N&W CLASS A 1218

@harmonyards posted:

Hmmm, ….very interesting,….as if you read my mind!…..I’ve been painting for over 35 years, and to this date, I never knew a picture could exaggerate orange peel,…..to death,……orange peel is orange peel, it’s either there, or it ain’t!….I’m very glad you’re happy with your new purchase, cause I’d be livid,……I am well aware of what a newly delivered, or restored locomotive is supposed to look like,…I’m just kinda surprised a multi million dollar manufacturer accepted that kind of finish on such a highly touted, & highly priced model,…..if you’re gonna lay down a gloss finish on a model, it’d better be slick as glass,…..gloss in scale is tough to do!…the slightest orange peel, and the message ain’t conveyed……they got to be slick like an eel,…..this is how it should be done…..the first represents as-delivered Mohawk in triple black lacquer, and the second is excursion J 611 done in gloss urethane to match high gloss Dupont Imron used on the J’s subsequent repaints in modern day …….again, I’m glad you’re glad, and thank you for posting the pictures, ……not knocking your model, it just doesn’t sit well with me, …..I’d be doing a re-shoot,….

Pat

Yes I definitely see where you're coming from with those thoughts.  I also didn't pay attention to who I was replying to so my explanation probably came across as a bit more "educating" than I would have if I had been paying attention.  You've definitely posted some beautiful modeling projects over the years!

Most comments I've seen about the gloss have been along the lines of "why would anybody paint a model in gloss finish, real trains aren't shiny" so that was my thought process in answering.

@harmonyards posted:

.... and to this date, I never knew a picture could exaggerate orange peel,…..to death,……

Hah! You should know by now that if you want to see any defect in your workmanship, just post a photo of it online and it will stick out like a sore thumb! BTDT!

A few details that I find missing on this high end model that I would think should have been included is :
1.) The whistle cord. Actually it is not a cord at all but a metal rod that ran from the cab through the sandbox to the whistle.
2.) Curtains. Other Lionel offerings have them, why not this?
3.) The "Water Gauge" on the fireman's side of the tender.

Some detail photos of the 1218 that I took years ago for those who want to learn more.

Jim, when I was there in March the 1218 was on the track against the platform:

I brought my 1238 home yesterday:

This is my first Lionel with the Force Coupler. It seems a bit hyperactive especially in reverse. I haven’t looked at it very closely yet but I keep getting the ‘crunch-bang’ sound.

The Kadee setup is pretty nice and easy though!

@SantaFe158 posted:

Yes I definitely see where you're coming from with those thoughts.  I also didn't pay attention to who I was replying to so my explanation probably came across as a bit more "educating" than I would have if I had been paying attention.  You've definitely posted some beautiful modeling projects over the years!

Most comments I've seen about the gloss have been along the lines of "why would anybody paint a model in gloss finish, real trains aren't shiny" so that was my thought process in answering.

Oh I agree with you 100%, it’s about time the mfr.’s did some gloss models, ……if they did it a little wetter, and had their concoction a little thinner, they’d a nailed it,……but as I mentioned, if you guys are happy, then that’s all that matters,….what irks me is if I can get a slick finish in my one car paint booth, with just me & a gun, then to be sure a world class manufacturer should be able to blow my doors off, …..I mean, if they need a consulting service on how to get it right, I am available. I can’t speak of the things Big Jim says are wrong, the N&W really ain’t my cup of tea, only specific models that I’ve been contracted to build, but then I study up on them and get well versed,…..in the case of the J, it just so happens that locomotive frequents the NC Transportation museum, so I literally can go hang out with it for a while……I’m not knocking you, or your model Jake, they just could’ve done a better job,…..

Pat

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

I brought my 1238 home yesterday:

This is my first Lionel with the Force Coupler. It seems a bit hyperactive especially in reverse. I haven’t looked at it very closely yet but I keep getting the ‘crunch-bang’

I have the 1210 and notice the same repeating “crunch bang” when in reverse, with or without pushing a line of cars.  While going forward I do not notice any hyperactivity. This is my first force coupler also.

Interesting! I can trigger the crunch sound with the engine at idle and pushing the trailing truck back and forth. I understand it’s some type of sensor, just not sure what kind. I looked them up on the support site. The Niagara breakdown shows it. The trailing truck armature/mount/sensor has about +/-3/32” of travel from center from my quick investigation. I’m wondering if it can be adjusted.

Minor issue aside, I absolutely love the whistle effects with the engine and tender speaker interaction. It’s my first engine with this feature and it’s really neat to play with.

@Norm Charbonneau you may want to go back a post or two and reload your video.  It's been "spinning" for an hour.  I for one would like to see it.

Eh, maybe I will get a quick YouTube up later.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Interesting! I can trigger the crunch sound with the engine at idle and pushing the trailing truck back and forth. I understand it’s some type of sensor, just not sure what kind. I looked them up on the support site. The Niagara breakdown shows it. The trailing truck armature/mount/sensor has about +/-3/32” of travel from center from my quick investigation. I’m wondering if it can be adjusted.

Minor issue aside, I absolutely love the whistle effects with the engine and tender speaker interaction. It’s my first engine with this feature and it’s really neat to play with.

The issue hasn’t bothered me enough to investigate it at the workbench yet. I will eventually.  Besides, I currently have a long line coal cars hooked to it.  Going backwards is asking for trouble right now.

I am very pleased with the model. Every time I run it, I discover a new detail or feature.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

I brought my 1238 home yesterday:

Hey Norm, I’ve watched a bunch of your videos and subscribe to your YouTube channel. Is it just me or is this a rare sighting of an active smoke unit on your awesome layout?  Looks fantastic. You should light ‘em up more often.

I don’t run smoke very often although I have a lot of engines with perfectly good units in them. I’d rather have decent weathering and be able to maintain it without the hassle of cleaning the oil off the flat finish. Another thing that some people seem to forget is that for us married guys, one trick to keeping marital bliss intact is to not upset your wife’s olfactory senses!

The smooth running and awesome sounds emanating from this beast more than makes up for the lack of smoke!

Now I need to find more hoppers and another caboose or two. Can’t believe how scarce proper N&W cabooses are considering how many popular N&W engines have been made.

I agree with the lack of a mass-produced, O scale N&W caboose. Lionel & MTH never had a problem producing fantasy paint schemes on almost anything, they can do the same with a N&W caboose, if they want to guarantee enough sales. Lionel produced the B&O I-12 Wagon top caboose, in various paint schemes.

HOW CAN WE MAKE THIS HAPPEN?

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

I don’t run smoke very often although I have a lot of engines with perfectly good units in them. I’d rather have decent weathering and be able to maintain it without the hassle of cleaning the oil off the flat finish. Another thing that some people seem to forget is that for us married guys, one trick to keeping marital bliss intact is to not upset your wife’s olfactory senses!

The smooth running and awesome sounds emanating from this beast more than makes up for the lack of smoke!

Now I need to find more hoppers and another caboose or two. Can’t believe how scarce proper N&W cabooses are considering how many popular N&W engines have been made.

I have been asking Scott Mann about offering N&W hoppers in plastic, seeing as how awesome their battleship gondolas came out. Perhaps now is the time to petition? Although I have a lot of brass N&W hoppers, I share your interest in more proper N&W hoppers and cabooses.

Greg P

www.youtube.com/trainbros89

Now is the time.

Everyone may not agree, but personally, I'm satisfied with the Atlas, Lionel & MTH 2 bay fish belly type hoppers. IT'S A CABOOSE WE NEED. That will satisfy 3 Rail & 2 Rail.

@ironman1 posted:

Everyone may not agree, but personally, I'm satisfied with the Atlas, Lionel & MTH 2 bay fish belly type hoppers. IT'S A CABOOSE WE NEED. That will satisfy 3 Rail & 2 Rail.

Atlas definitely makes some nice hoppers. I agree about the caboose offerings, someone needs to step up.

Mostly a repeat of my photos above, but there is some operating footage at the end of this brief video I put together yesterday.  The caboose running at the end of the train is an MTH product from the early 2000s.  It's the closest steam era appropriate N&W caboose I was able to dig up.  I doubt it's a perfect match for any true prototype other than the paint scheme, but it serves the purpose until someone comes up with something better.

A couple comments about the force coupler, I too noted some of the quirks mentioned above in its operation.  At one point I deactivated the feature as outlined in the manual and you can then control the "laboring" effects manually as with a normal Legacy locomotive.  I haven't quite decided which way I like better yet.

I am interested in getting the N&W 2231510 but have one anal question about the 5 whistle sounds - once a sound is selected, does it persist even after the track is powered off????

Yes it will hold on that selection until you press the AUX 1 button again then the whistle.

Maybe we will get matching aux water tender and cabooses in the next Lionel catalog.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Now I need to find more hoppers and another caboose or two. Can’t believe how scarce proper N&W cabooses are considering how many popular N&W engines have been made.

The only time I remember finding near-prototypical N&W CF/CG cabooses for sale was earlier this year when two went up for auction on eBay - one in dark blue with the hamburger logo, the other red. I think both went for close to over $200 each. We need more of these made!

@ironman1 posted:

Everyone may not agree, but personally, I'm satisfied with the Atlas, Lionel & MTH 2 bay fish belly type hoppers. IT'S A CABOOSE WE NEED. That will satisfy 3 Rail & 2 Rail.

The non-peaked end fishbelly hoppers are fine, and I think are "prototypical enough" for certain classes of N&W hopper (I can't remember exactly which), but I would really love to see more of the peaked-end hoppers. Atlas is the only one I know of that has made them in 3 rail (and have found on the used market). More of these would be great, especially in plastic. Atlas' die-cast version is very hefty and feels great just to hold in your hand, but trying to pull a long string of them up a grade may not be possible depending on the grade and number of cars.

I repainted this Weaver 2 rail CG that was in the diesel scheme but I am not real happy with the way it came out. I may work on it some more but it’s real close to getting stripped and redone. I used an old Champ set of decals which were very thick and weren’t trying to stay on for me. Weaver did the CG and CF and they are hard to find. I doubt Lionel would tool one but you never know. Their N5 was pretty nice and unexpected.

They were cataloged in 2006, here’s the archived catalog:

https://www.yumpu.com/en/docum...atalog-weaver-models

I have a few of these Atlas hoppers which are good enough for now:

laz1957, thanks a bunch for the info on the whistle selection; glad to hear it stays persistent.

Happy New Year,

RickM46

@0-Gauge CJ posted:

The only time I remember finding near-prototypical N&W CF/CG cabooses for sale was earlier this year when two went up for auction on eBay - one in dark blue with the hamburger logo, the other red. I think both went for close to over $200 each. We need more of these made!

I really doubt a newly tooled cabin car from the big L would be much cheaper.

The orange peel kind of looks prototypical of steam engine paint jobs.

Weaver brass CF/CGs are worth 200-300 bucks imo. They are very nicely made. Sunset made a nice 2 rail CG too, maybe early 80s? A proper scale N&W steam era caboose tooled to modern standards in ABS would be welcome right about now, tooled to the standards of Lionel’s nice I-12 (fetching north of $100 lately) or the nice PRR N5s.

Here’s the CF at Roanoke:

So is the N5 all new tooling? That certainly is listed at a reasonable price, at $89.99.

A few years back it was, yes. The cupola is diecast for some reason!

I think Lionel could make a nice N&W caboose if they really wanted to. They could paint it Sponge Bob later on too I wouldn’t care.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

A few years back it was, yes. The cupola is diecast for some reason!

I think Lionel could make a nice N&W caboose if they really wanted to. They could paint it Sponge Bob later on too I wouldn’t care.

Man those are really nice looking as weathered!

Wasn't this cataloged in 2015? I assumed they were based on the earlier brass version they did years back.

I have the smoking version of the N5b they did and then an N5 that lacks the crash bars. I like them a lot.

Edit: turns out I got my cabin cars mixed up. Lionel did an N8 in brass in the 90s. Williams did the brass N5.

Hey Norm, I like your Sponge Bob suggestion. I’d even buy a Sponge Bob if that’s all they made…for $89.99. I’d just repaint it.😊 I’d definitely have to re-run my N&W caboose decals for sure though.

BTW, the Sunset CG caboose is ok, I have 2, it lacks the detail of the Weaver, mostly missing separately applied roof walks. It appears to be stamped as part of the roof.

Joe

Did Sunset do the CH? Here’s one on brasstrains:

https://brasstrains.com/Classi...tom-1979-Run-Lhee-Do

Here’s a nice page showing some prototype photos:

http://www.springmillsdepot.com/nwprototypephotos.htm

I believe the Sunset caboose is a CH (not a CG as I mentioned in my earlier reply). I'm not sure if Sunset produced a CG. Both versions are very similar and the same design as the wood sided CF, except with steel sides & the CH has end windows.

Quick shot of my 1218 on the test track with an MTH aux tender and an Atlas O N&W baggage/tool car. The gloss finish on mine came out pretty smooth. Looking forward to getting all of the excursion cars behind it (the earlier release cars with the correct paint color that matches that Atlas O car) Not sure what Lionel has been thinking lately with using what is basically red for their recent N&W offerings.

Anyone NOT receive their pre-order Class A yet? I'm still waiting on mine...

@pbuff posted:

Anyone NOT receive their pre-order Class A yet? I'm still waiting on mine...

Just got one yesterday. Depending on your shop they all received them at different times. Combine that with possible shop closings for vacations and it can slow the process a bit.

I’m still waiting on mine. I’ve got a 1218 and Pilot version coming.

Have a question for SantaFe158 regarding his comments on the force coupler or any other members:

SantaFe158: A couple comments about the force coupler, I too noted some of the quirks mentioned above in its operation.  At one point I deactivated the feature as outlined in the manual and you can then control the "laboring" effects manually as with a normal Legacy locomotive.

I am trying to do the same on my recently arrived 1201; I successfully set its engine ID and then ran the engine for a while; now I want to go back and disable the force coupler sounds; tried following the instructions on page 15 of the manual but no success.  The instructions mention pressing Aux on the Cab2 but my Cab2 1.6 only has has Aux1 and Aux 2 buttons.  Maybe I am missing some steps.

@RickM46 posted:

Have a question for SantaFe158 regarding his comments on the force coupler or any other members:

SantaFe158: A couple comments about the force coupler, I too noted some of the quirks mentioned above in its operation.  At one point I deactivated the feature as outlined in the manual and you can then control the "laboring" effects manually as with a normal Legacy locomotive.

I am trying to do the same on my recently arrived 1201; I successfully set its engine ID and then ran the engine for a while; now I want to go back and disable the force coupler sounds; tried following the instructions on page 15 of the manual but no success.  The instructions mention pressing Aux on the Cab2 but my Cab2 1.6 only has has Aux1 and Aux 2 buttons.  Maybe I am missing some steps.

When you push "info" AUX appears in the top LCD.  Push the corresponding button under it, then AUX1, then 8.

DOH, thanks MartyE; saw the Aux on the LCD and have successfully turned off the forced coupler sounds using the manuals instructions.

I use whistle sound #5 and now its seems louder above all the other sounds.  I have been waiting for this whistle sound since I started into Lionel in 2014; as a kid I had a bedroom window facing the railroad tracks (1 mile away) in my Pennsylvania coal town and at night I could easily hear the locos going by with, I think, this whistle.