Lionel's New 65' Mill Gondolas

Have these begun to arrive at dealers yet?

Bill

These have been in for awhile now. Better call your dealers.

Any one receiving theirs yet please post some pics including under body detail, on the fence about getting some of these cars.

                          Thanks in advance.

How about the 2-rail conversion kits...are they anywhere close??

Mr. Muffin's Trains does not have any of the Mill Gondolas in stock. 

Andrew

I'm not finding anywhere with these in stock? 

Lehigh Valley Railroad posted:

I'm not finding anywhere with these in stock? 

Looks like Charlie Ro has a bunch in stock.  Check it out.

Just checked Ro site does not show any in stock, also lists new catalog gons for reservation same price either way. If I am not mistaken when originally posted they mentioned quantities of 1K each? What am I missing?

Just rec'd my 9 cars yesterday from Charles Ro.  Lionel did a fantastic job on these cars, and are weighted too. Spinning bearing caps on the trucks. Very nicely detailed cars. Here's a few pics

Jeff...any plans to 2-rail these cars...maybe, using Lionel's 2-rain conversion kits.

They look great!

Dave Olson posted:

These have been in for awhile now. Better call your dealers.

Thank you for the reply Dave!

hibar posted:

Just checked Ro site does not show any in stock, also lists new catalog gons for reservation same price either way. If I am not mistaken when originally posted they mentioned quantities of 1K each? What am I missing?

Are we talking about the same products here.  I did a search for "65 mill" in the website search bar, and 18 Lionel O-Gauge 65' mill gondolas showed in the search results.  Here's one example...

Is this what you're looking for?

My bad I saw the "0" next to the reviews on each car offered and assumed that was the stock status, I would like to see an under body pic of the car hopefully they stay in stock for a while so I can see one.

falconservice posted:

Mr. Muffin's Trains does not have any of the Mill Gondolas in stock. 

Andrew

Yes I do - they showed up on Tuesday..... 

Then I will have to check the Mr. Muffin's Trains website again later. 

Andrew

There are now CSX, NS, CNW, BNSF  in stock, but they are moving quickly. 

Andrew

I stopped by Charlie Ro's today in my travels for work and they had dozens of these in stock in the retail store.  Too modern for me, but they are really nice-looking cars!

Nice looking cars, Jeff. How's the ride height?

Matt, these cars ride at the correct height and look fantastic.  Very well done in my opinion. 

Lionel 65' Mill Gondolas  arrived this week
Three models per road name
17" in length / O-36 Curves
Extras still at Lionel - Please order Now!

BNSF

• Lionel 6-83317 - 65' Mill Gondola "BNSF" #518357
• Lionel 6-84582 - 65' Mill Gondola "BNSF" #518375
• Lionel 6-84583 - 65' Mill Gondola "BNSF" #518392

CNW

• Lionel 6-83318 - 65' Mill Gondola "Chicago & North Western" #342036
• Lionel 6-84584 - 65' Mill Gondola "Chicago & North Western" #342045
• Lionel 6-84585 - 65' Mill Gondola "Chicago & North Western" #342049

CSX

• Lionel 6-83319 - 65' Mill Gondola "CSX" #491600
• Lionel 6-84586 - 65' Mill Gondola "CSX" #491616
• Lionel 6-84587 - 65' Mill Gondola "CSX" #491638

Norfolk Southern

• Lionel 6-83320 - 65' Mill Gondola "Norfolk Southern" #195015
• Lionel 6-84588 - 65' Mill Gondola "Norfolk Southern" #195029
• Lionel 6-84589 - 65' Mill Gondola "Norfolk Southern" #195065

Southern Pacific

• Lionel 6-83321 - 65' Mill Gondola "Southern Pacific" #365117
• Lionel 6-84590 - 65' Mill Gondola "Southern Pacific" #365136
• Lionel 6-84591 - 65' Mill Gondola "Southern Pacific" #365142

Union Pacific

• Lionel 6-83322 - 65' Mill Gondola "Union Pacific" #96257
• Lionel 6-84592 - 65' Mill Gondola "Union Pacific" #96267
• Lionel 6-84593 - 65' Mill Gondola "Union Pacific" #96281

Having perused at length the various picture archive sites before ordering one it seems that only two liveries are genuine, the remainder appear fantasy or in Atlas speak 'alternative history' liveries. IMO disappointing for a first run, my preference  would have been correct liveries for the first run including leasing liveries before embarking on non existent prototypes. I realise I am in a minority unfortunately. I ordered the CSX variant.  Probably my last US prototype purchase in RTR. 

Limey,

I know that the CSX gondolas are not a fantasy  paint scheme. Which of the other 4 paint schemes are not fantasy?

On a related note, I just received the 3 CSX road numbers from Charles Ro, this evening. I will post some pictures after I have unpacked the cars.

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen

I believe the NS cars are accurate also, the latest Lionel catalog lists another run of these cars in new paint schemes at least one or 2 may be correct have not had a chance to check yet, looking forward to your pics and evaluation of these cars from a 2 rail point of view please show ends and underbody. I have not seen the car yet so I am holding off buying recent Lionels have had  very bland underbody detail [ I realize this is not a big issue to most buyers ] still we are talking 80.00 a car list. just saying

The Chicago & North Western is not a Fantasy scheme.

The real CNW gondolas are only slightly different than the model. 

They can not build an EXACT replica of each gondola. 

Andrew

BNSF and UNION PACIFIC have real gondola like this running on the railroads right now. Those are real schemes. 

Andrew

These gondolas are very nice. Best new releases out there, especially at this price point. 

Just a few points to bring up, Lionel used the Greenbriar  66' modern gondola as their prototype, it is a 17 rib side with a drop profile between the trucks obviously there are a limited number of RRs that bought from this mfg vs other mfgs of similar 66' gons [the CNW has 19 ribs] the vol 2 catalog shows the BNSF in black as the only accurate paint scheme for this car, the first run of BNSF red is a straight bottom edge gon as are all the other 2nd run cars. just saying !

Hibar,

Thanks for the clarification. Now that I think about the discussions I read on these forums, since Lionel announced these new models, I remember the disagreement between hobbyists was not just about the paint scheme but if the railroads had a Greenbrier gondola in the paint scheme as depicted, in the catalogs. Trinity Industries & National Steel Car also make mill gondolas that look identical at first glance, but have minor differences, the longer one stares at them. I knew the CSX version was correct as Greenbrier has the (CS)XT version, number (49)1600, on their webpage for this gondola & Ryan (from Lionel) had also confirmed that these models would be based on the Greenbrier design.

So, here are some photos of my CSX version. The pipe-like details on the underside are cast as ribs, not as separately applied pipes, but they are not in view, unless one turns the car over. I also like that the “BUILT BY LIONEL” markings are getting smaller compared to their scale cars from earlier this decade.

I intend to convert these to 2-rail eventually. I haven’t decided if I am going to use the Lionel 2-rail conversion kits or Atlas-O trucks, at this time. But does anyone know if the 2-rail conversion kits that Lionel announced, are available now?

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen

The underside is not that bad looking, if you can get the newer Atlas 100T RB trucks with the thinner side frames that would be the way to go. I do not believe Lionel has made their conversion kit available yet, with cut levers, air hoses and KDs the car should dress up well. I see these cars frequently on the CSX river line in N Jersey.

Thanks for the pictures Naveen, although I ordered a CSX one it is being delivered to my friend in IL, shipping and duty makes transatlantic purchases here a non starter and I will not actually get the car till the next March Meet. I will be replacing brake cylinders etc on mine when I get it along with the trucks. Not a bad car for the price, mine was ordered from Charles Ro. Only the UP and CSX seem to be prototypical, I could not find a matching numbers series on the prototype picture sites, I accept that  this is not a guarantee of fidelity though. I you want to model 2r f/s modern US then unfortunately one has to compromise as the majority of offerings are directed at the 3rail toy train market. 

hibar posted:

The underside is not that bad looking, if you can get the newer Atlas 100T RB trucks with the thinner side frames that would be the way to go. I do not believe Lionel has made their conversion kit available yet, with cut levers, air hoses and KDs the car should dress up well. I see these cars frequently on the CSX river line in N Jersey.

Hibar,

Stopped by P&D Hobby this afternoon. They had the Lionel 2-rail conversion kits in stock but they only had it for the 50-ton scale trucks & 70-ton scale trucks. As the prototype Greenbrier cars, that these new gondolas are modeled after, is rated for a Gross Rail Load of 286,000 lbs., is there a Lionel kit for the 100-ton trucks to be released or already available? It is my opinion that the 70-ton scale conversion kits, are wrong for this modern gondola.

Anyway, I took the easy way & just bought the newer 100-ton Atlas-O 2-rail tucks & Kadee 740 couplers at P&D & converted the cars to 2-rail. Even though I used the shortest 2-56 screw I had that was just 3/8” long, the screw broke through the floor of the car, even though I didn’t use a drill to deepen the hole. The floor must be rather thin in this area.

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen

Does Lionel make a 100 ton conversion? I only remember reading about the 70 ton kits for the modern trucks and 50 ton for the other type.

L84463 - 2 RAIL CONVERSION KIT 70 TON LIONSCALE TRUCKS (2)

I'm thinking it wouldn't matter? just probably 33" wheels?

Engineer-Joe posted:

Does Lionel make a 100 ton conversion? I only remember reading about the 70 ton kits for the modern trucks and 50 ton for the other type.

L84463 - 2 RAIL CONVERSION KIT 70 TON LIONSCALE TRUCKS (2)

I'm thinking it wouldn't matter? just probably 33" wheels?

 

Joe,

Thanks for the clarification on the Lionel conversion kits.

I was surprised how simple the conversion was, with the Atlas-O trucks as they were a direct replacement for the Lionel trucks & I used the screws that came with the Atlas-O truck to attach the trucks to the car.

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen

Engineer-Joe posted:

Does Lionel make a 100 ton conversion? I only remember reading about the 70 ton kits for the modern trucks and 50 ton for the other type.

L84463 - 2 RAIL CONVERSION KIT 70 TON LIONSCALE TRUCKS (2)

I'm thinking it wouldn't matter? just probably 33" wheels?

 

The three primary differences would be wheel size, wheelbase, and spring number and placement.  36" vs. 33" wheels, 70" vs. 68" wheelbase, 9 spring positions per side (3 x 3 grid) vs. 7 (2/3/2) or 9 (3 x 3).  So depending on how the 70 truck is executed with respect to the springs, the difference could be significant.  The wheelbase and wheel diameter would likely be the type of thing that would need to be seen next to a proper size truck to discern the difference.  So it probably largely depends on individual modeler attitude.

Lionel does not make 100T trucks, just the 70T roller bearing and 50T journal trucks.

Has anyone had issues with these cars shorting out tracks? My buddy said that he has seen a couple get returned to his shop he is working at saying they kept shorting out. 

SDIV Tim posted:

Has anyone had issues with these cars shorting out tracks? My buddy said that he has seen a couple get returned to his shop he is working at saying they kept shorting out. 

Maybe that thumbtack is drooping too low.

HMS2035 posted:

Sorry, that button coupler kills it for me.

Hal

Me too.  The new button coupler is a NO GO for me also.

base11 posted:

HMS2035 posted:

Sorry, that button coupler kills it for me.

Hal

Me too.  The new button coupler is a NO GO for me also.

I hear you on that one. It's was told that it's the same couplers as the Lion Scale Modern Boxcars.

I was told by Dave O. a few pages back that those couplers can be changed out with the scale ones with the hidden uncoupling plate. Just need to know what the part # is to buy and replace.

I had to use Micro-Mark Kadee spacers to lower the couplers on these cars that I had converted to 2-rail as the couplers seemed a bit higher, when tested with the Kadee Height Gauge. I speculate that Lionel designed this model to be converted with their own 70-ton wheelset / kit, as the 33” wheels would have lowered the car sufficiently to not need a single 0.025” thick spacer that I had to use with my Atlas-O 100-ton trucks.

Also, using the spacer, also reduces the length of the screws (securing the Kadee coupler-box to the body of the car) that intrudes into the floor of the car but doesn’t completely prevent it. The screws that were shipped loose, with these cars, were slightly longer than 3/8” & that wouldn’t have solved this issue either.

These are just my opinion,

Thanks,

Naveen