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Happy/Healthy New Year Elliot & all my OGR friends!  

This thread makes me feel like I walk into your train room and inspect your progress after you've punched out for the day.  You've taken more time POSTING your progress here on OGR, than many of us have done working on our own layouts.

Take care of your health first and layout second and you will achieve your goals.  I like the skip around method so that things don't get stale.  I do that too, and need to get crawling under the layout to do some more wring.  (Maybe I'll lose the 5 lbs. that I gained during the Holidays!) LOL. 

2017 was a good year and 2018 will be better!

Astounding progress.  Thanks again for sharing.

A few questions:

1) Is your track plan posted anywhere?  (I saw a couple of shots in the original thread, but they don't show a lot of definition.)

2) In the video, inside the helix you have some material between and outside of the rails that comes to the height of the railhead.  What is it, and what is the purpose?

3) In the helix, there is foil tape on the underside of each level.  Is this for holding the wires up?  What brand of foil tape did you use?  (I can't seem to find tape that will stick reliably to plywood like that.)

Thanks.  

                                          ELLIOT :

                                  you have created and built an excellent layout,

IN  EVERY WAY

            I really love following the progress on your, "dream/nightmare layout"

                              great pictures, stories, and information...

   Good Luck with your new goals for 2018 !       have a healthy Happy New Year !!

                             cannot wait to see your new progress this year !   Brian

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Last edited by briansilvermustang

Excellent work and video! I can imagine what the track costs alone! I wonder what that cost would be with Atlas O track!

OK, I must have missed it in the past 34 Pages but why are some sections of main line- mainly in the helix and/or along a back wall is the "ground" level with the outside rails? Is this a safety issue or plans for street running? OR some future scene?

Last edited by prrhorseshoecurve

Elliot fantastic thank you for sharing your layouts journey with us all.  you have accomplished quiet a lot this year considering the health issues that arose as well.

so do you ever take time to just run trains to enjoy the layout?  do you know exactly how many full train consists you can store in the hidden yard area?

I actually saw some brickwork and greenery scenery in last video looked really nice.

I hope 2018 is an even better year for you and the layout too.

That is just amazing!! I have to go back and finish reading all the links, but really looks like a lot got done. I like the videos too. It just keeps getting better with each update. It would take me a year just to put all that update info together and get it posted here. 

Wishing you and yours a happy and healthy new year. (And also the same to everyone else here at the OGR forum.)

Thank you all for your support on my grand project!!! It is the next best thing to having visitors. As always there is a standing invitation to all forum members. All you have to do is drop me an email and let me know when you'll be in town.

I suspect that my post, with all of its photos and videos, was the largest in forum history. I spent about 8 hours at dialysis gathering everything into a folder, writing the opening text and grabbing the permalink URL's, in prep. Then it took another 5 hours last night to upload everything and write the captions. You may have noticed I had a number of different fonts and a couple different colors. That was not my intent, but the forum was resisting my attempts to go back to normal from the red headings. Probably wasted an hour there. Oh well.

So frequently on my monthly reports, you guys comment on how much I've accomplished. Most of the time, I just have to take your word for it, because when I'm doing it, it just feels normal, like nothing special. This review was different, a real wake up call. Now I get it, and it feels good.

The next big push is for scenery. I need to have some photo worthy scenes by April, and even more by Labor Day. I think that when the layout tour committee revisits me in April, they will be sufficiently impressed, and I'll be on. That doesn't mean I'm going to take my foot off the gas though. I may stomp it down harder through the summer. I'm open to suggestions as to which scenes to tackle first. They all need to be done. For variety, it was decided years ago, that each aisle would be a different season. Aisle 1 winter, 2 spring, 3 summer and 4 fall, Red Wing will also be fall, to add more color, and give a visual transition from aisle 4 back to 1. I see it all in my head, and I'm constantly mulling over materials and techniques, especially the winter scenes.

Mark - I hope you got to see the entire post, I edited it three times before it was done. I was worried about all those pictures. You were Johnny on the spot when I put up the first section.

Roman - Always great to see you, almost like clockwork. Sorry I was running a bit late. I was done at midnight Pacific not Central like normal.

Chad - Hope you got to see my shout out to you. I do so love that sign. It's perfect!

Matt - That's a great way of putting it. Of course I do edit what you see, but not because there's anything to hide, more that I don't want to bore you. Keeping it interesting, keeps you coming back. As for my health and the layout, they are more closely related than you might think. Working on the layout keeps me out of the refrigerator, gets me moving around a little, and improves my mental outlook. All good things.

Art - Thanks, I really had a good time doing it. The diligence of treating the layout like a job really pays off. It's still fun, even though it's work. Aren't those the best jobs in life? Keep plugging away on yours. It's great to have you back. Say Hi to Jim.

Mallard - I know I've answered all those questions in the past, but there's no point to digging for them, I'll just do it again. The track plans for all 3 levels mainline only:

3 hidden yards

1 lower deck mainlines

2 upper deck mainlines

I couldn't find a good closeup of the track, let me explain what it is and why I do it. The material is Luan mahogany plywood. I cut the sheet into strips of specific widths, 4 different sizes depending on the situation. Two sizes for the bottom layer and two for the top. On curves, the first strip goes down on the inside of the curve, laid to a line drawn with my "vertical compass"  that pole on the left, which has an arm, not shown. When screwed down, it forms a perfect bending jig. That is followed by the spacer strip, which results in perfect 4" spacing. Then cap strips of the correct widths go over the tie ends to lock the track down. No screws in the track itself.

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Technically, that foil isn't tape, it's just kitchen foil, mounted with spray adhesive. Its purpose is to form a ground plane for TMCC, keeping the stacked tracks from interfering with each other.

Bob - Thanks. I think I'm in pretty good shape deadline wise. There will be lots to get excited about in 2018.

Mike - Thanks I have always enjoyed sharing my work with all of you. It was a lot of fun putting that together.

John - Thanks for all your help. I'm anxious to see what you build in your new train room.

Paul - I've enjoyed reading about your progress. I like your style.

Brian - Thanks. Looks like you have quite the space to fill yourself. I'm anxious to see it take shape.

Pete - Thanks. Stay tuned, it should be another good one.

Milwrd - 28 x 30 is no small space. The main reason I have the space that I do is, my ex wife and I bought a 2.5 acre lot and built our dream house. My part of that dream was to have the same sized space that I had at Mall of America.

Prrhorseshoecurve - Probably about 40% of the track was purchased for the mall layout 25 years ago, prices were a little better back then. At least 5 cases were picked up second hand from forum members. The rest was bought new from dealers, whoever had the best price. The last few from Trainworld. To have gone with Atlas, which I love, probably would have added between 30 - 50%. Yikes! I addressed your other question in my response to Mallard above. I only do that treatment in hidden spaces. I do have some intermodal yards that I plan on paving. I'll probably use 1/4" Masonite for that.

Nessmuck - Thanks, but I'm not sure that title is uniquely mine. There are a lot of great train people out there, many better than me. But I try.

Ray - The big hidden yard holds exactly 25 trains, five on each of five tracks. The small holds 7, one on each track. The yard under Dayton's bluff can hold three. The rest of the layout can probably do another 25, like 60 trains floating around. I don't find running trains particularly relaxing, like many here do. My layout isn't the kind where you can "set it and forget it". You have to pay attention to the throttle, and throw the switches, just to complete a loop. I think what you saw was the retaining wall on the upper deck. That's another leftover from enterTRAINment. That thing has been kicked around and beat up almost as badly as the roundhouse. I thought about tossing it, but people seem to like it. So I found a place where it would fit. It needs a little work, add some more rows to the top. You know what it's made of? GarGraves ties!

Doug - Thanks, I have no plan on quitting. A new one every month.

RTR12 - As I mentioned above, I got a good head start on this post while I was sitting for four hours at dialysis. I spent the better part of three of those sessions gathering stuff. I'm constantly having to dream up stuff to do to fill that time.

Ameentrainguy - That's quite the compliment for me to wrap my head around. If there was a model railroading hall of fame, John Allen would be in it. My modeling skills are not really on that level, and my style is much more simplistic. Your comparison raises an interesting question in my mind; if the technology of today were available back then, would he have partaken?

 

Thanks again to everyone for all the wonderful comments, questions and well wishes. I sorry it has taken so long to reply today, a bit of a rough ending at dialysis. Removing more than 10 pounds of fluid is pretty harsh. The big problems are cramping and dizziness from low blood pressure. Got home, had dinner and crashed for 3 hours. It's kind of the new normal.

 

 

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Last edited by Big_Boy_4005

I sorry it has taken so long to reply today, a bit of a rough ending at dialysis. Removing more than 10 pounds of fluid is pretty harsh. The big problems are cramping and dizziness from low blood pressure. Got home, had dinner and crashed for 3 hours. It's kind of the new normal.

Elliot, No need to feel sorry for taking a little longer to respond.  As I’ve mentioned before, I’m familiar with all the issues you have with dialysis since my wife was a dialysis nurse for I guess about 7 years.  Taking off 10 pounds of fluid will certainly do you in.  

Thank you for mentioning I got on a bit early to see everything.  I did see you had ‘Under Construction “ posted.  I’ll go back later today to review what I missed.

John Allen.  Yes, he was my model railroad hero growing up.  Reading about his modeling may have contributed to me buying HO as my first train instead of Lionel in the late ‘60s.  The thing about him is back then he built so much from scratch.  I do think he was innovative enough to try new methods, products, and technologies!

Keep up the work when you can and rest when needed!  I think the layout is therapeutic and gets you moving around!!

WOW !!! Elliot. You got a lot done. I am always amazed at the scope of your layout. Over 16 minutes to make one round trip is truly amazing. You should be very proud of the amount and quality of work you have done. This is one of my favorite threads and always look forward to your postings. This year you outdid yourself.

Bravo Elliot! Your hard-work on this layout never ceases to amaze me. Your layout is now the Mount Everest of 3 rail Home layouts & even larger then some club layouts. Those Helix's are huge and I am guess you use WiFi cameras to monitor the train. Awhile back  you had a rail car video of your layout with a WiFi camera on it. Can you share what make and model of the camera you utilized on the railcar?

Thanks,

Last edited by Seacoast

Elliot, the past year of your progress is fantastic and for now, a great final to the year 2017.   As we are all aware, there is always something to be done on our layouts, you simply tend to accomplish more and are the best of encouragement for the rest of us.  Not only are your posts informative, entertaining, they are inspirational beyond measure.  I know I speak for others when stating you, sir, push others to obtain more in their own layouts by laying the groundwork and sharing your efforts.  We all owe you much, the best of health and progress in your efforts on all fronts during this new year and all to follow.  Happy New Year to all who follow along and post on this Forum.  Brothers/sisters in trains and in the same, a family to encourage, support, teach and have the enjoyment of sharing our experiences.

May God bless you all in this and all coming years.

Jesse    TCA  12-68275

 

Must say a terrific job for one that has faced adversity. As for time, my layout took 15 years to build and its only 90% finished.  You are making good progress but large layouts take time and your layout has very complex controls.  As for the stamina/energy aspect; we all don't have the same as it was years ago so work sessions are now 1-3 hours in length.  When I need energy I just make myself a double cup of Turkish coffee. After one cup of that brew, you feel like superman.

Elliot,

We have run out of words to describe your undertaking, and the superb accomplishments you are making in spite of the challenges you face. Normally, the planning, the intricate details, and the breadth of disciplines involved would be quite a task for a 'normal' size home layout; but in your case, we must take this ten fold, and it becomes Elliot's Masterpiece.

As has been mentioned before, the time you have taken for your monthly updates, with videos, well presented details, and your care to answer the myriad of questions we have asked you, make all of this all the more admirable.

Thank you once again, and have a great 2018!

Alex

Mike - Thanks, I do try to make my posts fun and informative. The new norm ain't so bad, it usually consists of a 2-3 hour nap after dinner, around 6PM. Then I'm good til about 3 AM. That's how I do it. Now if I could just get myself to go downstairs and take advantage of it. Usually, I just chill and watch TV. Clock's tickin'.

Mark - I'm not sure about John Allen. You touched on his scratch building skills, and I feel that that would have remained his focus. There are still a lot of people that shun command control. My operations guy Gary is one. His layout is still block control. I asked him why, and he cited cost and the hassle of putting decoders in every engine. In the 3 rail world, there are a lot of people who still run conventional. This is why I feel John wouldn't have. Sadly, we will never know. He died much too young. Now some medical technology...

Pat - Thanks! You know, the layout hasn't gotten any longer, I just turned the throttle down a bit, wanting everyone to get a better look around. Don't feel so bad about your mishap at the club. I once smoked an engine when it split a switch. It wasn't on fire, but it was close! Smelled nasty for a long time. When I took the shell off, almost all the insulation was burned off every wire. That one was an important lesson. It was never repaired. Now, a similar engine may have a bad motor, so the burnt one will be a donor if that's the case. Bottom line, keep a fire extinguisher handy, and hope you never need it. My space is so big, I invested in four, and not just any ABC class, but specifically CO2. They're more expensive, but what they protect has greater value. My theory is, why add insult to injury? Who wants to clean up more of a mess from dry chemical?

George - Thanks. Funny you should bring up Mount Everest. I used to compare building enterTRAINment at Mall of America to exactly that, wondering what could I do to top it? I was angry and depressed for quite a while after I was forced to close. After some analysis, both mathematical and psychological, got me through that rough time. That was a different series of challenges from my current layout. Removing the external pressure of running a business has made this layout much more enjoyable. Also, while I have had a good deal of help with this project from Patrick, Matt, Jon, Joe, Gary, Scott, Walt, Dave, Dakota, and of course Tammy my wife, that list is short by comparison to what enterTRAINment required, but no less critical. As I come into the home stretch, for the most part, my help has moved on. Actually, the camera that goes around the layout is a GoPro Hero2 (an older model). It is not exactly WiFi, though there is a signal that it can send to a phone or tablet for monitoring, but it records the images on an SD card in the camera, which is how I do it. It has a waterproof case which I mounted to an old MPC gondola.

Bill - Thank you, and you're welcome. There is a lot to digest. I'm still having a hard time wrapping my head around it, and I was there the whole time.

Jesse - I'm at a loss for words. You're too kind. It gives me great joy when people find motivation or inspiration from my work. The thoughts you've expressed help to motivate me.

Dennis - Thanks. You and I seem to be working on similar time frames. 2018 will be the 15th year of construction for me. However, I took five years off when I was diagnosed with skin cancer. That was eleven years ago now. My elixir of choice when working on the layout is more mundane, water. And I go through a lot of it. In a few of my photos you might catch a two liter bottle. I keep two of them in the freezer, partly filled with ice, then top one off with water, and the ice lasts all day. Now I have to be careful how much I drink, because whatever goes in, has to come off at dialysis. The bigger the number, the harsher the session. I'm still adjusting to this concept.

Alex - Thank you. You make a very good point when you say multiple disciplines. Model Railroading is kind of an "umbrella" hobby, because it has so many elements under it. 2017 has brought to a near close the design, carpentry, trackwork and major electrical portions of the project. 2018 will see me moving into the more artistic and technical aspects with scenery and computer controls. Then of course, there is the end game, when everything comes together and the railroad is ready to host operating sessions. I enjoy when people ask questions about what I'm doing, so I'm always happy to answer them. Some of my methods are a bit unconventional, but I find them practical for what I'm trying to do.

Slowhands - Thanks. As I said in my previous post, forum members are always welcome, just let me know when. I recommend spring or later. I should have a good deal of scenery by then. It's a nice drive up here, stop at the Dells for lunch.

Time to get back to work!

Last edited by Big_Boy_4005
Big_Boy_4005 posted:

It all started back in 1998 when my ex wife and I decided to buy a vacant lot and build our dream house. Before we even broke ground, the track plan for the 2000 sqft train room was mostly drawn. We moved in in April of 2000, but there was still a lot of construction on the house left for me to do, so the train room went to the back burner. In December of 2002, the wife decided she wanted out. Shortly after that layout construction began in earnest.

This design is a prototype based representation of the Minneapolis / St Paul area. The focus was originally  on the Amtrak Empire Builder, but expanded to encompass a lot of freight operation along the way. The plan calls for two main levels separated by 24" and a hidden storage/staging yard below that, all connected by two helixes.


This is the lower level track plan. Unfortunately it is difficult to post in a format where all the detail is visible, but hopefully you'll get the general idea.

Photo Jul 26, 10 58 31 PM


The upper level plan isn't all drawn, but it is becoming clearer in my head.

Photo Jul 26, 10 59 29 PM

I had just started building a layout at my previous house, when the decision to move was made. Those chunks were easily salvaged and reworked into the hidden yard. By late 2006 benchwork was about 2/3 complete, one helix was nearly done and a 500' continuous loop was operational. I was chuggin right along!

And then it all came to a screeching halt. I was diagnosed with skin cancer. For 6 years I didn't feel like doing anything with trains. This past May, my PET scan came back negative, and the oncologist said he didn't want to see me anymore.

It hasn't been easy transitioning from couch potato back to model railroader. I'm beginning to wonder if I have bitten off more than I can chew. I just don't have the energy that I used to. I have the time and the money, but what I need is a small army.

There is a lot more story to tell, but this seems like a good stopping point. Feel free to ask questions. And if you are ever in the Twin Cities and would like to visit, just email me to set it up.

Here are a few more shots from around the room.

Photo Aug 30, 8 56 31 PM
Photo May 07, 4 41 05 PM
Photo May 07, 4 41 38 PM
Photo May 07, 4 41 53 PM

x

This is fantastic work,,,,,,what a good job...

Elliot,

That is what is so great about our hobby.... passion.... endeavors...... it all feeds off efforts and inspirations of others.  For some it may be simply "keeping up with the Jones's".  But, for the most part it is because a fondness of what it takes in terms of energy, commitment and pursuit of a determined goal.  Isn't that what has been the driving force behind many endeavors in the history of mankind?  Only, with what we all share, is just that.... it is a pleasure to share with others, in and out of the sphere of this hobby.  And the amount of satisfaction can be immeasurable, for the active participants as well as the observers looking in and marveling at the results of our endeavors.

Though not all may realize it, that is the source of all our efforts and the main pleasure we all feel.  When I worked managing construction at the Great Lakes Naval Center, the O Gauge Club we started (with great friends made while living there), I will never forget the looks on the faces of the kids as we set up and ran trains at shopping malls, libraries, etc.  I even handed my Cab1 to a select few young gentlemen who frequented our run sessions with their parents, the thrill they got, and the smiles are priceless.  It is a "hobby" to be shared and experienced by all... but, somehow the term of "hobby" does not encompass it all........    Many thanks to you, sir, and all others for contributions to the "hobby".

Jesse

Lots of progress to report in January. It really helped that Patrick came over twice.

Here he is putting on the very last roller of sky blue paint!

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The entire backdrop is officially done.

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He had me take a picture of his phone to record the moment. It has been five years in the making.

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Next up, the fascia. After Patrick's December visit, we had a slight height mismatch back in this corner.

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It was easily straightened out, and we were back on track.

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We marked the four 20 Amp circuits that power the layout. Brown is the outlets located around the layout. Red is track power. Orange is all other layout functions, such as, turnouts, security cameras, C/MRI, and misc other things. Yellow is layout lighting.

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It was necessary to pull the plugs on the track power and accessory power, in order add a pair of outlets to the accessory power switch.

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We ran the pipe from the switch box, down the leg of the layout, across the floor under the aisle, and continued over to a different leg...

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where it went up and over to the new box.

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I put an extension ring on the switch box. The one on the left is track power, the one on the right is all accessory functions.

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Back to the fascia, I got the very last piece of Masonite hung for the entire layout, over at Roseville.

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Much like when Patrick finished the the backdrop blue, this was the last bit to get flat black "primer". Most of the layout still needs its final coat of semi gloss black, but still a major milestone.

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It does make everything look a lot more finished.

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And then it was time to start on scenery. I put in the cardboard support strips along the hump at Northtown.

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Even though this is just a first coat of plaster cloth, it will remain white when finished. All of aisle one will be a winter scene, upper and lower.

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These curves are the winter - spring transition. I just took solid cardboard pieces and filled in between the tracks.

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I added a couple strips of plywood to serve as a stapling surface along the backdrop.

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More plaster cloth...

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and more.

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I cut the pavement surface for Midway intermodal.

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I took some foam and filled in the west bank of the river under the Short Line Bridge.

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After filling and sanding 32nd St over at Hiawatha, I painted the street with a weathered asphalt color. I still have to do the concrete sidewalks, curbs and gutters.

23

Patrick's second visit, we worked to fill in the holes in the lower deck benchwork.

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Three more holes filled in here.

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This area is still a work in progress. The plywood will be the river, but no water, ice because it's winter. Should be fun to model.

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I filled in this little piece. I was tired of the power plant being perched precariously on the 1x4's.

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I won't be using very many traditional accessories, but there's a bit of a story behind this one. Back in 2013 I went around to almost every layout on the NMRA regional tour. At one of the stops, my wife took a picture of a hobo camp. This friend of ours (not really into trains) saw the picture, and said, "Where are you going to put the hobo camp?"

At that point I wasn't, I didn't own this piece, and I didn't really have a place for it. Like a dog with a bone, he would not stop.

Then one day I was cruising through the Trainz auctions on eBay, and spotted it in a lot with a crossing signal, which was what I was really after. I guess it was just meant to be. BTW, he was very excited when he heard that I bought it.

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I'm going to put it in that triangle, next to the switch, top center. It will be back behind some trees.

Back to work. I carved the roadbed around the wye. There's still a little left to do.

29

This is my ballast sifting setup. Raw material in the black bucket on the right, clean ballast in the bus tub, and reject pieces in the ice cream bucket. I sat and watched the hockey game and mindlessly sifted two 50 pound bags. There's still a bunch more in the garage.

30

I spread the ballast over this section, now that it won't fall down into the hidden yard. All the seams are are caulked to keep the glue solution from leaking down too.

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Eventually I'm going to be mixing plaster to cover the plaster cloth. My wife found me this set of silicone baking pans for mixing on Amazon $14.

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Finally, it's almost time to start the scenery. For 17 years these buckets have been stored under the center section of the layout. When I had enterTRAINment 25 years ago, I was able to buy directly from Woodland Scenics in bulk.

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I have all the colors and textures they made back then.

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This area was packed full.

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They've made their way to the light of day, but this is only about half of them.

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Blank tree armatures. I want to work to add more branches to these for use in the winter scenes. I also have hundreds more that have foliage.

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As if all that wasn't enough, my Scenic Express order showed up. I bought a bunch of more modern materials to supplement the old Woodland stuff.

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Next month we should have some greenery!

 

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Last edited by Big_Boy_4005

Elliot- I thought the layout itself was outstanding! What is really outstanding is all the behind the scenes work that is going on, I.E the CTC control panels, searchlight signal driver cards, the wiring for the hidden yard, the computers, camera's, relay panels, outstanding!!! I talk about the  CTC control panels and the SSD's like I know what the heck I am talking about, but I have no idea!! LOL!! You said somewhere along the line that your wife helped you check the SSD cards, that's just great that she is involved in all of this. Overall that is a lot of behind the scenes work that once you are up and running most people will have no idea the amount of work it took to get you to that point.

Elliot, fantastic start to 2018 and end of January report showed tremendous progress. Taking the time to do everything right shows up in these pics. You should announce classes for speed layout building and scenery when yours is done. I'll sign up. When everything is all done the pics of the finished layout are going to be truly awesome. Thanks for this journey so far.............Paul

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