logo is absolutely gorgeous, and I only hope they will continue to make these wonderful trains for years to come. If MTH does not continue tinplate production, you can be pretty sure it will not be done at all. The market for contemporary tinplate is likely not large enough to entice Lionel or anyone else to dive in.

Yes, no desire for another company's name on an iconic Lionel product.  Repros are fine, but the reproduction seems truer to form with the original markings.  Have the O gauge tinplate Lionel prewar repros they made 10+ years ago.

I want my tinplate to say "Lionel".  I know they are reproductions, but why would I want a repro labeled with a company that didn't exist when the original was made?

I would not buy a 53 Corvette repro with a Saturn logo on it...

Mallard4468 posted:

I RUN my tinplate trains.  I'm pleased that new ones are being produced so that I can run a good-looking train without cleaning up a bunch of rust or worrying about 90 year old wiring.

This is exactly how I feel, I like my stuff to look pristine. I'm fine restoring trains, but, I like running them too... so If I'm going to drop a lot of money on a set I'd prefer it to be in good shape. I've got about a 50/50 mix of reproductions and originals and run all of them with no bias towards 1 or the other, they are toys and I treat them as such.

In many cases there is little difference between the originals and the repros, I think sticking only to originals is more of a prestige thing than anything else. 

As long as it looks good and is made well, I'm happy

I'm also in the camp that thinks that repro stuff should look just like the original, including the name plates.  MTH getting the license to use the Lionel name has inspired me to get a little tinplate, and I plan on getting more down the road.

Andy

Repro items should be like the original, down to the logo, as long as there is identification on the body of the fact. Look at Lionel PWC items, which are marked as such because they are not the Lionel Corporation-manufactured originals. The license earns money for today's Lionel, and further advances the name. Perhaps when the license expires, Mike will make a move on the company as a whole. 

I seem to recall that when Josh Cowen acquired Ives at the beginning of the 30's, Ives Trains continued to carry that label for a year or two, although they were owned by Lionel. (I know that's not a perfect simile, but....)

In any event, the original items were made by Lionel Corporation, which divested its train manufacturing circa 1969 and no longer exists, so who cares what logo is on the repros, as long as they look good and run well.

When i purchased MTH's O gauge Blue Comet, very early Mike's production, I added the Lionel logo to the tender. 

I going to vote off the board. I like to purchase the old original items and just restore / run them. 

I couldn't give a rat's hind end what name is on my contemporary tinplate. I am also no Lionel purity league member for the originals as I will put Ives/AF/Lionel together where ever tab fits into slot.

I always liked the MTH accessories, i.e., lamp posts, signals, structures, etc.  The repro trains themselves never appealed to me initially because they had all been "done before."  But when MTH started making tinplate in color combinations as well as rolling stock with prototypical road names, I started to take notice.  It was all new... and "original."  As I've often said, Lionel never made a 2817 Pennsylvania caboose, let alone one with interior lights, but MTH did!  While I can't say I'm impressed with everything Mike and his team have done over the years, they've introduced affordable tinplate to a new generation of enthusiasts and I for one hope they continue their efforts.

Not really, but I do like the Lionel badging on my Lionel Classics standard gauge engines and cars. I also enjoy my MTH Tinplate Traditions locos and cars and would not swap out the MTH plates. I am primarily an operator and not a collector.

Pre-War Steve posted:

I always liked the MTH accessories, i.e., lamp posts, signals, structures, etc.  The repro trains themselves never appealed to me initially because they had all been "done before."  But when MTH started making tinplate in color combinations as well as rolling stock with prototypical road names, I started to take notice.  It was all new... and "original."  As I've often said, Lionel never made a 2817 Pennsylvania caboose, let alone one with interior lights, but MTH did!  While I can't say I'm impressed with everything Mike and his team have done over the years, they've introduced affordable tinplate to a new generation of enthusiasts and I for one hope they continue their efforts.

I'm a big fan of the new road names. I really don't care about traditional tinplate rolling stock. Give me the new paint schemes. I love the Hooker Chemical Tank car, the Pennsylvania, New York Central and B&O boxcars. I'll buy these until my wife leaves me over having too many of them. I like the Lionel Orange Heritage series and the purple Tinplate Traditions set. I don't have to have the Lionel name on anything. I have a Proto 2 Blue Comet with the MTH nameplate. I'm not going to replace them with a Lionel nameplate.
     One thing I did notice in the pictures posted on this thread. The tinplate L logo looks great on the engines. Perhaps MTH need to use their color logo on their Tinplate Traditions engines. In the past their nameplate has been a black M.T.H. on a silver plate. The MTH Blue Comet logo in color would look better. In tinplate, color counts.

Scott Smith

Is it important to me?  No!

Bob Nelson

Yes, the Lionel name on my tinplate is important to me.

I am new to Standard gauge, it started last summer after I saw the awesome SGMA layout at the TCA Pittsburgh Convention. Seeing these shiny beasts running around on a BIG layout...it totally blew me away! Plus, what put it over the top was I found out that the new locos had all the modern features that I like: they come with Protosounds 2 or Protosounds  3 giving me remote control, cruise control, smoke, sounds, LED lighting, station stops etc.

I knew I had to be a part of Standard gauge. I could not stop thinking about it every day after I got home, after a few weeks I finally took the plunge.

I had a fever, and the only cure was a Blue Comet set!

So far I have only bought modern Standard gauge "Lionel" reproductions. (I leave the "MTH" reproductions for others)

The answer to the question is a question. Why would MTH pay a fee to put Lionel on the plates if they sold just as well with the MTH logo/name? 

I prefer the actual manufacturer be on the trains regardless of when it was made (ie: pre-war vs modern).

-Greg

Brian Liesberg posted:

... In many cases there is little difference between the originals and the repros, I think sticking only to originals is more of a prestige thing than anything else.

but you don't mention the most important difference... i constantly lament about the fact that my prewar and postwar trains have no "Certificate of Authenticity".  whatever will i do when it comes time to sell them?!?

Where are you guys getting the lionel badging from, I'd be interested in adding them to my 400e.  thanks

First, I'm a runner of tinplate rather than a collector so whether a piece of tinplate is an original or not has no impact whatsoever on any purchase. I honestly could care less about whose name or badging is on it. I buy tinplate because I like its looks, features, and how it runs.

overlandflyer posted:

Brian Liesberg posted:

... In many cases there is little difference between the originals and the repros, I think sticking only to originals is more of a prestige thing than anything else.

but you don't mention the most important difference... i constantly lament about the fact that my prewar and postwar trains have no "Certificate of Authenticity".  whatever will i do when it comes time to sell them?!?

Any trains possible resale price is never a consideration when I buy it. I live in the present concerned only about the happiness my trains currently provide me. The future is guaranteed for no one and I won't be around anyway to see what my heirs get for them when I'm gone.

ogaugeguy posted:

Any trains possible resale price is never a consideration when I buy it. I live in the present concerned only about the happiness my trains currently provide me. The future is guaranteed for no one and I won't be around anyway to see what my heirs get for them when I'm gone.

I'm with you! I buy what I like and could not care less about future value. Truth be told, there are going to be a great many folks who will be very disappointed when, at some point down the road, they hope to profit when selling their trains. There was a time when that was most certainly possible, but for the most part, and with few exceptions, those times are gone. Just the reality of changed and still-changing times. The nameplate on the side of the item won't make much difference at all.

The only implication here is the use of the "Lionel Colors" such as orange and blue.  Lionel trademarked them a while back.  

Mike884 posted:

Where are you guys getting the lionel badging from, I'd be interested in adding them to my 400e.  thanks

Mike884 revived this thread.  I wish I knew Mike.  I wouldn't mind rebranding some cars.  Not offended by it.