New to DCS Can't Power Tracks Through WTIU?

When you run in passive mode, you'll need to place a choke between the Transformer output and the track. This will prevent the transformer from trashing the DCS signal.

@H1000 posted:

When you run in passive mode, you'll need to place a choke between the Transformer output and the track. This will prevent the transformer from trashing the DCS signal.

Makes sense I will look into that but is there something wrong with my WTIU or how I'm setting it up? With the two block sections on my layout I do want to be able to use two outputs the way it is intended.

I've messed around with this further this morning and the issue appears to be my zw-l with the WTIU. I took a simple loop of track and ran the power from my zw-l thru the WTIU and had the same issue. The WTIU clicks but the light stays green for that channel, no power or dcs or legacy signal to the track.

Does anyone else have a Zw-l and a WTIU and is it working?

Could it be an issue with the ZW-L outputting a modified sine wave? Does it work okay with a power brick?

@H1000 posted:

Could it be an issue with the ZW-L outputting a modified sine wave? Does it work okay with a power brick?

I don't have a power brick to try it with, I have a postwar zw, that has a better wave I think. Just wasn't sure if that try of transformer would hurt the WTIU?

@ArtsModelTrains posted:

I don't have a power brick to try it with, I have a postwar zw, that has a better wave I think. Just wasn't sure if that try of transformer would hurt the WTIU?

The post-war ZW has a true pure sine wave output just like a brick. It won't hurt anything but the ZW has less than stellar circuit protection. It's always recommended that a fast blow fuse be placed between the ZW and WTIU. The internal fuses in the WTIU also do this job but I'd rather blow a smaller fuse on the outside first.

If the ZW-L (or possibly all modified sine wave transformers) is incompatible, MTH will have to address this issue.

@H1000 posted:

The post-war ZW has a true pure sine wave output just like a brick. It won't hurt anything but the ZW has less than stellar circuit protection. It's always recommended that a fast blow fuse be placed between the ZW and WTIU. The internal fuses in the WTIU also do this job but I'd rather blow a smaller fuse on the outside first.

If the ZW-L (or possibly all modified sine wave transformers) is incompatible, MTH will have to address this issue.

OK yup that worked, tested the postwar zw and it operates correctly.

Stupid question but I'm guessing there is no way to clean up the wave from the ZW-L so it can be used?

I can't be the only one having this issue, I'm surprised when I searched I didn't see more posts about it.

Not many WTIU's in circulation but I'm sure this will come up as there are quite a few ZW-L transformers in use out there.

@MTH RD Please make note of Art's problem with the ZW-L. Will the WTIU work with transformers that output modified sine waves?

Art, if you set one output of the ZW-L to full voltage and then turn it on, will the light on the WTIU change to purple?

My theory is that the sine wave on the ZW-L is less choppy at full power and the modification to the wave at lower voltage is confusing the WTIU.

@H1000 posted:

Art, if you set one output of the ZW-L to full voltage and then turn it on, will the light on the WTIU change to purple?

My theory is that the sine wave on the ZW-L is less choppy at full power and the modification to the wave at lower voltage is confusing the WTIU.

I have the ZW-L set to full, I start everything up then once all booted I use my legacy remote to address the track on my zw-l and turn it up to full power.  No change in the light, I do hear a click in the WTIU but nothing changes.

So a few questions, should I go to full throttle before the WTIU finishes booting up, does that make a difference?

Also, should I turn off my power masters in my zw-l and just leave the handles up at full throttle?  Of course downside of that is I lose the ability to run conventional then.

Well that's what I'm wondering. As the power slowly rises to max voltage, the wave is modified and throws off the WTIU. If you disable the power masters and leave the voltage set to max then the ZW-L operates more like a brick transformer when you flip the switch on.

Sounds like you’re using the ZW-L in command mode.  Is it possible to switch it to conventional mode and take the command variable out of the setup, at least temporarily?

Do you have any other transformer including Post War? If so just see if the WTIU works with one of those to determine if its your ZWL or the TIU.

Pete

@Jimz posted:

Sounds like you’re using the ZW-L in command mode.  Is it possible to switch it to conventional mode and take the command variable out of the setup, at least temporarily?

OK took the ZW-L out of command, reconnected everything, powered everything off and started fresh power up sequence with the throttle at full.

WTIU powered up, clicked but no change in the lights, then I left it for a few minutes and every minute or so it would click and sometimes all the green lights would pulse blue like it was rebooting, then in a second or two turn all green again.

🤷 I'm at a loss here, I might just hook it up to my postwar zw for now but that means redoing a bunch of wiring too.

I haven't received my WTIU yet, but wanted to chime in.

I've run my REV L TIU off my ZW-L (in command mode), and have not encountered this issue.   I would power on the ZW-L , then bring the channel connected to the TIU up to full power, then turn on the TIU.

That worked for me.  Once my WTIU arrives, I will do some configuration testing and see if I can duplicate your issue.

Ok so an update :

Rewired WTIU with postwar ZW feeding fixed 1 &  2 for my two blocks of track, everything works great with a 9 or 10 dcs signal through out the run. I have the fast acting breaker coming tomorrow to add in just in the line from the ZW.

I have tried to continue to use one of my other tracks passively through variable 1 output (track power from my zw-l) but I get a very loud buzz from the WTIU, so I stopped. I'm not sure if that will go away if I paid for the premium app and changed that input to fixed?

Please let me know if anyone has any ideas on how to get the WTIU working with the ZW-L?  Feels really weird that it doesn't if TIUs have in the past.

I'm also going to contact MTH directly.

@ArtsModelTrains posted:

Please let me know if anyone has any ideas on how to get the WTIU working with the ZW-L?  Feels really weird that it doesn't if TIUs have in the past.

I'm also going to contact MTH directly.

So weird.

Having the same problem with a z-4000.

I have 2 main lines and a yard all separately isolated. My old TIU ran the yard and one of the mains with each half of the z4000

I bought a z1000 to power the other main.

my WTIU will illuminate green on power up and then turn purple on the “fixed” outputs on 1&2 when the track power is applied. Trains run fine.

problem is the variable outputs do nothing. Z1000 or the Z4000 absolutely nada from the output. WTIU makes a “click” but nothing happens.

The ZW-L can be problematic with the DCS TIU system.  When I used my ZW-L with my old TIU, it used to make a buzzing sound.  I did not like that, so I switched to a Lionel 180w brick, and buzzing stopped & everything worked fine.

Some people have no issue and others like me did with the ZW-L.  Never could find an explanation for it.   

My layout has a very straight forward Star pattern wiring, so nothing complicated.  I'm guessing it is the Sine Wave it does not like.   Not sure anything can be done about it.  Sounds like it affects the WTIU even more.  You could buy a Z750 or Z1000 brick and be done with it.  They made a point in their documentation that all units were tested from factory, so this will be interesting to see the outcome.

Let us know what you find out from MTH, this could be a big issue for some.

@The Bellcaptain posted:

Having the same problem with a z-4000.

I have 2 main lines and a yard all separately isolated. My old TIU ran the yard and one of the mains with each half of the z4000

I bought a z1000 to power the other main.

my WTIU will illuminate green on power up and then turn purple on the “fixed” outputs on 1&2 when the track power is applied. Trains run fine.

problem is the variable outputs do nothing. Z1000 or the Z4000 absolutely nada from the output. WTIU makes a “click” but nothing happens.

Did you pay for the premium app to unlock using the variable channels? I think that is required to use those channels.

I was thinking about this more last night, amazing how many hours over the last few days I've spent on this, could this be an issue with the powerstrip I'm using? All my devices are plugged into the same one that has surge protection on it.

Just a thought maybe I missed it on here but I watched the muffins video with Mike and it was stated in that video that the WTIU MUST be powered by the supplied power supply. Any chance the could be part of the problem?

@zhubl posted:

Just a thought maybe I missed it on here but I watched the muffins video with Mike and it was stated in that video that the WTIU MUST be powered by the supplied power supply. Any chance the could be part of the problem?

Yeah I saw that too, I have mine plugged in. I'm going to try removing the power strip and just plug both the WTIU and zwl directly into the wall.

I FIGURED IT OUT!!!!!

Last night I had the idea and I took both the WTIU and my ZWL and instead of using my surge protector, I ran both directly into an outlet and it works now!!

Been following this very close because i will be upgrading my TIU to the WTIU and i want to thank you for taking the time to keep us updated with your progress.

@ArtsModelTrains posted:

I FIGURED IT OUT!!!!!

Last night I had the idea and I took both the WTIU and my ZWL and instead of using my surge protector, I ran both directly into an outlet and it works now!!

Fantastic!

I always had mine on power strips (no surge protection) but wonder if it was the power strip causing the issue with the buzzing with my ZW-L.   Although when I switched it to a Lionel Brick it stopped buzzing, and it was on the power strip.

I have so many things to plug in on my layout, I would never have enough outlets on the wall, so a power strip has to come into play at some point. 

Great you got it working.

Art

I wonder if you have figured out any more about that particular power strip/Surge suppressor.and what did you replace it with ?

Not sure exactly what the issue was but I replaced it with a belkin model I ordered for $40. It seems to work but there are still some bugs to work out since it isn't as reliable as I want. I am working on wiring the WTIU in passive now, just have to run wire from the outputs to the distribution blocks for each section of my layout.